Has Iron Judgement finally killed Gwent?

+
As I've said, there's little to no hope for Gwent. The costs outweight the benefits and they'll be putting everything into Cyberpunk 2077. I expect Gwent to be gone by Easter 2020.

What needs to happen is remove dual card-play abilities from ALL leaders and Roche, then simultaneously get rid of Defenders and Coins. Cards like Sukrus or Lebioda are enough. Raise the STR of almost every card by at 1, 2 and 3 depending on prov cost. Then spend whatever budget's left balancing everything else and pay attention to Lore.

Won't happen, but it's a start.
 
One year ago eveyone was told to stop moaning about Gwent dying in favour of Gwent HC.
Yeah, I guess we are considered the moaners who raise all the HC bad stuff that CDPR keeps ignoring. Until the time we can say: "We told you so".
 
Yeah, I guess we are considered the moaners who raise all the HC bad stuff that CDPR keeps ignoring. Until the time we can say: "We told you so".

Yep, and sadly nobody is the winner. CDPR loses, we lose. I don't get why they didn't listen. Blind ignorance.

I mean how about this for the best possible example of the lack of care and attention - the Defender for ST adds two rowdy dwarves. How the hell does that help an Elven deck focused on traps, or whatever?! Narrow minded and stupid.
 
Last edited:
I mean how about this for the best possible example of the lack of care and attention - the Defender for ST adds two rowdy dwarves. How the hell does that help an Elven deck focused on traps, or whatever?! Narrow minded and stupid.

It's ironic that you call the design narrow minded and stupid, while your argument follows the same flaw. Not every card or mechanic is useful for every deck. When you play a trap deck you don't really need a defender. And when you play a deck that does need a defender, it doesn't matter that it's a dwarf, although that is a bonus for a dwarf deck.
 
I bash Gwent a lot for becoming full of filler cards and dumbed down abilities, but the ONE good thing left in gwent is that it's free to play and they only chose to heavily monetize cosmetics. I would never pay $1 per card. That's evil.

Than You can always play on lower ranks for free , with others who stubbornly dont want to pay these 1$, no one will force You to pay, and gwent Still remain a free game for You; And in reverse the same - if sameone wants better cards and higher ranks, and he will pay these small change for it from His own unforced will - whats the problem than? And Yes- sometimes You will play aginst sameone with better cards only because He paid for it and You will loose even if You are better skilled player; and these situation maybe will piss You off so much, that You even invest these 1 or 2$ in game that You didn't intended to invest - who knows? And than You will won with someone ealse encouraging him to improving cards - and that will be ok! Nothing wrong with that - that's what's selling and marketing is all about bro! Just like with these mentioned above Tinder - You can have basic limited amount of standard likes for free, or pay to stand out from the crowd paying for it, it is a free choice; sorry for the example from outside the gaming apps but I use tinder a lot more than games so I know it better; nevertheless I am sure that there are a lot of successfull online games that from one hand are free, but in the end of the day it turns out that You have to pay real money to have tools / equipment sufficent to compete on really hi levels - maybe one of objective observers of these discussion could support me with some examples from the gaming world please? In The right cause: if You want better gwent or - more pessimistically - even gwent at all :/
Post automatically merged:

@4RM3D - maybe a little ask to moderator to Put discussion about ways to improve gwents cashflow in a separate thread, because I think is important yet it can dissapear in Iron judgement thread
 
Last edited:
Ok Satan.

I bash Gwent a lot for becoming full of filler cards and dumbed down abilities, but the ONE good thing left in gwent is that it's free to play and they only chose to heavily monetize cosmetics. I would never pay $1 per card. That's evil.
I tend to agree. Gwent's FTP model is fair for new players. The only downside is there's not much to spend scraps on apart from cards. I get that CDPR wants to use meteorite powder as part of their monetisation strategy, but there comes a point where it becomes all too easy for players to put their scraps into a T1 deck. This unfortunately fuels the fire where players end up burned out by getting stomped by an overabundance of meta decks. Perhaps one thing they might consider is something similar to MTGA's Historic format. Kind of a non-ranked classic open beta version of Gwent where players could use scrap to buy 3 row boards and pre-HC cards.
 
@4RM3D - maybe a little ask to moderator to Put discussion about ways to improve gwents cashflow in a separate thread, because I think is important yet it can dissapear in Iron judgement thread

If you have a suggestion, you can make a new thread in the suggestions forum.

As for your suggestion in particular, I don't think it's a good idea. This will turn the game P2W and a lot of players are going to leave, as a result. So, whatever good you think will come from your idea, isn't going to pan out as you had hoped.
 
If you have a suggestion, you can make a new thread in the suggestions forum.

As for your suggestion in particular, I don't think it's a good idea. This will turn the game P2W and a lot of players are going to leave, as a result. So, whatever good you think will come from your idea, isn't going to pan out as you had hoped.

Any better ideas to increase a game profits than?
 
