If you don't like the combat, you're doing it wrong

[elloimjoe]

If you don't like the combat, you're doing it wrong

This game isn't supposed to be easy. The combat is intended to be challenging, and if you don't like it you're doing something wrong. I've watched game clips of many people who are complaining, and have noticed two common trends. They either don't dodge enough, or they dodge too much.

You have to keep moving in this game, especially if you're surrounded. You'll rarely have a chance to spam attacks if its more than 2v1. Dodging is something you should do often, as it uses no stamina; however it shouldn't be the ONLY thing you use. This game has rolls, parrying, ripostes, quen sign, bombs, and potions for a reason. If you learn how to use all of these in the correct situations, the combat is one of the best systems in any RPG.

Rolling - Should be used if getting swarmed by creatures that attack quickly/use heavy attacks. (Nekkers, Water Hags, Drowners) Also to apply Quen if it comes down, however rolling does use stamina so you'll have to wait a second to bring it up.

Parrying - So you're surrounded and getting the crap kicked out of you. You're desperately watching your health bar drop as monsters mercilessly tear away at you. Can't dodge or roll, you're trapped. Parry. Geralt's witcher senses give him jedi-like blocking skillz. Granted there are attacks that are too heavy to be parried, but in most cases it'll give you a couple seconds to get your bearings/enough stamina to cast signs.

Ripostes - Require precise timing, so I wouldn't rely on using this instead of parrying. I seem to only get these in intense flow battle moments, and parrying is usually the safer option of the two.

Quen - Should ALWAYS be up if possible. Use it before going into a fight and you'll go into a fight with a shield and another available sign; stamina regens quicker out of combat. If it goes down, get it back up ASAP. If upgraded with the first available skill it also explodes when it goes down, with dmg and a chance of knockback, which comes in handy if you're in one of those cornered situations.

Potions - Do I really have to mention the importance of these? Considering they all get refilled after meditating providing you have Alcholest (which you more than likely have tons of by now) there's no excuse to not use them. Swallow is one of the most handy potions, and should be crafted as early as possible. Plus theres a quest in White Orchard that gives 250 xp just for crafting it (this quest fails after leaving the area for the story).

Bombs - Not so hidden gems. Know how drowners hate fire? Know how you hate fighting drowners? (I have a vendetta against them) Use bombs! THESE ALSO REFILL WITH MEDITATING. So no excuse not to use them. Dragon's dream produces a noxious gas cloud that when combined with igni, creates an explosion obliterating anything unlucky enough to be in it (including yourself, be careful!) Grapeshot does shrapnel and silver damage.

Finally just a couple run of the mill tips.
- Careful where you're standing, positioning is unexplainably important in this game. Watch out for little objects on the ground that Geralt can't jump over for some reason.

- Save FREQUENTLY. If a monster makes you think "Oh no" then save. If you see a group of monsters, save. If you discover/clear out some undiscovered locations, save. If you complete a quest, save. It may take all of 5 seconds, but it's better than being sent about 15 minutes back because the autosave didn't decide to activate.

That's all I got. I understand that some people simply will not like this game's combat; however I implore you to at least learn and practice before you simply say it's bad. As mentioned previously, it's supposed to be challenging. If it wasn't challenging, it wouldn't be rewarding. It's not broken, just takes some time to get used to. This game is a masterpiece and I think CDPR did amazingly on it. Sure there might be some technical hiccups, but they obviously aren't intentional; and if you think it is you're being a conspiracy theorist or don't know how much these guys appreciate their fans.

Thanks for reading =)

 

[styku]

I cannot overstate how correct you are about this.
Combat system is dynamic and demanding. It is far more complex than in any other action RPGs I know. Due to its complexity, it gives you a lot of flexibility, so after some practice you can use it to fit your character and style, but at least on harder difficulties you'll never be able to disregard part of your arsenal completely. No button mashing. No Dark Souls style roll and backstab tactics. This is one hell of a great combat mechanics, which certainly could be improved in some aspects, but still are one of the best (if not the best!) out there.

 

[The_Blog]

Is there any way to know if you can Parry or not? Because you can't for example parry the attack of a Droawner, or the attack these Axe wielding Bandits do. Basicly all heavier attacks. Can you maybe read it in the bestiary? I havn't found it.

 

[styku]

I guess it comes solely from your experience and common sense. If a guy wields a huge-ass axe, that's basically the size of a grown man - you might be better of just rolling under it
This might be considered good or bad. For me it really doesn't matter that much. Just save often!

 

[elloimjoe]

I've noticed that if a monster jumps at you its better to try to dodge, but I haven't noticed any UI notification to alert us. Once you learn a monster's attack patterns it becomes easier to tell what you can and can't block.

