Homecoming Reveal

[Makhil]

Great job overall.
2 points though:
- as mentioned by others, a gold card is something special. It needs a WOW factor. The small yellow triangle in the top left corner is just not enough.
- the leaders are blent with the background. The 3D effect is not enough to make them stand out. imho they don't belong there. They should be at the same information level as the cards in hand.

 

[FG15-ISH7EG]

To be Honest: I am sick of this argument. We may no criticise the anounced changes, before we see anything, after seeing some off the stuff, we may not, because it is not all. I bet, after seeing all of it, we may not, because we didnt tested it. After we tested it, no changes are going to come, because you cant change it anymore. This wont be a problem because all skeptical players will be moved out.
I dont have to see all little details of the changes to assume they are wrong/ a misconception. You know, we can imagine something, expect, extrapolate and guessing. We have point, you dont have, because all you say is: I could be good. Thats not a valid point, because it could also be a pink elephant. It could be anything, but we can se the infomations we have and these are worrysome (for many players, not all, maybe not even the majority, but many)

You are free to critizise as much as you want, but what some people are doing is jumping to conclusions and assuming some things with absolute certainty, we have no clue of at all yet. That just isn't any meaningful critic, but ranting instead. If someone is basing their opinion on assumption, it makes sense to mention those.

The real question concerning meaningful criic is what have seen so far:
We have seen the art style for the menues, the cards and the board for monsters. All of that is likely pretty final except some polish (f.e. better leader models) and it makes sense to critize it.
Concerning the row system we have seen two new systems, but can't say that those are all, maybe there is another one, that we are missing yet. Also we don't know yet, how many cards have those effects, which means how important is this row system going to be in reality. From what I've seen I don't really think that scrapping the siege row was necessary, but I'm still missing information to come to a final conclusion.

And you are completly right, that there are things for which, I'd say, you have to play it ingame first. For example the feeling or if something takes too much time. And I'd even go further, I would say that you shouldn't make your final opinion about balance until the first balance patch hits.

 

[Mashajab]

You are free to critizise as much as you want, but what some people are doing is jumping to conclusions and assuming some things with absolute certainty, we have no clue of at all yet. That just isn't any meaningful critic, but ranting instead. If someone is basing their opinion on assumption, it makes sense to mention those.

The real question concerning meaningful criic is what have seen so far:
We have seen the art style for the menues, the cards and the board for monsters. All of that is likely pretty final except some polish (f.e. better leader models) and it makes sense to critize it.
Concerning the row system we have seen two new systems, but can't say that those are all, maybe there is another one, that we are missing yet. Also we don't know yet, how many cards have those effects, which means how important is this row system going to be in reality. From what I've seen I don't really think that scrapping the siege row was necessary, but I'm still missing information to come to a final conclusion.

And you are completly right, that there are things for which, I'd say, you have to play it ingame first. For example the feeling or if something takes too much time. And I'd even go further, I would say that you shouldn't make your final opinion about balance until the first balance patch hits.

As he said - it's critique of things we see.. I also condemn those who trash talk.. But emotions are so big now. Ppl just saw game they love to be destroyed. Thats what make them crazy.. I myself am so much enraged I deleted gwent icon from my windows bar..

 

[Fimbulthrym]

You are free to critizise as much as you want, but what some people are doing is jumping to conclusions and assuming some things with absolute certainty, we have no clue of at all yet

The marked one are just wrong. We have clue, we saw some effects, we know the wanted oputcome by burza as well. We can make assumptions. It is true, that we have a lack of informations but we dont have nothing. On the other side, the positiv-speaker make the same (positive) assumptions of things they dont know . Why is it ok to assume there is some positive effect we dont see yet but it isnt ok to assume, that the already known effects are negative?The reveal show us much more than the asthetics of the game. We saw strenght, effects, mulligan, apartof how leaders are going to work. For example we know there is a ability called "reach 2" wich could mean, standard reach is 1. So a ranged unit cannot target another ranged unit. This feature alone make the 2 row system unnecessary, because you could use this with 3 rows to an better extent

 

[osgrim]

I'm still sceptical. It wasn't much gameplay, but t seems to be a slow and non-dynamic version of the gwent I love.
So you can push that Olaf to 70 points? Wait for my Margarita i can tutor out, because I thinned correctly knowing your gameplan. Wonder if such huge, and beloved pointswings are still possible? Ok, it's to early to say, but the short revealed gameplay seems little bit lame to me.

