How would you feel about Cyberpunk 2077 always online ?

[blank_redge]

+10 Internets for referencing Saint Jourgensen.

 

[onosendai7]

That brings me to 20.
Izzat enough for a 18 year old Islay single malt ?

 

[thylbanus]

After the "epic" launch of Simcity, I would not buy this game until it hit the $10 bin if it did. By then all the bugs, patches, and poor launches of constant internet connectivity should be worked out. Otherwise, I would like to be able to play a game when my IP is on the blink (which happened recently when they did an "upgrade") or on my laptop, to which I broke my wireless.

 

[Aes Sídhe]

It's all about control of the customer.

You may be right, particularly concerning online requirements in games that dont need online to function, certainly the "captive audience" principle is in play at least... there have been a few games with static ingame advertising of real world products, similar to product placement in TV shows, ... this kind of thing will only increase now games have become the most profitable of the popular entertainment industry - an additional revenue stream made possible by some regularly online requirement enabling frequent updates, and its likely bright sparks in suits have other money making ideas looming too, if only they can get us to line up neatly in the milking shed.

The best anti-piracy bet is to create a game that is worth buying, because it's just so goddamned good.

Absolutely.

Unfortunately DRM software & strategies have now become a field & business of their own, with post graduates being encouraged to undertake research, because Warez groups keep beating the current techniques, because the game producers keep challenging them, because bean counters only understand counting beans, etc, to the top of the pile where this is just a bargaining chip / method to highlight the wider problem of copyright issues brought on by the digital age. So the big joint pressure groups fund further research completing the cycle, and out of an original irrational fear we get vested interests & blind stupidity ad infinitum

However, you have to remember that a large portion of the people who use "warez" do so because they have no money to buy products. Students and the unemployed, barely making the rent every month, spending most of their money to self-medicate with alcohol because their lives suck, and trying to find some form of escape from reality through warez media, be it TV, movies, music or games. I've been in a situation where I could relate to that.

Exactly ! Sales numbers & illegal downloads =|= number potentially sold if DRM worked 100%.

A recent European Union report showed that was the case. Curious how few studies are actually being done, isn't it? Sometime facts get in the way of a good story.

So yeah... If you want to cut down on warez, make the game always online. That's just a working solution.

Why bother at all? Like you I buy all the good games fairly quick, the not so good but ok I buy later when in the bin. I suspect that is the case with most people. Someone who really cant ever afford it though... if I was the game developer i'd be ok with it, I imagine anyone who donates to charity would see it in the same light. Point is: I *know* its not a lost sale.

Its generally accepted in advertising that beyond achieving name recognition, well known brands advertising budgets just cancel eachother out, achieving nothing but equilibrium. Its a futile expense, but now has a thriving industry keeping it going. DRM in my view is similar, although the currency is Respect.

Naw, they'd lose a LOT of their customer base, even more of their street cred...
.

Yep, and their minds too I suspect. I trust, never mind some early hiccups, that CDPR take this stance precisely because in the round, it is the wise thing to do and they know it.

DRM is bad, dumb and stupid

'Nuff said !

 

[onosendai7]

You may be right, particularly concerning online requirements in games that dont need online to function, certainly the "captive audience" principle is in play at least... there have been a few games with static ingame advertising of real world products, similar to product placement in TV shows, ... this kind of thing will only increase now games have become the most profitable of the popular entertainment industry - an additional revenue stream made possible by some regularly online requirement enabling frequent updates, and its likely bright sparks in suits have other money making ideas looming too, if only they can get us to line up neatly in the milking shed.

Well, they start to think to actually sell Alpha games, even if only for indie developers (so far).
They also think about generalizing in-game transactions (yes, even for solo mode).
And, of course, multiplying DLCs is not to be forgotten (Skins, weapons, map, 1 or 2 hours of additional gameplay).

This business starts to stink....

 

[username_3659674]

"It's around a 93-95 per cent piracy rate." - Ubisoft, on the PC market.

Obviously this statistic is pure fiction, but it does reveal an alarming mindset behind the big publishers who have this antagonistic relationship with their own customers. You better believe that crap is unsustainable, they're bleeding money right now.

As for my personal feelings on what I'd think of an always online Cyberpunk 2077, I wouldn't appreciate it at all. I could point at my clunky Internet connection, or the watering down of my consumer rights, but by far the biggest complaint I would have is that it would be a full priced rental relying on the continued running of external servers. I want to, and regularly do, play singleplayer games from more than ten years ago right out of the box, and I see no reason why I should lose that ability.