 

[apoc_reg]

Haha no offence to OP but i laughed at the title, "if you have an opinion it is wrong"

---------- Updated at 02:36 PM ----------

Is there any way to know if you can Parry or not? Because you can't for example parry the attack of a Droawner, or the attack these Axe wielding Bandits do. Basicly all heavier attacks. Can you maybe read it in the bestiary? I havn't found it.

I seem to remember a tool tip early on in the tutorial fight that said the enemy health bar flashes... i could be wrong though!

 

[DukeAlmighty]

Pro tips: Put dodge on right mouse button.Very easy to use. You don't really need witcher senses there, or heavy attack.

 

[elloimjoe]

I didn't mean for it to sound like their opinion is wrong, but that they're most likely going about their tactics wrong. Hence, "you're doing it wrong." Sorry if anyone takes offense to it.

I believe the red flashing is the moment you hit the parry to perform a riposte.

 

[littlemad]

I believe the red flashing is the moment you hit the parry to perform a riposte.

what is the thing that is red and flashing?

 

[elloimjoe]

Opponent's health bar, you'll see it flash real quick right before a hit lands.

 

[kaltorakh]

No Dark Souls style roll and backstab tactics. This is one hell of a great combat mechanics, which certainly could be improved in some aspects, but still are one of the best (if not the best!) out there.

I like Dark Souls, but I am in no way a fanboy... but saying that Wicther3 combat is better than DS combat... that's going too far.

I'm just talking about the combat, not anything else of the game. I prefer many other RPGs over dark souls, but I have to admit that if I just take the combat into consideration, Dark Soul beats any RPG. Well, mele combat. Ranged and magic are meh.

 

[apoc_reg]

I didn't mean for it to sound like their opinion is wrong, but that they're most likely going about their tactics wrong. Hence, "you're doing it wrong." Sorry if anyone takes offense to it.

I believe the red flashing is the moment you hit the parry to perform a riposte.

No not at all just struck me as funny

Actually very much agree with a lot of your points. Now I'm more versed in combat I'm tempted to start again on death march but hate losing progress! Would be annoying to put it on DM now and finish it without the achievement though.

 

[styku]

I like Dark Souls, but I am in no way a fanboy... but saying that Wicther3 combat is better than DS combat... that's going too far.

I'm just talking about the combat, not anything else of the game. I prefer many other RPGs over dark souls, but I have to admit that if I just take the combat into consideration, Dark Soul beats any RPG. Well, mele combat. Ranged and magic are meh.

I also do like Dark Souls, spent more than 50 hours on this, and considering that I don't really have much time for playing games, its a lot for me.
And combat system is good, even very good, thanks to it simplicity. But also it narrows your tactics to two major ones: if you're heavily armored, facetank with shield up and occasionally dodge. If you're not encumbered as much, roll and backstab or riposte whenever possible.
What I really do love about Dark Souls combat are the differences in movesets of certain weapons. But that doesn't change the fact for me, that you're still forced to use one of those two tactics, because you don't have much choice. Ever tried to cast a spell in the middle of close combat? No way, man. You need to run from the bad guy, maybe behind some pillar or corner. Witcher allows you to do this, and even much more - therefore presenting you much more ways to combat effectively.
But of course that's only my opinion. I still like DS combat system very much.

 

[apoc_reg]

Dark Souls combat is excellent, exact and calculated focusses on 1 on 1 battles

Witcher 3 you are fighting often more random (ie dogs, wolves etc) and groups of enemies, its different and also very good
I hate it when games dont feel distinct (re any shooter in the last 5 years...) so I celebrate the difference! Not 'better' just different

 

[Gothfather]

I would add a few other "Pro Tips" often times you will stagger a foe with an attack even a light attack. It is in your interest to follow up aggressively even in a group setting as often your follow up attacks can stagger your opponent out of the immediate combat zone. This isolates the enemy an allows you to either finish or severely wound. This said you must be aware that as soon as they parry your attack they have recovered and aggressive button mashing now will only open up your defences.

Openings should be exploited but openings are not a set duration so some times an opening can be exploited until death sometimes you only get one fast attack in. So be prepared to stop so as not to open yourself up to a counter attack.

I find leap works best against multiple and large opponents, while dodge/side step works best against 1 or 2 human sized opponents as you can strike from the flank very easy after a dodge/sidestep. If things get hairy do multiple leaps out of the impedimenta combat zone. This will give you a chance to reassess the combat. and often you can get a straggler to chase you out of the pack allowing you to kill it alone and isolated.

Remember swallow stops vitality regen for 2 secs when you are damaged, food gives regen all the time it is up. So don't dismiss food as a combat "potion." They both have their place don't dismiss one over the other out of hand.