 

[FG15-ISH7EG]

@Fimbulthrym
But we aren't talking about critic concerning things we've seen, instead about unreflected ranting and hate.
This is the post you were refering to at first:

I understand that people compare this new version to the original one but the hate of some people is inappropriate. You've just seen a small snippet of what it will be or look like but still go crazy about the changes and say "This is not my Gwent." or "Give my money back."

And yes there are also people being optimistic and basing their positive feedback on assumptions, but in general that doesn't hurt anyone, while ranting does. Also, if one dislikes something his goal should be to improve what he dislikes by stating what exactly he dislikes, just being negative without a real reasoning is just ranting. For positive comments without critic, it usually means that those like everything they have seen.

The reveal show us much more than the asthetics of the game. We saw strenght, effects, mulligan, apartof how leaders are going to work. For example we know there is a ability called "reach 2" wich could mean, standard reach is 1. So a ranged unit cannot target another ranged unit. This feature alone make the 2 row system unnecessary, because you could use this with 3 rows to an better extent

Yes, we saw a lot of things, but even more things were left out. We haven't seen the army cost system of the cards(or how it works) which is a secondary value for them, so the strength alone doesn't tell us that much, except that the general strength is decreased.
I agree that we got quite a lot information about mulligan, but we are still missing some. How does each leader affect those numbers, how many cards are drawn in round 2(answered in Ask a Dev) and 3, how many are mulliganed there.
I think we should just be prepared that those things we might be assuming could possible be wrong. That is what I'm hoping everyone giving positive or negative feedback does.

From the given information, I agree with you that the Reach system would have worked with 3 rows as well, and I even suggested that back in March as a full concept. But we don't know yet, how many units are using that other system with the row locked abilities, which could be a lot more difficult with 3 rows, and I think that is the factor that will decide my final opinion about the removal of the siege row.

 

[sfruzz]

You are free to critizise as much as you want, but what some people are doing is jumping to conclusions and assuming some things with absolute certainty, we have no clue of at all yet. That just isn't any meaningful critic, but ranting instead. If someone is basing their opinion on assumption, it makes sense to mention those.

We got quite some information on how the gameplay will look like. For example, randomness will be stronger than ever by judging from the revealed cards.

Drowner - Move an enemy to the opposite row and deal 2 damage to it. If that row is under a Hazard, deal 4 damage instead.
Homecoming Drowner - Deathwish: Damage a random enemy by 4.

Rotfiend - Deathwish: Deal 2 damage to units on the opposite row.
Homecoming Rotfiend - Whenever another unit dies, deal 1 damage to random enemy unit.

The outcome of matches will be decided whether you'll hit or miss with a Drowner a unit that can give you full 4 points values. This trend of having RNG-cards added to the game is nothing new. In moving from Closed to Open Beta we saw an increase in those cards (i.e. Pyrotechnician, Archespore,...), along the simplification of beloved cards (Shieldmaidens, Tuirseach Hunter, Morenn, Trollololo,...). This trend is likely to continue based on the information that we were given now.

As for the look of the new board I wish they would remove the 3D-leaders. As architect van der Rohe stated: "Less is more". I prefer the cleaner witcher 2 board as opposed to the current ones, same as I prefer the less crowded current ones as opposed to the Homecoming *fancy* stuff.

