Has Iron Judgement finally killed Gwent?

[nedders]

The relentless matchups against META net decks, the endless broken combination, the constant feeling of "why am I matched against this?" and "how the hell has my opponent drawn the perfect hand R3, yet again?".

I can feel myself getting the same level of rage I felt back when HC76 was originally released, to gasps of "what the hell have they done?" and "where did Gwent go?". I've rage quite three games on the bounce - twice against the absurdly overpowered Monster bleed deck, and I've just played an absolute monster deck for NR where my opponent had the defender and every, single Gold you could possibly imagine (Dandelion/Priscilla/Anna/Shani/etc.). It was just a relentless boost fest with absolutely no counter. We're talking about a game that's supposed to be balanced, yet the opponent was basically slamming 10+ points on the board with every turn.

How does everyone seem to have these perfect decks? How does everyone seem to get the perfect deal? My Skellige deal had Dagur still in the deck whilst my opponent - with no thinning - pulls gold after gold after gold.

It's getting to the point where I'm not just bored with it, I'm sick of it. There's no room for error, there's no allowance for trying new things, you either copy what everyone else is doing and subscribe to Team Aretuza or just don't bother. God only knows how bad a new player must find the whole experience, but it's such a narrow game there's no ability to grow with it. Add in the fact some of us spent scraps getting leaders, only to then see it all disappear in favour of 'skins' (which I really couldn't give a stuff about) and again you feel cheated. Feeling cheated is a very common theme in this game:

- Let's try an Arachas deck. Vs. Usurper? Cheated.
- R3 where's my finisher? Still in the deck. Opponent playing perfect hand? Cheated.
- Mill my leader cards, and give me skins instead of scraps? Cheated.
- Spent money on Gwent Beta, only to see this game replace it? Cheated.
- Playing a defender R3 - opponent happens to have a purify card? Cheated.

I'm not saying it's actual cheating, I'm saying it's the feeling of being stitched up, with nothing you can do about it. Bad matchup? Nothing I can do. Crap deal? Nothing I can do. Seems to me that no matter which way CDPR turn with this game, it's always down a blind alley. No more hard removal? Well you better have enough scraps to craft the mega boost meta else you're just going to lose, time and time again. It's not even as if you can spend money to get anywhere. I've opened 30+ Iron Judgement kegs and have found ONE Gold card. One. Out of 150. I had to craft the couple I wanted to use, and they're not even that good - that's an expensive waste of scraps when you're trying to experiment.

I dunno, my love for the game is hanging by a thread. It feels pointless - I don't see why people clearly copy a deck, what's the point? I played IDENTICAL Monster decks twice in a row. Identical (bleeding/big units). That means something is desperately, badly wrong with the game. And, honestly, I'm probably about half a dozen games away from uninstalling it. Anybody else finding that their love for Gwent is being sorely tested?

 

[Bruele]

Yes. Broken cards, broken tutors, broken power level. I don t like this meta but a lot of people like this... Opinions.

 

[Guest 4368268]

Though I've been in your place of frustration plenty of times before, I do feel like you're being very biased towards whatever is convenient for you. For example you say "Playing defender opponent 'happens' to have a purify card? cheated."
That implies he got lucky when he deliberately chose to have that card in his deck (which makes perfect sense atm) if you lost the game because your opponent had a defender and you didn't have your purify you'd probably be upset about that.

I do agree with you that matchups are a bit too favourable/unfavourable to a point where it trumps skill/experience at times. I definitely share your concern as far as newer players goes. For example, I've faced Scoiatael decks where I could guess my opponents entire hand and played accordingly and would still lose. But equally I played an enslave Nilfgaard deck where I'd win not necessarily because I'm good but there was just nothing in my opponents hand that could deal with defender + Damien etc.

When both winning and losing feels a bit unfair/boring that really is a problem. Having said all of this though, if I look back at where Homecoming was at its inception about a year ago, it is significantly better now. Still not nearly as good as it could or should be (which is saying something about how terrible it was at release) but they've made a lot of good decisions design wise since then. They've just been extremely lackluster in terms of balancing.

The tier 1 decks of old (alchemy, greatswords, NG handbuff) had their weakspots which you could exploit if you knew what to play and when to play it. Often times now if a deck is great you can make all the right moves and still lose and that does feel very deflating.

 

[SkiZophreniC]

I thought you had left the game ten times since I joined this forum. I almost missed reading your endless complaint about how the game is "cheated".

 

[StrykerxS77x]

I am endlessly entertained by your constant attack on net decks and getting a bad deal. It's like wondering if the sun will rise tomorrow. Never change dude.

