Introducing Novigrad — the newest GWENT expansion

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The faction's mechanics remind me of the Fable Fortune card game, if anyone here has played it. Also, I doubt that this faction or mechanic will merge well with existing Gwent factions. What we need is primary Witcher characters as deck-Leaders, like it was somewhat in open beta.
 
The main theme with the five Syndicate leader is too cartoony for my taste.

I would have preferred an Eternal Fire faction. Thugs belong to the Witcher Universe, but an entire faction based on them doesn't feel unique. Each and every storyline can have thugs. The persecution of sorceress, mages, alchemists was a stronger theme in the witcher games.

I don't know, I guess they cater to a different demographics.
 
When I play, I do not want to be "crime maker", I want to be "crime fighter". That means, I can play against other players using this expansion cards and enjoy fighting against crime,
I can respect this, to an extent, as it's not unlike my comment above.

However, to its credit, in true Witcher fashion, this expansion poses thoughtful players with the choice of the lesser evil. For those of us who've a mind to a faction's (or deck's) moral character, we must make a hard decision, and pick which of these criminals is less unsavoury, from amongst a thoroughly despicable gallery of rogues, murders, and villains. Despite the repugnance of the criminal underworld, artistically, the Novigrad expansion's theme is very much in the style of The Witcher Series, where we are frequently thrown into uncomfortable association with vile and repulsive representatives of a compelling world's deeply flawed folk.

Despite its splendour, Novigrad is a harsh, ruthless city, where corruption and injustice thrive upon the insatiable lust for coin and power, as its citizens struggle for survival. The merciless Church of the Eternal Fire reigns over the city from high atop Temple Isle, while the assorted gangs squabble for dominion down in the filthy streets, sewers, harbours, and slums. Some of these gangs' bosses are absolute fiends, while others have some -- albeit small -- scraps of decency, though it almost always comes at a price. . . . Rather like Geralt, during his quests in the city during Wild Hunt, if we want to move within Novigrad's streets, we must choose uneasy alliances with dubious characters.
 
The main theme with the five Syndicate leader is too cartoony for my taste.

I would have preferred an Eternal Fire faction. Thugs belong to the Witcher Universe, but an entire faction based on them doesn't feel unique. Each and every storyline can have thugs. The persecution of sorceress, mages, alchemists was a stronger theme in the witcher games.

I don't know, I guess they cater to a different demographics.
I have to mainly agree with that post.
I always envisioned Novigrad a bit like Nuremberg a large free town, which has risen thanks to trade and commerce. I already found it rather weird in Witcher 3 that the power was focused so much on the underground gangs, while the merchants and guilds should be the ones holding the real power, because they are the ones making the money not just redistributing it inside the city.

While giving all those gangs and bandits their own faction might be nice and interesting it feels really weird considering what kind of battles are actually fought in Gwent. On one hand we have the imerpial army of Nilfgaard and on the other hand some thugs or fisstech addicts. That feels just wrong on so many levels.
Of course Novigrad held power, Kovir and Poviss together with Novigrad basically won the second war against Nilfgaard due to all the money they used and the mercenaries they hired. That would actually have been a much better faction working around money, because it would have been a real player.

Moreover, the alliance between the Eternal Fire and the gangs seems weird too. They might be both not good guys but on a completly different level and they are trying to achieve their goals for different reasons. While the thugs don't care if what they do is right or wrong, the Eternal Fire believes to do the right thing. Having both in the same faction as an alliance of gangs feels pretty forced in my opinion.
But as it is a game I can overlook this smaller problem, while the one above still remains for me.




I am disapointed a lot for several reasons. I will name a few:

1) I strongly dislike theme. When I play, I do not want to be "crime maker", I want to be "crime fighter". That means, I can play against other players using this expansion cards and enjoy fighting against crime, but for me myself, new expansion has nothing to offer. I see no counterbalance to crime in this expansion, just support for criminals of all kind. If I would want to play new expansion cards, I would have to join criminal side and I do not like it. I may eventually do it for some contracts and for refreshment from usual play, but theme is one big disappointment for me and if I would play with new cards, it would be despite theme, not because of theme.

