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I'm late about this, but thank you CD Projekt RED for no dialogue wheel in Cyberpunk 2077

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Balloers100

Rookie
#1
From the forty eight minute YouTube video of Cyberpunk 2077 from August 2018 at Gamescom 2018 when CD Projekt RED showed off Cyberpunk 2077 I did not see any dialogue wheel at all like what Fallout 4 has for choosing choices in the dialogue sentences.

It was all texts lines sentences.

So thank you CD Projekt RED for not adding a circle or a oval or a diamond shaped thingy to choose from for dialogue.
 
Snowflakez

Snowflakez

Forum veteran
#2
Balloers100 said:
From the forty eight minute YouTube video of Cyberpunk 2077 from August 2018 at Gamescom 2018 when CD Projekt RED showed off Cyberpunk 2077 I did not see any dialogue wheel at all like what Fallout 4 has for choosing choices in the dialogue sentences.

It was all texts lines sentences.

So thank you CD Projekt RED for not adding a circle or a oval or a diamond shaped thingy to choose from for dialogue.
Click to expand...
Doesn't mean the dialogue won't be shortened and mis-represented, though. :(

But I too am happy to see a classic-ish "line by line" dialogue system.
 
EngryEngineer

EngryEngineer

Senior user
#3
Snowflakez said:
Doesn't mean the dialogue won't be shortened and mis-represented, though. :(

But I too am happy to see a classic-ish "line by line" dialogue system.
Click to expand...
I'm not saying it'll be mis-represented, but the gameplay reveal shows it already being significantly shortened which means it is re-interpreted, which increases the chances that someone's going to read it differently. Honestly I don't see much difference in what they did give and the wheel, it is the same idea of a collection of summarized statements, just in list form.

examples:
Looking to upgrade. -> Need to bump up my specs and get a grip, heh. (then a whole exchange giving details about the dex job that is automatic)

Wanna make a deal with the corpos. -> 'Member the corpo off Dex's shard? Rang her. She's in the area, and we're gonna meet.

Yeah. -> Yeah, gotta do this, but don't you move a damn muscle. Not unless I start that is.

Calm the hell down. Sheesh. -> Calm down, what is this? (not even sure why this one was changed.)

Yep. All by my lonesome. -> Yep just little ol' me. (again why, this one's "summarized" form is longer)

No idea what you're talking about. -> Nope got nothin' to do with him or Militech.

Pay me, and I'll nab your thieves for you. -> Gangoons who ripped you off - I know where to find 'em. They got a bot I want. Give me the funds to buy that bot, you can do what you want with the gang.


Full transparency here, I feel like in the context of the conversations and such these aren't bad. To me these responses were generally expected, but it is still taking the same sort of liberties that the wheels do, and I get a raised eyebrow when the response is not only different but shorter than the selected option. I don't really have any qualms with it other than I'm surprised that the bulk of the conversation isn't selected by the player.
 
Snowflakez

Snowflakez

Forum veteran
#4
EngryEngineer said:
I'm not saying it'll be mis-represented, but the gameplay reveal shows it already being significantly shortened which means it is re-interpreted, which increases the chances that someone's going to read it differently. Honestly I don't see much difference in what they did give and the wheel, it is the same idea of a collection of summarized statements, just in list form.

examples:
Looking to upgrade. -> Need to bump up my specs and get a grip, heh. (then a whole exchange giving details about the dex job that is automatic)

Wanna make a deal with the corpos. -> 'Member the corpo off Dex's shard? Rang her. She's in the area, and we're gonna meet.

Yeah. -> Yeah, gotta do this, but don't you move a damn muscle. Not unless I start that is.

Calm the hell down. Sheesh. -> Calm down, what is this? (not even sure why this one was changed.)

Yep. All by my lonesome. -> Yep just little ol' me. (again why, this one's "summarized" form is longer)

No idea what you're talking about. -> Nope got nothin' to do with him or Militech.

Pay me, and I'll nab your thieves for you. -> Gangoons who ripped you off - I know where to find 'em. They got a bot I want. Give me the funds to buy that bot, you can do what you want with the gang.


Full transparency here, I feel like in the context of the conversations and such these aren't bad. To me these responses were generally expected, but it is still taking the same sort of liberties that the wheels do, and I get a raised eyebrow when the response is not only different but shorter than the selected option. I don't really have any qualms with it other than I'm surprised that the bulk of the conversation isn't selected by the player.
Click to expand...
Yes, I agree, and thank you for providing specific examples.

I'm a bit more bothered by it than you, though. I don't like when the character has a tone that is completely different than I was expecting, and I don't like when dialogue is taken out of my hands.

Jackie is her friend, and she tells him "not to move a damn muscle" as if she's his underling or something. Silly, and that's not how I would roleplay V (of course, we aren't given a choice).

Maybe my V wouldn't want to share information about big jobs with her ripperdoc?

I don't know. It's just becoming very clear that V is not our character, V is basically Geralt, but with a look customized by us and apparently a few more choices to flesh out her personality (since it isn't written into a bunch of books).
 
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EngryEngineer

EngryEngineer

Senior user
#5
Snowflakez said:
Yes, I agree, and thank you for providing specific examples.

I'm a bit more bothered by it than you, though. I don't like when the character has a tone that is completely different than I was expecting, and I don't like when dialogue is taken out of my hands.

Jackie is her friend, and she tells him "not to- move a damn muscle" as if she's his underling or something. Silly, and that's now how I would roleplay V (of course, we aren't given a choice).

Maybe my V wouldn't want to share information about big jobs with her ripperdoc?