It's ironic that you call the design narrow minded and stupid, while your argument follows the same flaw. Not every card or mechanic is useful for every deck. When you play a trap deck you don't really need a defender. And when you play a deck that does need a defender, it doesn't matter that it's a dwarf, although that is a bonus for a dwarf deck.

Defender should be neutral to the faction, not designed to make an already OP meta stronger still.

Well, to be fair, Defender should be removed from the game. Any card that actively support the already broken mechanic of 2+ cards per turn should never have been created. As I said before, it's like the devs simply overlooked the fact that "Order" was put in place to stop cards being too powerful. It's one thing to reduce damage to improve the likelihood of Damien, Stefan, etc., staying on the board but adding the defender so they become immune is mental.
 
I think that defenders see less play today than some weeks ago. Or is it only my impression?

Like I said before, I don't think they are that great at least not in every deck. But I wouldn't like to see more defenders added to the game, one per faction is absolutely enough. If you could play two or more defenders in one round it would really get annoying.
 
I think that defenders see less play today than some weeks ago. Or is it only my impression?

Like I said before, I don't think they are that great at least not in every deck. But I wouldn't like to see more defenders added to the game, one per faction is absolutely enough. If you could play two or more defenders in one round it would really get annoying.

For me the one and only really OP defender od in scoiatell because his real strengh is not in his defender ability , but in creating two raw dwarves , that are immidiatelly changed into berserkers (another tottaly OP card in compare to provinsion cost) ; every other defender is very easy to counter and all Players who are playing above avarage level have counter for him
 
Any better ideas to increase a game profits than?

When someone disagrees with your suggestion, doesn't necessarily mean that (s)he has a better one. I know that coming up with suggestions can be hard and shooting them down is easy. However, some thought should still be put into it. For example, players rarely look from both sides when making such suggestions. What applies to them doesn't automatically apply to everyone. They also tend to focus on a single aspect without looking at the big picture.

It's important to offer players a choice. A good implementation of a financial model is how CDPR is doing it now by selling cosmetics (including premium cards). If you want to increase the profits, then you have to ask why you need to do that, in the first place. Sure, every business wants to thrive, but that what cost? If there is a need to increase profits, then that's more likely a result of Gwent not being popular enough, rather than the studio having a wrong business model. Thus the solution is probably not to improve the business model, but to improve the player experience, which results in more (paying) users.

For me the one and only really OP defender od in scoiatell

Every faction has a unique thing with their defender. Syndicate spawning two defenders is in some cases more "OP". Actually, all defenders are quite strong. Though, the one from NR has the least support for additional archetypes; that is, having a shield isn't as relevant.

Defender should be neutral to the faction, not designed to make an already OP meta stronger still.
*snip*

Well, now you are at least explaining your point of view. Defenders are a solution to squishy units, which doesn't defeat the purpose of having orders, but rather introduce more ways to let units with order thrive, which, in turn, creates new threats that might need to be dealt with. Trying to find balance is key and it's also one of the most difficult aspects. Now, you have lock and purify mechanics as alternative ways to deal with threats (instead of removing them). With defenders, there is more reason to use the existing purify mechanic.

For example, the old Clear Skies was a bad design because it only worked against weather. Purify is a better design because it works against a lot more. However, that doesn't mean it should become a counter to everything. That's why there are also locks. This is the balance the devs need to find, the number of threats and the available counters. As such, within the current game, defenders are fine. The problems lay elsewhere.
 
It's important to offer players a choice. A good implementation of a financial model is how CDPR is doing it now by selling cosmetics (including premium cards).

When one's looking to spend money, he is willing to spend it when get real additional value for it - and cosmetics are not geaving real additional value , at last not a value to be worth to spend real money for it - strong cards does, easier winning does, good feeling after won game does. I also prefer gwent to be tottaly free game, with free purchase, free cards, free membership , and on top of that with great balance monthly patches and 100 new cards every quoter - but it have to earn money also, to obtain that goal. And it will earn it only, if You, me, and other players will pay for it somehow. But We will pay only, if we will see an additional value in these investment. Don't get me wrong, I am not attacking You with question about other solitions, i want only a serious discussion to start and maybe one of ideas will be these, what devs are looking for - and I hope for that, because as I mentioned ealier current public gwent financial results are not letting to calmly look into it's future... :/
Post automatically merged:

Syndicate spawning two defenders is in some cases more "OP".

I don't agree - Syndycate defender is easy to remove with many cards, like manticore venom or surrender or Filippa Blind fury ( we need to kill only two flies) . SC defender in compare cannot be removed with anything in one turn with both raw dwarves that he created, and or I will desteoy Him and berserkers will be created next turn, or i will remove raw dwarves but defender will remain a problem. Even Filippa is risky because there are hi chances that she wont kill them all in one turn with her ability. Not to mention that using filippa aginst SC defender in perspective of four mercs in next turn - suicide
 
Last edited:
Any better ideas to increase a game profits than?
Even running around the city and fishing coins out of fountains is better idea than pay to win nonsense.

