How does Count Caldwell work?

[Archan6el]

I'm fairly certain, just as borut0207 wrote about playing his very last card. The game ends immediately after you play Caldwell, so he doesn't move. But will try to recreate.

On top of that, his RNG is simply terrible. Please implement the highest unit mechanic consistent with other cards: If both players have the same strength highest unit, he shouldn't move. This is supposed to be strategy, not gambling.

 

[BrokeCiri]

He doesn't if you play him as final card in round 3.

Did you have last say?

 

[4RM3D]

I'm fairly certain, just as borut0207 wrote about playing his very last card.

But borut0207 played it on his last turn while not having last say. If he did have last say then Caldwell would have immediately switched sides on his turn (and game) end. I've just tested it and it does work.

 

[BrokeCiri]

"Every allied turn, on turn end, move to the row with the highest unit on the battlefield"

I don't get what part of this is confusing to others.

 

[borut0207]

But borut0207 played it on his last turn while not having last say. If he did have last say then Caldwell would have immediately switched sides on his turn (and game) end. I've just tested it and it does work.

I did have the last say. I should've been more careful in stating that it wasn't me who passed the round but the game did that for me (since I had nothing left to do in the match).

Maybe I'm misremembering something, but I'm pretty sure the opponent had the highest unit. He had the other Caldwell on his side (whom he copied from me with Anna). Maybe two Caldwells on the board messed up the AI

 

[mzeebra]

It's guaranteed 10 points for only 8 provisions, in that deck, and no other deck would run it.

I don't run it, but Tibor Eggerbracht is a good counter to it for Nilgaard. Many people also use a tactic where they boost either a single or multiple cards. Say Anna Strenger situation or Hubert Rijk or one of several ST cards like Mahakam Defender or Olaf for Skellige or even Arnjold with a small boost, Jutta or even Greatsword.

 

[Archan6el]

Another funny one: I played Caldwell in R2 and passed as I had no more cards. Caldwell stayed on my half, while the opponent also had a 10 point unit (same as my Caldwell). Opponent plays a card lower than Caldwell. Then it's my turn again, but I had already passed. Now Caldwell moves to my opponent's side! This makes absolutely no sense. CDPR, please remove the RNG from Caldwell.

 

[rrc]

He doesn't if you play him as final card in round 3.

No, this is not how he works. But, let's say your opponent plays Caldwell as the last card and you have the last say. Now the opponent has passed and even if you play a huge unit having undisputed highest unit, when you pass, the game is over and Caldwell doesn't switch to your side.

This is because the opponent doesn't get a turn after you pass and hence Caldwell's condition is not executed.

But if you had the highest unit when opponent played Caldwell as the last unit and passed, Caldwell will switch to your side.

 

[Archan6el]

No, this is not how he works. But, let's say your opponent plays Caldwell as the last card and you have the last say. Now the opponent has passed and even if you play a huge unit having undisputed highest unit, when you pass, the game is over and Caldwell doesn't switch to your side.

This is because the opponent doesn't get a turn after you pass and hence Caldwell's condition is not executed.

But if you had the highest unit when opponent played Caldwell as the last unit and passed, Caldwell will switch to your side.

Ah, that makes much sense. I would find it more interesting and fun if he changes directly (like the traitor he is), whenever a bigger unit is played, irrespective of which player originally played Caldwell (including after passing). And again, to make it more strategic, I would appreciate that his RNG is removed so that he acts the same as other "highest-unit" cards (like Wild Hunt Rider); that he only moves if there is a higher strength enemy unit (and no RNG/gambling on same strength).

 

[nedders]

I just do not understand this at all.

My SK-Eist deck vs oppo SK-Bran (boring); we get down to 4 cards each in R1, i'm slightly ahead and have 2 x 5 STR units, oppo has 1 x 5 STR unit. So I play Caldwell, then Oppo plays Ulfheddin on Caldwell, so I've now got 3 x 5 STR units, oppo still just has the 1 unit. End of my turn, Caldwell moves to the other side. Why? What is going on, why is it randomly deciding? Surely it just stays on my side of the board. I then lost CA so instantly forfeit.