2) Pre-order packages are strange. I bought pre-order for Crimson Curse and if I remember it right, it was about 35 euro for 40 kegs. Current pre-order is just official price for 15 kegs (about 17 euro) which can be bought anytime and only what makes it feeling as pre-order is extra card skin. My long time experience with MtG and HS is, that pre-orders offer special price, just like Crimson Curse did. Pre-order for official price and extra card skin does not feel like pre-order to me and this time, I will pass this offer.

3) Frequency between releasing new expansions and gathering reward points for unlocking leaders trees is unbalanced and I am falling behind even faster than before, because there was longer period between Thronebreaker and Crimson Curse, than is between Crimson Curse and Syndicate. I doubt, if I would have even been able to catch up lack of reward points if I would play 4 hours every day. I would very much like to either increase frequency of gaining reward points or decreasing frequency of releasing expansions with their reward trees.

4) I very much appreciated, when new cards for Crimson Curse have been posted in this forum and people could see them there. Shifting card galery to facebook is big minus for me, despite this is probably more subjective matter than other points above. I would very much appreciate if cards would have been posted in forum as well.
EDIT: In the meantime, cards have been posted in forum too and I very much appreciate it. Thank you! This point 4) is now "solved" and is not valid anymore.

There are few more points which I do not like about new expansion (at example why do you bother making 4-power, 4 damage on deploy card for 9 provisions, when the first thing, you will do after one month from release will probably be its increasing of provisions to 10), but it becomes more and more subjective and is not so important to me like 4 other points above, so I will end list here.

I am sorry, but I am not excited about new expansion at all, I am rather worried about future of Gwent. :(

While I understand your problem, I'd like to ask, which of the other factions or their leaders aren't thugs more or less. Only because they dress in fancy robes and have honourable titles their evil deeds might not be crimes, but aren't less evil either.

The only ones I'd consider rather good would be Meve, Jan Calveit, Brouver and Dana which doesn't leave much choice, in particular in a game centered around battles, which means killing enemies.
 
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I bet Kovir will be added as a whole set of dual faction cards with two faction specific leaders: Esterad for Sindicate (merchant synergies) and Tankred for NR (mage synergies).
 
While I understand your problem, I'd like to ask, which of the other factions or their leaders aren't thugs more or less. Only because they dress in fancy robes and have honourable titles their evil deeds might not be crimes, but aren't less evil either.

The only ones I'd consider rather good would be Meve, Jan Calveit, Brouver and Dana which doesn't leave much choice, in particular in a game centered around battles, which means killing enemies.

My favourite faction is Scoia'tael and my favourite leader is Brouver Hoog. When I was playing Thronebreaker, I was really identifying myself with him. I very much like his sense for neutrality, live and let live approach, careful evaluation of matters without making hasty decisions, sense for order and discipline, systematic approach backed up by principles, respect to tradition and history ... He appears to be from old world, where logic was applied before emotions.

There are big differencies between reasons for killing. Killing in self-defense, killing because of being careless, killing because of wanting possessions of killed man ... There is lots of big differencies in game like that and despite some may see it all the way same as battles, where are killed enemies, I distinguish significant differencies there. In Thronebreaker, my approach was really visible in game as I had really no chance to keep Black Rayla with me, because my actions were against her conviction.
 
Hmmm. I trust that CDPR has thought this through, and that this faction will bring something new and unique to the game. I can understand why some people are a little skeptical, but IMO the developers have proven to be quite capable and clever in hindsight. I have been frustrated by a few things along the way, since the beta, but overall these guys have delivered the best digital card game on the market. The quality and production values are high, strategy is deep yet approachable, player progression is excellent, and the community is great. After taking a break and a step back recently, I have more of an appreciation for the bigger picture. Can't please everyone.

That said, I'm really looking forward to my boy Dijkstra, and favorite sorceress Philippa, sometime down the line. :)
Their absence continues to be felt.
 