To answer your question at the end there my feelings on the game haven't changed in awhile. I basically always have the urge to play even if I'm not a big fan of the meta. Right now the game is interesting and annoying at the same time. Defenders and the new cards have altered the game drastically which has spawned a lot of new decks. While it has been interesting and fun making new decks and using strong combo's it's also revealing the same age old problems with Gwent. Balancing is not being given the attention it deserves. CDPR seems happy breaking the game and then picking up the pieces later. I would really like to see an effort to balance the whole game so that unusable cards/leaders/archetypes get fixed and obviously broken mechanics don't get throne into the game so carelessly. Defenders is the latest example of something that is going to be OBVIOUSLY broken. You can't have a card that essentially gives immunity to everything on a row, make it tanky and expect that to be ok. They either don't care about putting broken stuff in the game or they are too busy to pay attention and fix this stuff before releasing it. Same thing happened with Syndicate. It's like they are doing it on purpose so that people will spend money on the new stuff.

 

[thetruerenter]

He has a good point again. If you're not following the meta/netdeck trend then you will end up with a score of 25 wins on 128 games played. Imagine the score of new, unexperienced, players. I will never play the meta, it is for sheep in my eyes. Too much ambition for a little prestige. However, to find new combos and so inspires me to continue playing. Probably it is a matter of time and more expansions before decks as SK Alchemy have the same powerfull synergy as the netdecks/meta contain.

 

[Jesting-Jack]

For now, I think I'll just... reserve judgement.

 

[nedders]

Though I've been in your place of frustration plenty of times before, I do feel like you're being very biased towards whatever is convenient for you. For example you say "Playing defender opponent 'happens' to have a purify card? cheated."
That implies he got lucky when he deliberately chose to have that card in his deck (which makes perfect sense atm) if you lost the game because your opponent had a defender and you didn't have your purify you'd probably be upset about that.

As I say, I'm focusing on how it feels as a game to me. I cannot speak for anyone else, hence why I write it from my point of view. And I'm not saying anybody is cheating because they have a purify in hand - it clearly makes sense to carry such a card. I'm saying it's how the game makes you feel about it. For instance, I'll play against someone with purify and lose as a result. I'll add a purify unit to my deck. Then when the next matchup comes the purify play is pointless and I should have had something else. You change, then purify would have worked. It's simplistic, but it's the lack of control that I believe has a huge impact on Gwent being very successful.

I am endlessly entertained by your constant attack on net decks and getting a bad deal. It's like wondering if the sun will rise tomorrow. Never change dude.

If I could be bothered, I'd make my own Dandelion Show. I swear I could create a 30 min episode every week.

I thought you had left the game ten times since I joined this forum. I almost missed reading your endless complaint about how the game is "cheated".

Actually left 14 times now, and counting. Thanks for paying attention, though, nice to know I got fanz.

 

[Jesting-Jack]

Actually left 14 times now, and counting.

Sounds to me you're in a toxic relationship. You might want to move on and find someone who values you for who you are.

 

[nedders]

Sounds to me you're in a toxic relationship. You might want to move on and find someone who values you for who you are.

But she looks so good...

 

[MaxisZ]

Not sure Gwent killed. But the Gwent is definitely heading towards casual game swings.
You have been building a strategy for 3 rounds, got an advantage, overtaking the opponent by 50 points.
NO PROBLEM - get 70 points wild card from your opponent ! OMG what the shit ? Welcome to CCG targeted at casual audiences !

 

[zecenker]

Hah. You would think so, hum?
I've seen waaaaaaaay worse.

Gwent is like an abused resurrect- recall from graveyard card.

Can't die easy.

 

[Archan6el]

Sounds to me you're in a toxic relationship. You might want to move on and find someone who values you for who you are.

Indeed. A purify is needed here.

But she looks so good...

If only you could decouple looks and abilities...

 

[Celadyl]

I like the meta of this season alot more than let's say draconid season's. but something that is very annoying is that there are tons of literally worthless cards that need fixing, yet cdpr instead throws new cards at us every other month. old cards get completely reworked and new deck types become popular, which makes it a little difficult for non beta players to have all the cards for an archetype. to this day I have not played a single game as syndicate just because it doesnt make any sense for me to invest into a new faction when I still miss so many cards for the others lol. gold drop rate is abysmal.

I hope CDPR will use the next months to clean up behind them and bring make every card useful in a way, not only 1 or 2 archetypes per faction per season.

 

[RyseAurellius]

- Let's try an Arachas deck. Vs. Usurper? Cheated.
- R3 where's my finisher? Still in the deck. Opponent playing perfect hand? Cheated.
- Mill my leader cards, and give me skins instead of scraps? Cheated.
- Spent money on Gwent Beta, only to see this game replace it? Cheated.
- Playing a defender R3 - opponent happens to have a purify card? Cheated.

"R3 where's my finisher? Still in the deck. Opponent playing perfect hand?" ...not cheated, sometimes luck of the draw goes against you, but you still have 2 rounds to set up for a strong R3.. I'm sure you would be okay if it was the other way around.

"Spent money on Gwent Beta, only to see this game replace it?" ...not cheated, no one is forcing you to spend money on a free to play game, knowing very well that the direction of the game can change.

"Playing a defender R3 - opponent happens to have a purify card?" ...not cheated, Defenders are big right now, purify is also big as a result. Leaving defenders until round 3 is probably a bit of a silly and predictable thing to do, hence your opponent holding onto at least one purify for round 3.