I don't know. It's just becoming very clear that V is not our character, V is basically Geralt, but with a look customized by us and apparently a few more choices to flesh out her personality (since it isn't written into a bunch of books).
Click to expand...
I get that, I have some issues with social cues and literalism (I think this is where my obsession with context and semantics comes from), so I've had some miscommunication in nearly any game with selectable dialogue more recent than Fallout 2.

It used to bother me more, but I've accepted that the ship of showing the paragraphs of text you are about to say has sailed and probably isn't coming back. I do agree that there are some strange choices here, V seems to have a pretty solid repoire with the doc, but it is clear the corporate agent is NOT your friend, and being corporate is probably pretty savvy on information use, so I'm not sure why V volunteers her intent to pick up an illicit bot from the gangers that she is about to identify. It wouldn't take that much work to connect those dots and sell V out to whoever those gangers stole the bot from.
 
Matchst1ckk

Matchst1ckk

Forum regular
#7
EngryEngineer said:
I'm not saying it'll be mis-represented, but the gameplay reveal shows it already being significantly shortened which means it is re-interpreted, which increases the chances that someone's going to read it differently. Honestly I don't see much difference in what they did give and the wheel, it is the same idea of a collection of summarized statements, just in list form.

examples:
Looking to upgrade. -> Need to bump up my specs and get a grip, heh. (then a whole exchange giving details about the dex job that is automatic)

Wanna make a deal with the corpos. -> 'Member the corpo off Dex's shard? Rang her. She's in the area, and we're gonna meet.

Yeah. -> Yeah, gotta do this, but don't you move a damn muscle. Not unless I start that is.

Calm the hell down. Sheesh. -> Calm down, what is this? (not even sure why this one was changed.)

Yep. All by my lonesome. -> Yep just little ol' me. (again why, this one's "summarized" form is longer)

No idea what you're talking about. -> Nope got nothin' to do with him or Militech.

Pay me, and I'll nab your thieves for you. -> Gangoons who ripped you off - I know where to find 'em. They got a bot I want. Give me the funds to buy that bot, you can do what you want with the gang.


Full transparency here, I feel like in the context of the conversations and such these aren't bad. To me these responses were generally expected, but it is still taking the same sort of liberties that the wheels do, and I get a raised eyebrow when the response is not only different but shorter than the selected option. I don't really have any qualms with it other than I'm surprised that the bulk of the conversation isn't selected by the player.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I am a little worried that we're going to have some miscommunications along the way. It's nothing that can't be ironed out between now and release, but I know it'll happen.

The problem is that I think the dialogue wheel actually works for the game. Since it appears that the game usually won't stop for these dialogue scenes and that the player can "skip" these altogether (notice at the beginning of the demo you can talk to the old lady before storming the scav joint and at the end when V walks away from the corp agent mid sentence). We're meant to feel involved in this world, and reading long sentences would take away from that.

Just so long as we avoid something like this, I'm happy.

 
Lucian06

Lucian06

Forum regular
#8
How many dialog options are visible at most at a time? More as 4?
CP.jpg


Witcher had a maximum of 7 (Normally 2-4)
TW.jpg
 
Tuco

Tuco

Forum veteran
#10
Can't really say I give a shit about the wheel rather than the list, when it should be more about the number of options offered and how meaningful they are.

That said, one thing that impressed me in the demo (and that I'm hoping will be developed beyond the "smoke and mirrors" tier) was the dynamic contextual system during dialogues (i.e. look at something during the dialogue, get an option to act/comment on that thing).
 
Harthwain

Harthwain

Rookie
#12
From what I have seen there is no functional difference between the dialogue wheel and what we have seen in the gameplay. We get even the same, very limited, amount of choice lines to pick from. This can be attributed to the fact that the longer the line, the more it costs. However, nothing can justify your character say something else than it's written and I have seen this in CP77 a few times already.
 
hallfing2080

hallfing2080

Rookie
#13
Dialogue wheels have gotten out of control. Even the company that helped make it what it is today doesn't know what to do with it. They tend to put all the good and bad choices on opposite sides to make it real simple for people. That's so stupid. Mass Effect 1 had the best dialogue choices for a dialogue wheel game. It all went downhill from there with BioWare wanting to "streamline" and "surprise" players with limited answers and misrepresented choices. I'm really glad CDPR and Bethesda don't give two shits about the dialogue wheels. Although Fallout 4 dialogues were ok it is also a tragic example of how not to present your dialogue choices.
 
atomowyturysta

atomowyturysta

Forum veteran
#14
Dialog wheel is a good idea. Putting "Good" choices on one side and "bad" on the other, is also a good idea. Why? It's fun to actally WANT to make a bad choice :) I like play games as I live my life :) Bad choices FTW :)
 
Snowflakez

Snowflakez

Forum veteran
#15
atomowyturysta said:
Dialog wheel is a good idea. Putting "Good" choices on one side and "bad" on the other, is also a good idea. Why? It's fun to actally WANT to make a bad choice :) I like play games as I live my life :) Bad choices FTW :)
Click to expand...
You can make bad choices without having it clearly spelled out for you, and some of us want the game to be more complex than "paragon" and "renegade" actions.
 
Snowflakez

Snowflakez

Forum veteran
#17
atomowyturysta said:
Hmm... "cyberpunk" and "corporate" actions? :)
Click to expand...
Now you're being silly. :p

How about actions that aren't labeled under any category at all, and are all contextual?

I may not want to kill some poor beggar who drunkenly ambushed me for my cigarettes, but that doesn't mean I don't want to kill a brutal gang member with a history of rapes and murders under his belt who ambushed me in a similar manner.

Good and evil is usually not black and white.
 

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