 

[blank_redge]

...by far the biggest complaint I would have is that it would be a full priced rental relying on the continued running of external servers. I want to, and regularly do, play singleplayer games from more than ten years ago right out of the box, and I see no reason why I should lose that ability.

Hear, hear! ^_^

 

[dragonbird]

Just in case there's anyone around who still doesn't know CD Projekt Red's views on DRM and Always Online -
http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2013/04/24/talking-the-witcher-3-with-cd-projekt-red-single-player-only-drm-worst-thing-in-video-game-industry/

“In my opinion,” Tomaszkiewicz tells me, “DRM is the worst thing in the gaming industry. It’s limiting our rights to play games owned by us. Let’s imagine that you have a game that requires internet connection to prove that you actually bought it. What if you lose your connection because of your internet provider? You can’t play anymore. It is worth mentioning that many people in Poland or even in the US and other countries still don’t have an internet connection or have a very slow one. I was in such a situation once and I really didn’t understand why I couldn’t play games that I had bought. I believe that as long as people feel that companies are cheating them by selling games they cannot play freely, limiting their rights, and making unfair DRM, then they will fight against that.”

We believe that DRM is not stopping piracy but can be a real pain for legal users. And if this is the case, why would you want to punish your customers instead of supporting them?

 

[Sioclya]

Well, I personally am 100% online anyway, so it wouldn't make a difference. Also, seeing as how 100% of games which aren't always online are cracked by the guys at Razor1911, SKIDROW or RELOADED, or if not them, then someone else, I can quite easily understand why you'd want an always online system.

Even "always online" systems are cracked. Something such as WoW is much harder, since the game is streamed from a server to your computer in a big part. Anything that exists 100% on the install DVD will be cracked, regardless of DRM. DRM is nothing but a speed bump, and as such complete and utter waste of time and simply a PitA for the honest customer.

So, to answer, I would buy the game whether it required you to be online or not, but I can understand why someone wouldn't.

Let me tell you this: ALL games that have always-on have been cracked. To the point that the ACII patch that removed always-online carried a Razor1911 tag.

But this discussion continues to be naught, because CDPR explicitly stated that they're aiming for 100% DRM-free games.

And let me tell you how always-on DRM usually works out when games become older: everybody uses the crack. Except for MMOs, where most of the newer ones are better than the older ones anyway (talking about MMORPGs and MMOFPSs here, don't know about other types of MMOs).

 

[Sydanyo]

Let me tell you this: ALL games that have always-on have been cracked. To the point that the ACII patch that removed always-online carried a Razor1911 tag.

As I said, even "always online" systems are cracked. We are in agreement.

However, in the case of a game such as for example WoW, or Diablo 3, you must have a separate server software running either on your computer or elsewhere. Also, when there's an online community, and even an online economy, people tend to want to be a part of the official one, rather than an unofficial one.

Then there's the fact that you don't pay for the client in WoW (or even Diablo 3 AFAIK). You pay for the account. At least in WoW you can freely download the account from where ever you want, and install it on any and every computer. You've bought the account, and you pay a subscription to access the service using that account.

That's hugely different than downloading an .iso as a torrent.

But this discussion continues to be naught, because CDPR explicitly stated that they're aiming for 100% DRM-free games.

Well honestly now, you quoted a post of mine that is a month and a half old.

And let me tell you how always-on DRM usually works out when games become older: everybody uses the crack. Except for MMOs, where most of the newer ones are better than the older ones anyway (talking about MMORPGs and MMOFPSs here, don't know about other types of MMOs).

I personally don't see games where the client has a two line discussion with the server as "always online", since as you said, you can crack that. With a single .dll, as is the case with most Steam games. In my mind true "always online" games are those where a server streams data to the client. But that's neither here nor there.

 

[chriswebb2020.736]

I realise this i s a bit of an older post to quote, but I just wanted to make sure my opinion on this particular matter was represented:

What if we dumbed it down and gave it cartoony graphics, to appeal to casual gamers? aka WoW.

DIE!!!
IN A FIRE!!!
BURN ALIVE AFTER BEING FED YOUR OWN GENITALIA!!!

I'll leave it there before I get too graphic.

That is my opinion of 'WoW-iffying' CP2077

 

[blank_redge]

That is my opinion of 'WoW-iffying' CP2077

That should be EVERYone's opinion on WoW-ifying... well, anything. Anything that's not supposed to be pitched to 12-and-under, that is.