 

[elloimjoe]

Thanks for the addition! You make some very good points.

 

[Windemere]

As a PC user, I'm using a G600 MMO mouse for the game it works nicely. I have the different signs keybound to the thumb buttons to make it even faster than the mousewheel, and I have bound dodge and shift to a couple of other buttons for convenience. Combat definitely feels more fun and fluid than TW2. I think it is both easier to learn yet not easy to master. I agree that counterattack needs some work though, that one feels very imprecise.

 

[AutumnalWanderer]

In this series this game have the best combat so far. The first was slow but more tactical, the second was more fast, but for me it was lesser tactical, but now, not just fast, but tactical. Geralt's animations are just perfect, exactly how I imagined when I read the short stories for the first time.

 

[Cotchorama]

I agree with this OP 100%. It is absolutely correct.
(long cool story incoming)

Someone argues: "if you have an opinion, you're doing it wrong" and tbh, having an opinion on your first impression on the game doesn't mean its the best educated opinion. We can all agree that sometimes we make ignorant opinions, or educated opinions... an opinion that you can make hastily and thus somewhat erroneous, or you can spend time to learn the combat's ins and outs to make a solid educated opinion.

What I'm getting at is, twas' a while ago, I was looking for a pc RPG to sink my teeth into coming from playing Skyrim. Its my educated opinion (500 hours of playing the game both on xbox and pc with mods) that the combat in Skyrim is really really lackluster. Well I did my research, asked on many forums, for an ideal RPG I could play on PC, the single most unanimous vote on many forum was The Witcher 2. I had NEVER heard of TW2 before then (yes I know, poor poor me ;. So I decided "what the hell? lets try it. It sounds like its great".

So I purchased the game, installed, and promptly started playing the game. Mind you, Zelda, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, I went into the combat swords blazing. I knew NOTHING of the combat except I could roll, didn't even know what the magic was for. So, I promptly got my ass handed to me on the first two hander by the arbalest in the first scene. I restarted, again, dead. dead, dead, dead. I end up just rage quitting. A few days after I try it again, same deal. So I was like WTF this fighting sucks balls, F*** this game, *uninstall* (yes an uneducated ignorant opinion, as I didn't fully understand combat nor magic.)

A year passes, and I install it again, and AGAIN the instant gratification I learned to expect from Skyrim like games, isn't given to me by TW2. After a few long anger filled attempts again I uninstall. I guess in hind sight i never really gave it a chance. Anyway, so I'm like "why the F*** do people even like the game? the combat SUCKS hairy monkey balls, its the worst combat ever".

So, ANOTHER year passes and Bloodborne gets released. I learn from that game how useful Dodging and timed attacks are, I didn't exactly like that the enemy attack patterns are always the same, its kinda boring to me... but I continue on with Bloodborne getting better at combat. I get tired of talking to doors and windows, and suddenly I'm reminded "hey I have that game TW2 on steam!!! it kinda plays like this!!, except it has magic and gear that has stats i can play with (I'm a gear whore) AND It has an AMAZING story-so I hear!!". So I download and install TW2 a third time... except this time, i took the time to learn the ins and outs of combat, what the spells do, and from Bloodborne, WHEN to dodge and strike.

After a while of learning the spells, and the attacks, I'm like "WTF O.O... THIS game is the BEST RPG in the whole frikkin world!!!! ( I played FFs 4-12, 11 and 14 online, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, Fall out, Zelda, Secret of mana, Chrono Trigger, various other Square enix titles, some of Bloodborne, which still sits dusty after I discovered -in detail- how to play TW2)

I'm kinda in shame that I never really gave TW2 a chance because I never understood the combat. Being that it was clearly such an amazing game. Combat is something you constantly do in RPGs,so combat SHOULD be amazing.

Well sorry for wall of text, but because of MY exerience, yes, I can say "if you don't like the combat, you're doing it wrong" I disliked TW2's combat and i was CLEARLY doing it wrong. When I learned how to be effective, even in TW3 as combat is the same just refined, combat is VERY fun and challenging. When you take the time to understand the combat completely, you understand its one of the best combat systems in rpgs, no question about it. (I can't compare it to DS games, as far as I understand DS games aren't openworld giant like TW3 is, and learning attack patterns isn't exactly challenging, just time consuming. Same with Bloodborne, I can't really compare TW3 with Bloodborne because TW3 IS a full blown RPG not a "follow the railroad talk to windows and doors kinda game.)

 

[elloimjoe]

Thanks for your input Cotchorama, that was exactly the point I was trying to make. The game's combat is difficult to learn, but amazing once mastered =)