The changes that I liked were:
- different mulligan cards based on leaders,
- showing the base strength of a card after it has been buffed or damaged,
- new cards borders (even if the difference between bronze / gold is unclear)
- new cardbacks (with the exeption of NG)

 

[FG15-ISH7EG]

The outcome of matches will be decided whether you'll hit or miss with a Drowner a unit that can give you full 4 points values. This trend of having RNG-cards added to the game is nothing new. In moving from Closed to Open Beta we saw an increase in those cards (i.e. Pyrotechnician, Archespore,...), along the simplification of beloved cards (Shieldmaidens, Tuirseach Hunter, Morenn, Trollololo,...). This trend is likely to continue based on the information that we were given now.

I wouldn't call the Drowner being added RNG, but instead just the old Deathwish of the Archespore being moved there.
Also, I would call the effect of the Drowner a good RNG, because it forces the player to consume the Drowner exactly at the correct moment to minimize the risk. Moreover, the player can try to destroy the lowest enemy cards to improve the Drowner. If he hasn't any cards in the deck that are able to do so, he probably shouldn't include the Drowner. So all in all the Drowner becomes a card, that adds quite a lot of depth to the game, even though being RNG.

Let's look at the example of letting the Deathwish of the Drowner always target the lowest enemy unit, which would be the worst case scenario and apparently a lot less RNG. But in fact that is wrong, because the lowest enemy unit is still nothing the player himself decides on, but part of the enemies deck and thus has to be looked at as if it were RNG. Therefore, the damage of the ability would be clearer in each game situation, but the variance of the damage would increase, and therefore the RNG.
As weird as it sounds, by giving the unit some RNG, it becomes less RNG overall.

 

[4RM3D]

Are moderator are paid to only say nice thing about this game/company? Any restrictions, about what you can say? I am just asking because any reply of a mod seems extremly positive without negative aspects. How was Gwent not working out? Mostly positive feedback ad closed and early open beta to regular complains now. The only thing i can agree is, that they scrap this game.

Moderators have their own opinion and are not required to say anything on behalf of CDPR. I've remained pretty neutral in this thread, not giving my opinion. I just try to explain certain aspects of Homecoming. I did say that CDPR should be applauded for making a tough decision. However, I didn't say anything about the result, which can be argued whether it's good or bad. The fan base is pretty divided on this.

One final thing about having an own opinion, I do occasionally openly disagree with CDPR, e.g.:
Change the Premium Card Refund
Tempo Plays are Getting out of Hand

 

[sfruzz]

I wouldn't call the Drowner being added RNG, but instead just the old Deathwish of the Archespore being moved there.
Also, I would call the effect of the Drowner a good RNG, because it forces the player to consume the Drowner exactly at the correct moment to minimize the risk. Moreover, the player can try to destroy the lowest enemy cards to improve the Drowner. If he hasn't any cards in the deck that are able to do so, he probably shouldn't include the Drowner. So all in all the Drowner becomes a card, that adds quite a lot of depth to the game, even though being RNG.

Sadly also the Archespore has close-to-the-same ability. So now we have the Drowner, plus the Archespore.

Homecoming Archespore - Deploy: Damage a random enemy by 2. Deathwish: repeat this unit's Deploy ability.

Given the size of the decks / the limit to the card copies (x2) / the limit to the card in hand / the remove of tutors, I doubt that the strategy you propose is going to be viable. When dealing with RNG, instead of going for the proper play, you just try to minimize the chance of missing your target. For me, there is quite a difference.

 

[DMaster2]

I have an idea. As a big thanks to all the employees, why not offer the Gwent Game as it was at the end of 2017 for sale as a stand-alone game. Charge $20 a copy, the funds used for future maintenance for the program's most serious errors. No new cards, factions, lessor rows etc. Gwent as it was. Call it 'Geralt's Gwent'. Then after one year when financials are released for this game alone, all net profits are divided up equally and a check is cut to all employees that worked on the deck, as a hearty Thank You. Then let Gweralt's Gwent rise or fall on its own sales and merit, while Homecoming can just become what it will and also rise or fall through it's own merits, gaily changing a few times a year.

