I'll give my feedback, and I think a lot of people (will) agree

+
cant wait for nilf guard to spy it way to to a 15 card hand and then draw 2 more after the round ends good luck trying to beat that,

this change kills alot like about gwent it's really changed what I was redrawing knowing that I was getting more cards later.
 
What do you say we leave the panicking for when/if this is confirmed to be a permanent change rather than just a KTS thing? It might just be a way to make up for the lack of spies and Decoy. Not to mention that if this was for good, you would expect Northern Realms to have a working ability, even if it's not the same one they used to.
 
Totally agree with you on those cards being drawn making game for worst, the whole Gwent idea is that you got your cards at the beginning and you need to be smart how you play them (you get extra cards occasionally by some specific abilities), but that's it, it gives you that feel of real competition, and that one with the better strategy will prevail at the end, otherwise with more cards drawing after each round, makes game more depended on luck and aims more on casual side, which is really bad for Gwent overall!...
 
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I really wish cd red would say if drawing cards after each round is just a Kts or a new rule in gwent, this is a big rule change not to taken lightly if it stays.
 
We haven't see the whole picture. The deck ability of NR changed due to drawing cards between turns, a lots of cards should be changed. Maybe developers can provide both of the old and new mechanics in beta and let players vote, so that don't have to give up their hard work.
 
I really wish cd red would say if drawing cards after each round is just a Kts or a new rule in gwent, this is a big rule change not to taken lightly if it stays.

They are probably discussing the game mechanics themselves right now. It's nice to know that they still want to change things on such a large and drastic scale though.
 
I agree card drawing at then end of the rounds should be removed, as part of Gwent's core is devising your strategy in the mulligan phase and in round 1, and then executing it in rounds 2 and 3. Drawing cards in between rounds allows for deviations from the original strategy, and this seems unGwent like, i.e rng based.
 
You'd agree though that to play so aggressively (depending on the degree of course), that the odds of getting two cards that both will save your butt are unlikely, yes? To me, I actually like this angle because it means that you can't be assured victory by just making the opponent play more/bigger cards than you. It puts more value on the first round and makes it's important to not just treat it as a throwaway round.

I do agree that it makes the game a little less predictable though and I liked the part of how things could swing from decisive victory to crushing defeat because I think a great game should have that. Mind you, I still don't think three cards make THAT big a different, at least not to make up for a skill gap. This game is still about out thinking your opponent more so than being luckier. I see no less the tactical/chess-like element being removed. I'm a big Civilization fan and enjoy playing multiplayer. And that element of luck does serve to vary the game. But if I play my cards right, I can adjust to the situation and still make it work.

While I do think there will be those odd games where things turn dramatically as you suggest, I think by and large that will be made up in the amount games that don't get forfeited either at the start of the game, or at the end of the second round.

Alright, I can see your point. I still think reduce the number of cards drawn from 2 to 1 after the first round and both sides are happy. The drawing would still be an element of unpredictability, but the difference would not be as big if you only drew 1 card instead of 2.

But I understand what you mean, although I think the card drawing does NOT like you said make the first round more important, it makes it less important since the other rounds can still change things. Which is not necessarily a bad thing I agree.

I also did not mean that the "chess-like element" would be "removed", I just think the decision whether to let the players draw cards or not, and how many of them in which round will determine HOW "chess-like" (planning ahead, predicting the game) and HOW "luck-based" and "dynamic" (being able to turn a game if you get a good draw) the game will ultimately be. My point was, it always depends what the developers actually wanted to achieve. If they designed the card-draw mechanic because they wanted it to be less predictable and wanted the later rounds to be more interesting, then they did achieve that. If they did not want the game to be that way then it is a problem.

I PERSONALLY think it is both a good and bad change, and they have to change it a LITTLE bit and balance it out to make it work well. With a card draw of 1 after each round (like I said) it might be more of a balanced game. But maybe I'm wrong there, that is just my impression. I'm not the GWENT expert.
 
Hey Ruben,

I'll answer as much as I can :)

One of the reasons we are experimenting with the way card draw works is to standardize it across factions. The faction abilities that granted extra cards gave those specific factions what we considered to be an unfair advantage. The same can be said for cards within the decks that granted multiple card draws. Therefore we've lowered the card draw within the cards themselves and inserted it into the game rules instead.

Another reason is that if people had a bad mulligan they would often simply give up on the game as there would be very little chance to win. This isn't a good experience for the player or the opponent. For some specific factions, e.g. Monsters, this was even worse and more common due to muster cards and lack of card draw cards.