I genuinely, honestly don't understand these things - should this be posted in "ask a dev" or do they just not get it?

 

[4RM3D]

What the hell is going on?

You make it out to be that having more units matters for Caldwell. It doesn't. When both players have the highest unit, Caldwell just rolls the dice; 50-50 chance.

 

[BoYoDes]

This sor of RNG is one of the most stupid "mechanics" in all of Gwent history @nedders

Yesterday I lost a game cause between two 8 STR units, Oppo played Curse of Corruption and destroyed, of course, the card that was on my side of the board, while in a familiar situation but it was me that played CoC - I burned my own unit. This is what people hate when they speak of hating RNG in the game. Set some rules there. Like, burn the last card with the highest STR played OR the first one, do not randomly choose between two or thre or five. Remember how good it felt in Beta when they set the rules of what effect triggers when (left to right; Melee -> Range -> Support)? It was like a blessing.

In case of Caldwell - keep it on your side of the board when you are the one that initially played him when there are units with the same high STR value. Enough with this stupid RNG.

One more thing that really annoys me to no avail - the stupid Wild Hunt Riders that will trigger their ability no matter what (for some cheap a** Provisions too). First of - they should trigger when there are already units on both sides of the board and secondly, they should trigger when you actually have the highest STR value unit on the board when playing them. Not when there are units with the same highest STR value on the both sides of the board. They should have some drawback and not simply be the best one turn play Bronze card in the entire game.

Same goes for NG Knight - let him damage himself by 2 when there are no Units on the other side of the board.

 

[nedders]

You make it out to be that having more units matters for Caldwell. It doesn't. When both players have the highest unit, Caldwell just rolls the dice; 50-50 chance.

That's infuriatingly stupid. When Wild Hunt Rider appears and there's other 4 STR's, it doesn't roll a dice - it just summons. Conversely, if Old Speartip is on the board and you play Jutta, there's no dice roll - Jutta just halves to 6 STR.

Out of my decks and into scraps it goes!

Post automatically merged: Apr 23, 2019

This sor of RNG is one of the most stupid "mechanics" in all of Gwent history @nedders

Yesterday I lost a game cause between two 8 STR units, Oppo played Curse of Corruption and destroyed, of course, the card that was on my side of the board, while in a familiar situation but it was me that played CoC - I burned my own unit. This is what people hate when they speak of hating RNG in the game. Set some rules there. Like, burn the last card with the highest STR played OR the first one, do not randomly choose between two or thre or five. Remember how good it felt in Beta when they set the rules of what effect triggers when (left to right; Melee -> Range -> Support)? It was like a blessing.

In case of Caldwell - keep it on your side of the board when you are the one that initially played him when there are units with the same high STR value. Enough with this stupid RNG.

One more thing that really annoys me to no avail - the stupid Wild Hunt Riders that will trigger their ability no matter what (for some cheap a** Provisions too). First of - they should trigger when there are already units on both sides of the board and secondly, they should trigger when you actually have the highest STR value unit on the board when playing them. Not when there are units with the same highest STR value on the both sides of the board. They should have some drawback and not simply be the best one turn play Bronze card in the entire game.

Same goes for NG Knight - let him damage himself by 2 when there are no Units on the other side of the board.

Yes, just commented on this. Jutta is the only one that's accurate; unless she is ACTUALLY the largest unit - not joint-largest - she damages herself. Understand that, simple and clear - however, I had to find out by trial and error because with units like the WH Rider the same rule DOESN'T apply. Similarly all of these "dominance" rules are broken - it should be that the player has to have the outright largest card on the board, not a selection of joint largest. NG Knight too should take 2 damage. Plus the Marauder is also a bit dumb.

There has to be some kind of consistency from CDPR, and surely it cannot be difficult to notice these problems then act upon them.

 

[4RM3D]

Out of my decks and into scraps it goes!