As for me, I'll gladly buy Geralt's Gwent. And if you offer hard copy cards and board so regulars can play the game in a bar, in the field, or in the backyard on a picnic table, without a computer... I'll buy a set of that too.

Post automatically merged: Sep 3, 2018

To do what, play against the amazing AI of the game? Because you don't seriously expect players to play there, in a dead game right? Especially since a lot can't wait to play the new gwent.

Post automatically merged: Sep 3, 2018

I gotta say that whoever is in charge of making decisions on this game has no clue what they are doing.
They took a nonissue, board design, and turned it into something which as far as I can tell is alienating at least 30% of the remaining playerbase, maybe more. Do you even focus group, bruh?
Nobody had any complaints about the board design. Sure, some people said they'd like it if the mood of the game felt darker to keep in tone with the witcher setting but nobody had any real issue with how the game looked.
I'm laughing so hard just thinking about the hundreds of hours of work that went into designing this 'board' and how it ended up looking like the background from some 2005 chinese Diablo ripoff, all the way down to the 2D leader models pretending to be 3D.
People had issues with the gameplay, the coin toss, the RNG and the create mechanic. None of these issues have been addressed.
It took you 6 months to show people your art project. No mention of gameplay at all. Not even about the cointoss. The most heated issue of the game. You're not even gonna talk about that in what was supposed to be your hype video? Instead of hyping people up you have turned so many away. Seriously, who is making the decision over there?
If you put 40k on the table I'll take three months out of my life and fix this mess for you. Otherwise, good luck. I think there's another card game entering closed beta at around the same time.

What are you talking about? No one complained? I didn't saw anyone happy about it (probably only you and your upvote gang) and on the contrary it was the obvious game's shortcoming.
How many times i've saw written "cards animations are amazing but the board looks dull".

That is true as well outside gwent's community, on the contrary it gets worse. I've seen quite a lot saying they didn't even tried gwent because of how boring it looks from YT videos.

Lastly, don't think they don't do reasearchs on this matter. It's pretty evident, except for you guys i suppose, how this UI+board was a major issue and a setback for the game's popularity.

 

[highhand]

To do what, play against the amazing AI of the game? Because you don't seriously expect players to play there, in a dead game right? Especially since a lot can't wait to play the new gwent.

Post automatically merged: Sep 3, 2018

What are you talking about? No one complained? I didn't saw anyone happy about it (probably only you and your upvote gang) and on the contrary it was the obvious game's shortcoming.
How many times i've saw written "cards animations are amazing but the board looks dull".

That is true as well outside gwent's community, on the contrary it gets worse. I've seen quite a lot saying they didn't even tried gwent because of how boring it looks from YT videos.

Lastly, don't think they don't do reasearchs on this matter. It's pretty evident, except for you guys i suppose, how this UI+board was a major issue and a setback for the game's popularity.

 

[Fimbulthrym]

How many times i've saw written "cards animations are amazing but the board looks dull".

Sorry to say that, but show me some examples pls. The board was not very often a subject of argumenting because nearly nobody was bothered by it.

 

[highhand]

If the cards are set, the board plain, and the deal is fair, what do you need AI for exactly? I do not even care about ranked if that is the issue. Clean up the deal, keep track of the rounds, the scoring, and announce the winner. Think about it. No Hearthstone here, no monthly updates of group think to a Mission getting far afield. Let that continue for you and others that want the fluff. Homecoming.. OK, come on. For me and many others, to sit down and play a competitor for... the fun of it, to pass the time, with a beer or favorite drink on the table. And if agreed, to hook-up by phone through messaging. Look at the roots to this. The game played in the bars in Witcher attends to player choice of cards, then strategic and tactical strategy, applying oneself alertly to the play, within set rules. This is a masterful player's game. And IMO what it was, and is to me, is being ruined by techno fun fluffy stuff, and changes, I do not need, especially since for me and many others on this post, it changes the 'flavor', the chatoyancy, of a great game. I for one, already miss 2017 Gwent greatly. And you can bet, if not here, some smart business game talent will see the huge potential and create something along the lines I set out with a new charecter set from another well known program... maybe using the rich Game of Thrones as a house and character well to draw on. If I was a young man with bucks I would do it myself. This is a wise opportunity laying here, with a customer base already on line, waiting. And after a long beta. Use it.