Suggestion: Casual mini tournaments
8 people, 1$ participation fee, price pool (8 bucks) is devided between top 4 and CDPR.
Downside is that it's gambling.
 
*snip*
Well, now you are at least explaining your point of view. Defenders are a solution to squishy units, which doesn't defeat the purpose of having orders, but rather introduce more ways to let units with order thrive, which, in turn, creates new threats that might need to be dealt with. Trying to find balance is key and it's also one of the most difficult aspects. Now, you have lock and purify mechanics as alternative ways to deal with threats (instead of removing them). With defenders, there is more reason to use the existing purify mechanic.

For example, the old Clear Skies was a bad design because it only worked against weather. Purify is a better design because it works against a lot more. However, that doesn't mean it should become a counter to everything. That's why there are also locks. This is the balance the devs need to find, the number of threats and the available counters. As such, within the current game, defenders are fine. The problems lay elsewhere.

Let's take ST and your first sentence. There's not much "squishy" about 2 x dwarfs with 5 armour each and 1 ping per round, easily strengthened by cheap armour boost cards. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but lock doesn't do anything to a defender? So all that's happened is the devs have made purify cards necessary, which is then just a counter to be played at a specific time against a specific card if you get the deal in the specific order. Too much RNG again. There is definitely something fundamentally wrong with cards dedicated to countering other cards. Usurper is the most extreme example, but simply shouldn't exist - leader abilities are a key part of Gwent, almost fundamentally important, and the inclusion of one leader that hard-counters your own leader ability is madness.

Clear skies is another good example of this "designed to counter" problem in Gwent. Instead of having cards that each have interesting summon, spawn or copy abilities - which are much more interesting - we have a massive amount of "this card will deliberately crap on that deck", which is also just plain wrong. Remember when unitless was a thing, and everybody just played White Frost FTW!

There's also no place or need for anyone to be able to play two proper cards in one turn - Roche, any leader that plays or replays a card. Vilgefortz is a better example of a good card design. It can be disruptive, or it can be a disaster, but that's the risk. Yenn Invocation is a terrible design, because it specifically hurts most Monster decks and Skellige - Second Wind. There really should be an effort to look through all cards and think "if it's more powerful, almost OP, against a particular deck, it should be changed". Some of these cards effectively mean auto-win. There's multiple examples listed above. You could also argue far more cards, particularly Gold, need dual purpose around things like unlock and purify (seriously, three unlock cards in the entire deck?). How about anti-seize? Barricade, for example, should mean a unit cannot be seized. How the hell are you "barricaded", yet seizable?! Makes NO sense!!

I don't think it would take a development team much effort to go through this step by step:

1) Replace all leader "card draw" abilities with more interesting design.
2) Remove all "draw another card" cards from the deck.
3) Add more dual purpose to currently bad cards (Lambert, Morvudd, Phoenix, Ruehin)
4) Add more options for unlocking and purifying in ALL decks
5) Rework anything that clearly has a massive negative impact on a particular deck (Invocation, Usurper)

I don't think it's a lot of work.
 
I have been playing since closed beta, went through open beta, midwinter, those long months without patch, homecoming, CC, iron judgement. Some changes I liked, others less. Some took a while to adapt (like homecoming) but in the end I still enjoy the game.
Yes, it has changed a lot since beta, even more since the witcher 3 but let's be honest, the game could not have survived in that state. The mechanics were just too restrictive. Not saying every decision was the right one, for example I very much dislike this homogenization of abilities to very generic ones or the narrowing of provision bonus combined with the increase increase in low prov cards. But overall I still enjoy the game.
I never play net/meta decks (just because I part of my fun is the deckbuilding itself) and sometimes I curse at those same overpowered decks that people play brainless and win despite playing nonsense. In every online game, you'll never have perfect balance but one solution that I'd like now is for CDPR to work on balancing what we have and NOT add more cards too soon.
Iron judgement is overall a very good extension and introduces a lot of nice cards, great arts, interesting mechanics that will become good once tweaked (defenders for example are too strong. Their effect is fine but they should not take tons of damage or purify to work around. Reducing them to 4 or 5 strength, armor included, would already be a step forward).

What I wanted to come to with all that is that the ONE thing that would make me stop playing instantly is to have cards that would be available only with real money. I want a free to play, not a pay to win, and the reason I chose gwent over others is the pretty rewarding system, allowing me to play here and there and still be able to get cards and rewards. Why in the universe would you reward people with money to invest in the game rather than skill or dedication?
Cosmetics have been proven in other games, even MMO, to yield profit.
Lately I did pay for the elder skin and the novigrad board. Because I wanted to. Because I wanted to give back some money. I don't think it's worth 5$ but I've been playing this game for free for years so I figured I'd give a bit. But if a card comes (a real card, with a specific effect, not a different art of a card or some other cosmetic) that costs even 10 cents, I'm out XD
 
So the one who spents more money wins the game. This would push away a lot of players I guess (it would push me away for sure) and the company would earn even less.

There will be a lot of players who dont want to spend anything and it will be passible to play with them on lower levels
 
Top Bottom