I am also running Caldwell and while he can be a liability, he was the sole reason I won 3 matches in ranked. There are a few ways you can reduce the risk of using him. First of all, if the opponent has last say, but doesn't have the highest unit, you can safely play Caldwell. Also, if you need to take the round (1 or 2), Caldwell is also excellent choice. However, if the opponent is running big units or has more control than you, you might want to mulligan him away, unless you can sacrifice him (in a Mo or NR deck).

That's infuriatingly stupid. When Wild Hunt Rider appears and there's other 4 STR's, it doesn't roll a dice - it just summons. Conversely, if Old Speartip is on the board and you play Jutta, there's no dice roll - Jutta just halves to 6 STR.

The cards do exactly what they say. Jutta is indeed the highest unit, same with Wild Hunt Rider. Except with Jutta that's a negative, while with WHR it's a positive.

 

[nedders]

The cards do exactly what they say. Jutta is indeed the highest unit, same with Wild Hunt Rider. Except with Jutta that's a negative, while with WHR it's a positive.

Where does it say this on the cards?

 

[4RM3D]

Where does it say this on the cards?

Where does what say?

 

[nedders]

Where does what say?

Where is it explained that Jutta has to be the only biggest card, but Wild Hunt Rider only has to be joint-biggest, or says that Caldwell will "random roll" if both players have joint-highest? You said the words "positive" and "negative" as if there was some detail of explanation that I cannot find on the cards. The text for Jutta's condition is exactly the same as the text for WH Rider and there is zero explanation for Caldwell.

It's so slapdash and half-arsed. Why don't CDPR offer some kind of comment on these sad failings?

 

[MeCosmos]

Just read the descriptions of those cards and take a few minutes to think about it.

Rather than focusing on whether cards like Jutta and Wild hunt riders are the highest on the board, focus on whether there are cards on the board which ARE HIGHER than said cards. Bcs thats how it works.

Just an example:
Both players have 4 point units on the board and the first player plays Wild hunt riders. And now think about what i said, does the other player have bigger card? Answer is, NO. So the effect triggers. Its the same with jutta or any other dominance card.

The only problematic one can be Count Caldwell. As far as i can see the majority of complaints are based around him not changing side after passing. There comes the issue that way too many people struggle to understand what ,,allied turn,, means. Allied turn is considered a turn of a player on whose side Caldwell currently is ( at least thats the way i understand it)

So, if somebody plays him as a last card and then passes, there will be no more allied turns so he wont move no matter what the other player does or even when the other player has double last say. Although, i havent tested it, but i am pretty sure this is the way how it works.

Only problem i can see there, is when both players got the highest unit on the board. In that situation, there is 50% chance whether he will move or not, which causes a lot of confusion between players.

I would propose a few changes for him.
1. Make him 8 point for 6 provisions.
2. Make him move to the other side ONLY when there is unit on that side which is HIGHER than any other onit on allied side of the board.

So in situation where both players got the the HIGHEST unit, he wont move, bcs there isnt a higher unit on the other side, pretty simple, isnt it?

And why the nerf? Bcs decks which are centered around playing high units wont benefit so much from abusing his ability.

 

[4RM3D]

Where is it explained that Jutta has to be the only biggest card, but Wild Hunt Rider only has to be joint-biggest, or says that Caldwell will "random roll" if both players have joint-highest?

Caldwell is not specifically mentioned, just like with Curse of Corruption. These are inherent mechanics of Gwent that are learned through experience rather than just reading a manual.

As for Jutta and WHR, both units have the same condition for triggering (dominance). However, you actually don't want Jutta to trigger. And that's the difference. The cards make perfectly sense from a logical standpoint, even though one could be confused about the situation when both sides have the strongest unit. And just like with Caldwell, you'll learn through experience.

Jutta's and WHR's mechanics are solid. Caldwell can be debatable. Either way, I do like cards with unique mechanics instead of yet another boring removal card.

 

[BoYoDes]

... you'll learn through experience...

I'm sorry, but this is no excuse. RNG is no excuse. Just fix some mechanics to be more fair. Especially WH Riders, that are the best thinning Bronze tool in every faction and they are still considered the same Provisions Cost as the others.

The fact that something "can be learned through experience" does not mean that it is a good mechanic.