 

[InkognitoXI]

It is mostly positive, I like what they did to one's hand, the mulliganing looks completely perfect, the full art style has me hyped, the Order mechanic is something I really wanted, cards like Rotfiend and Imlerith are amazing.

Adding 1-2 more mulligans, while kicking someone in the balls in an even more painful way for losing the coin flip, by not even allowing a dry pass is a pathetic idea of solving anything, a symptom gets mended and the issue gets even worse, hopefully that is not their excuse for a solution.

The board looks alright, though elements like trees moving is something that reminds me too much of Heartstone and I really cannot stand that game's art style.

The leaders, not doing anything, while standing right next to the battlefield and right in front of each other feels horribly awkward, why do they no attack each other, why does nothing attack them ?
(I guess placing them on he right side of the hand respectively would fix that issue, given that the board would be inbetween them, without that it actually feels more like a friendly sparring than a battlefield, something they specifically mentioned as an aim)

Hopefully weather remains as well designed and polished as it was, the initial weather (which clear sky hints at) was binary and a joke design-pointwise and I really could not stand the game degrading back to that.

Though all in all I sure hope these issues get mended, in which case I am really looking forward to Homecoming.

 

[Selestes]

I remember video with them talking about midwinter patch and tons of new cards. How happy they were!!! Smiles, enthusiasm, interest, can't wait, etc etc.
And now - their faces look like they are at funeral.

 

[ManBearPigTroll]

How can you see this as negative lol. Right now the three rows mean absolutely nothing and the only thing they do is allow you to play around igni more, the game board and aesthetics of the game looks absolutely horrendous right now, comparing Gwent now to visuals of new Gwent is like comparing 4K TV to 1990 television.

People here are very weird and negative, these type of negative people are always afraid of change and always like to be nostalgic about how “things were used to be so much better back in the day” these type of people are not majority of the Gwent community, if you want real feedback go to Reddit or YouTube comments.

I’m shocked at the amount of negative feedback on this small forum, I hope CDPR ignores these negative “back in the day” individuals, and goes to reddit for real feedback and real constructive criticism.

 

[Voyagers]

Overall, I can see what they are trying to do in making a better looking board and 3D leaders both are simulating a battlefield and I am actually quite happy with them doing this. However, they should make an option to just switch back to the simple standard board on the table for players who just want gameplay and no aesthetics. Also the new board might require higher system specs to run.

I fully agree with several other posts which calls for more distinction between bronze and gold cards

 

[Fimbulthrym]

How can you see this as negative lol. Right now the three rows mean absolutely nothing and the only thing they do is allow you to play around igni more, the game board and aesthetics of the game looks absolutely horrendous right now, comparing Gwent now to visuals of new Gwent is like comparing 4K TV to 1990 television.

People here are very weird and negative, these type of negative people are always afraid of change and always like to be nostalgic about how “things were used to be so much better back in the day” these type of people are not majority of the Gwent community, if you want real feedback go to Reddit or YouTube comments.

I’m shocked at the amount of negative feedback on this small forum, I hope CDPR ignores these negative “back in the day” individuals, and goes to reddit for real feedback and real constructive criticism.

When do you start playing gwent?

And real feedback at reddit and youtube, are you trolling?

 

[ManBearPigTroll]

When do you start playing gwent?

And real feedback at reddit and youtube, are you trolling?

I started playing Gwent since closed beta, and no I’m not trolling, Reddit feedback is a way better indicator of the community than this forum and it has way more people active, too many negative people afraid of change and progress here, all they do is complain about everything.