I agree with others, seems you want everything to go perfectly in your favour and if it doesn't the game of Gwent must be against you. I'll admit, Gwent is not perfect and the are a lot of improvements that need to be made. But I think you are being a bit hysterical about the things that are wrong with it.

 

[Evangium]

Playing mostly seasonal mode this month, I've noticed the only engine deck that works too well is assimilate. Every other faction, I can play their key pieces and effectively dismantle their strategy without the need to rely on dumb-auotboost/autodamage cards. My deck - https://www.playgwent.com/en/decks/guides/37228 - tends to do well without heavily relying on the two engine cards against every other faction. Against assimilate though, it seems they can easily achieve their win con with half their deck available to them. I put this down to a few factors.

First is the sheer amount of dumb-boost cards. Take out one, and they have two or more units that do the same thing. This effectively reduces varience other factions have, since you might as well consider all assimilate engine cards to be differently named copies of each other. Essentially an assimilate deck os running far more than 2 copies of a card that boosts whenever a non-starter deck card is played. Even NR, with its ping engines tends to be throttled by the need to replenish charges or armour. This limits the number of engines that can run at any time since they need to devote provisions to enabler units. NR can run more engines for redundancy, with the expense being less enablers.

Second is the high synergy with create and seize cards. As many cards that create for NG are also tactics, this increases the range of leader abilities available to the archetype. All other factions archetypes tend to work best with one leader ability. Assimilate works well with at least 3 leader abilities. This is not good for the game, as it pushes players to play only the strongest leaders from other factions, other assimilate decks within NG, or Lockdown. This creates a superficially diverse meta where closer examination reveals it to be limited to the same type of decks.

Finally is that assimilate is built into their key golds and purifying units. Artorius Vigo, for instance, is self-enabling in addition to providing extra engines or enablers. Imperial Diviner not only makes playing a lock card body points at best, but also places another engine on the board. Glyns disrupts symetrical tall removal with her 2 point dumb-boost. While it is arguable that, for a gold, having a better version of a bronze engine ability is appropriate, her 3 points of armor gaurantee she will stick to the board long enough to negate the effectiveness of a minor board wipe courtesty of Scorch or Igni. This limits the range of tech cards that can deal with multiple tall units on the board. Add defenders to the mix, and targetted removal becomes impossible.

In short, the archetype needs an overhaul. the number of engines should be pared back. Gold and support bronzes need to support the engines without being engine themseves.

 

[Guest 4336264]

On the point about spending 'materials' to get leaders, I think that's a valid point. I, too, have spent loads of 'mats' on leaders and now they've just f'd off! And, to add insult to injury, no materials given as compensation - blooming outrageous in my books! The worst is that this change to skins instead of leader cards is PATHETIC!

As for the rest, I think I'm starting to agree... I can only be glad I haven't paid any cash for the game (besides Thronebreaker), otherwise I'd be really p'd off!

 

[RaynStargaze]

I like the current patch overall. Lots of different decks to be played. Cool new cards and some archetypes.

Aside from ME/waters/NJ and my personal disgust for everything related to nilfgard, im really enjoying the game right now.

 

[Pietriej]

Generally, I think it's the first expansion since the Homecoming that really improved Gwent as a card game. It brought improvements to consistency of the game. Armor and Defender mechanics were long-needed to switch the game from "Damage by 2, Boost by 2" scheme. Also, some archetypes are so well designed - i.e. Dwarves. They are consistent, versatile, they don't rely on RNG too much, your strategy is not based on your opponent's strategy and you can even change your approach during the game based on the current situation.

However, I do have four concerns only related to this patch -

• There is a tendency in Gwent to improve certain archetypes/factions and leaving others behind (i.e. redesigning NR, building strong Dwarf archetype, but leaving behind Elves and Spies). There are so many archetypes in Gwent still neglected even a year after the release of Homecoming.
• The Defender mechanic should only apply to a whole row. It's simply too powerful and as an effect, all competetive decks are playing defenders. They have become the new "Silver Spies".
• A great amount of bugs (still not solved) makes me question how the testing was done.
• What is the future for monetizing the game? I'll be honest - I like the game and I'm willing to pour some money into CDPRs pockets to keep it alive, but I don't like the offer. The Iron Judgement prerelease offer wasn't great and even if people bought it, they're still waiting for animated cards. Also, the currently available leader skins, card backs and boards do not convience me to buy them.

 

[Guest 4336264]

• The Defender mechanic should only apply to a whole row. It's simply too powerful and as an effect, all competetive decks are playing defenders. They have become the new "Silver Spies".

As far as I'm aware the defender does defend the entire row - it doesn't affect the other row.

I've seen some argue that the defender should defend only defend those units directly to each side of the defender.

Personally, I think it's fine as it is - defending all units on a single row. The defender is relatively easy to defeat if you have the right unit(s) - purify it and that's pretty much problem solved (there are other solutions too). So, claiming the defender is too powerful is ridiculous, as far as I'm concerned. It doesn't need to be touched at all.