The decks within the stress test were purposely quite simplistic, this is why for example they include several pure value cards. We knew for many people it would be their first exposure to new changes within Gwent since the Witcher 3 and we didn't want the decks to be overwhelming, especially with the absence of a tutorial :)

From what you have played at Gamescom the cards as a whole have not been simplified. Something that might have caused some confusion is that Redanian Knights didn't use to be a pure value card, we exchanged them with another card that was. The total number of pure value cards available within each deck has actually been decreased on top of this.

Thank you for the feedback and if you have any other questions I will try to answer as best I can :)
 
Very good change in my opinion. I wrote most of those points on a polish forum as well, when i tryed to explain why that drawing mechanic is a good thing.
 
Hey Ruben,

I'll answer as much as I can :)

One of the reasons we are experimenting with the way card draw works is to standardize it across factions. The faction abilities that granted extra cards gave those specific factions what we considered to be an unfair advantage. The same can be said for cards within the decks that granted multiple card draws. Therefore we've lowered the card draw within the cards themselves and inserted it into the game rules instead.

Another reason is that if people had a bad mulligan they would often simply give up on the game as there would be very little chance to win. This isn't a good experience for the player or the opponent. For some specific factions, e.g. Monsters, this was even worse and more common due to muster cards and lack of card draw cards.

The decks within the stress test were purposely quite simplistic, this is why for example they include several pure value cards. We knew for many people it would be their first exposure to new changes within Gwent since the Witcher 3 and we didn't want the decks to be overwhelming, especially with the absence of a tutorial :)

From what you have played at Gamescom the cards as a whole have not been simplified. Something that might have caused some confusion is that Redanian Knights didn't use to be a pure value card, we exchanged them with another card that was. The total number of pure value cards available within each deck has actually been decreased on top of this.

Thank you for the feedback and if you have any other questions I will try to answer as best I can :)

Hey thank you for that response. I actually agree with your assessment and this is probably the best time to go ham with changes and experiment with different mechanics.

As for other questions, here's two:

1. Do you plan to make cards have a symbol representing their faction (or neutrality) they belong to?
2. What about player interaction? Full chat (optional maybe) or emotes, if planned at all?

Thanks
 
Hey Ruben,

I'll answer as much as I can :)

One of the reasons we are experimenting with the way card draw works is to standardize it across factions. The faction abilities that granted extra cards gave those specific factions what we considered to be an unfair advantage. The same can be said for cards within the decks that granted multiple card draws. Therefore we've lowered the card draw within the cards themselves and inserted it into the game rules instead.

Another reason is that if people had a bad mulligan they would often simply give up on the game as there would be very little chance to win. This isn't a good experience for the player or the opponent. For some specific factions, e.g. Monsters, this was even worse and more common due to muster cards and lack of card draw cards.

The decks within the stress test were purposely quite simplistic, this is why for example they include several pure value cards. We knew for many people it would be their first exposure to new changes within Gwent since the Witcher 3 and we didn't want the decks to be overwhelming, especially with the absence of a tutorial :)

From what you have played at Gamescom the cards as a whole have not been simplified. Something that might have caused some confusion is that Redanian Knights didn't use to be a pure value card, we exchanged them with another card that was. The total number of pure value cards available within each deck has actually been decreased on top of this.

Thank you for the feedback and if you have any other questions I will try to answer as best I can :)

Thanks for explaining, I'll still stay with my current feeling on this subject though. Spies didn't break the game because other factions had other ways to draw cards or win. Each faction had unique win conditions which was a lot of fun. I don't think this is a correct solution for the 'problem'. Thanks for your patience and polite answer anyways, always appreciated :)
 
One of the reasons we are experimenting with the way card draw works is to standardize it across factions. The faction abilities that granted extra cards gave those specific factions what we considered to be an unfair advantage. The same can be said for cards within the decks that granted multiple card draws. Therefore we've lowered the card draw within the cards themselves and inserted it into the game rules instead.

As Ruben said, every faction has it's own way to draw more cards.

What about factions with cards granting multiple card draw, like monsters? Maybe it seems to be advantage in cards, but it is not, even if it is an advantage, it can be easily weakened by changing points values of those additional cards. Many monster cards with muster ability have the same values, or they are in the same row, so they are vulnerable for weather or simple scorch/epidemic. So even it seems to be so much OP at the beginning, avarage Gwent player can deal with it just using proper cards.

Another reason is that if people had a bad mulligan they would often simply give up on the game as there would be very little chance to win. This isn't a good experience for the player or the opponent. For some specific factions, e.g. Monsters, this was even worse and more common due to muster cards and lack of card draw cards.

I can believe you that there are many players that do that. But starting draw depends on deck and cards we put there, so it is the first way to avoid bad draw - rethink and prepare proper deck. The second way (which of course can be used with the first way) is possibility to redraw 3 cards, it is 30% of the start draw, so it is quite a lot in my opinion. And last but not least, even if you has a "bad draw", ok, it will be much harder to win, but it is not impossible!

I will give here example from my experience with Gwent games with living opponent (I know, it "old" Gwent, now is new, standalone, new cards, abilities etc - OK, but the rules are the same!).
I had a bad draw - 7 special cards! and only 3 cards with points on them! And I still was manage to win, why? Because the opponent was weak? No, because even with this baaad draw the opponent does not know about it, so if well played and with a bit of luck it is possible to win :)
 
Hey Ruben,

I'll answer as much as I can :)

One of the reasons we are experimenting with the way card draw works is to standardize it across factions. The faction abilities that granted extra cards gave those specific factions what we considered to be an unfair advantage. The same can be said for cards within the decks that granted multiple card draws. Therefore we've lowered the card draw within the cards themselves and inserted it into the game rules instead.

Another reason is that if people had a bad mulligan they would often simply give up on the game as there would be very little chance to win. This isn't a good experience for the player or the opponent. For some specific factions, e.g. Monsters, this was even worse and more common due to muster cards and lack of card draw cards.

The decks within the stress test were purposely quite simplistic, this is why for example they include several pure value cards. We knew for many people it would be their first exposure to new changes within Gwent since the Witcher 3 and we didn't want the decks to be overwhelming, especially with the absence of a tutorial :)

From what you have played at Gamescom the cards as a whole have not been simplified. Something that might have caused some confusion is that Redanian Knights didn't use to be a pure value card, we exchanged them with another card that was. The total number of pure value cards available within each deck has actually been decreased on top of this.

Thank you for the feedback and if you have any other questions I will try to answer as best I can :)

I'd also politely invite some developers into the discord chat. Some of the most hardcore playerbase is there, discussing aspects of the game. They are making some really good points for both parties here.

If you're interested you can always hop on and read a bit :)
https://discord.gg/vuxM6D6
 
I think they are trying to make this game more p2w, because with gamescom cards, even with some troops card, thanks to their abilities you , could make some good strategies, and now with that plain units your stategy will be to change these units (mean buy better) even Rethas mentioned that you will likely replace them
:cirisad:
 
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@Rethas, I agree with your reasoning, however I felt that some factions being stronger in an important game aspect like card advantage, than others made them stand out. Now that this will be equalized, how does the design team envision making the factions unique enough on their own without gameplay becoming to linear?

I understand each faction will have their unique cards and effects, but there are only so many big game mechanics, like card advantage, available especially without mana-resources.
 
Hey Ruben,

I'll answer as much as I can :)

One of the reasons we are experimenting with the way card draw works is to standardize it across factions. The faction abilities that granted extra cards gave those specific factions what we considered to be an unfair advantage. The same can be said for cards within the decks that granted multiple card draws. Therefore we've lowered the card draw within the cards themselves and inserted it into the game rules instead.

Another reason is that if people had a bad mulligan they would often simply give up on the game as there would be very little chance to win. This isn't a good experience for the player or the opponent. For some specific factions, e.g. Monsters, this was even worse and more common due to muster cards and lack of card draw cards.

Players should have a choice to decide if they want to play with or without drawing cards between rounds.

To be honest I don't like the new mechanics it makes gwent less strategic then before imo.
 
Hey thank you for that response. I actually agree with your assessment and this is probably the best time to go ham with changes and experiment with different mechanics.

As for other questions, here's two:

1. Do you plan to make cards have a symbol representing their faction (or neutrality) they belong to?
2. What about player interaction? Full chat (optional maybe) or emotes, if planned at all?

Thanks

I can't really give details on those points at this time, so sorry for that :)

At this time we do not have full chat planned as a feature, if you wish to chat you can add someone to friends in GOG. You will be able to challenge them to a friendly game through GOG galaxy also.
 
I think they are trying to make this game more p2w, because with gamescom cards, even with some troops card, thanks to their abilities you , could make some good strategies, and now with that plain units your stategy will be to change these units (mean buy better) even Rethas mentioned that you will likely replace them
:cirisad:

We purposely chose many of the simplest cards for this build as to not overwhelm newcomers to Gwent :)
 
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