Watching the recording of the stream on Youtube, and the first thing I thought was "oh no, a new mechanic". The second thing was "the first dual-faction card they reveal is a gold card for Skellige that basically gives a unit on the side god mode (can't take any damage) for 10 prov/6 str - that will raise even more hate against SK"

Really, that wasn't a good move. All in all, it seems more like the old mistake, so many developers do: Forget about bugfixing and balancing, instead just add new content to cover the flaws. That will work for a short while, but not on the long run.

I will certainly play the new faction, and maybe my judgement changes after that. But currently I'm not convinced.
 
I'm also very surprised by the expansion thematic. I wasn't hoping for Zerrikania due to low number of named characters (2 in the books, and one in witcher 1, perhaps some more in the other games but surely not enough for a full fledged faction).

The thing that make me really doubt is well....Gwent is supposed to be a game where two faction wage war against each other. That was one of the main dev mantra during Homecoming - giving the player the impression of a clash between armies. Even the faction that everybody call Scotael is called Elder Races in the game, and most of their units are not SC guerillos, but regular units from Mahakam and Dol Blathana,

If I understood well that idea is already buried - the gold cards-characters are game deciding compare to bronze-regiments. But this expansion gives me a really MtG feeling.

I don't want to criticate while we saw so few from the new expansion, but I would really prefer to see a Novigrad-Kovir-Powiss faction full of mercenaries (which they are famous for, and that would also work with the coins mechanic) instead of 'armies' of beggars, butchers and fisstech addicts.
 

rrc

Forum veteran
I am disapointed a lot for several reasons. I will name a few:

1) I strongly dislike theme. When I play, I do not want to be "crime maker", I want to be "crime fighter". That means, I can play against other players using this expansion cards and enjoy fighting against crime, but for me myself, new expansion has nothing to offer. I see no counterbalance to crime in this expansion, just support for criminals of all kind. If I would want to play new expansion cards, I would have to join criminal side and I do not like it. I may eventually do it for some contracts and for refreshment from usual play, but theme is one big disappointment for me and if I would play with new cards, it would be despite theme, not because of theme.

2) Pre-order packages are strange. I bought pre-order for Crimson Curse and if I remember it right, it was about 35 euro for 40 kegs. Current pre-order is just official price for 15 kegs (about 17 euro) which can be bought anytime and only what makes it feeling as pre-order is extra card skin. My long time experience with MtG and HS is, that pre-orders offer special price, just like Crimson Curse did. Pre-order for official price and extra card skin does not feel like pre-order to me and this time, I will pass this offer.

3) Frequency between releasing new expansions and gathering reward points for unlocking leaders trees is unbalanced and I am falling behind even faster than before, because there was longer period between Thronebreaker and Crimson Curse, than is between Crimson Curse and Syndicate. I doubt, if I would have even been able to catch up lack of reward points if I would play 4 hours every day. I would very much like to either increase frequency of gaining reward points or decreasing frequency of releasing expansions with their reward trees.

4) I very much appreciated, when new cards for Crimson Curse have been posted in this forum and people could see them there. Shifting card galery to facebook is big minus for me, despite this is probably more subjective matter than other points above. I would very much appreciate if cards would have been posted in forum as well.
EDIT: In the meantime, cards have been posted in forum too and I very much appreciate it. Thank you! This point 4) is now "solved" and is not valid anymore.

There are few more points which I do not like about new expansion (at example why do you bother making 4-power, 4 damage on deploy card for 9 provisions, when the first thing, you will do after one month from release will probably be its increasing of provisions to 10), but it becomes more and more subjective and is not so important to me like 4 other points above, so I will end list here.

I am sorry, but I am not excited about new expansion at all, I am rather worried about future of Gwent. :(
Dear @Charles5pencer ,
While I respect your preference, I think a game should offer every type of choices people may want. Having a faction which is completely criminal and cut-throats makes sense as the world (real or the game world) have such underground organizations. Even the so-called righteous kings and queens are jerks if you get to know who they truly are. But I understand that this expansion doesn't offer anything for you as you may not want to play this faction, but as you yourself said imagine playing against these criminals and beat the hell out of them with your righteous leader; that should be great, right? Every RPG offers choices, some are righteous and some or neither-here-nor-there and some options are pure evil (again, what is the definition of evil anyway?) Even HoS expansion of W3 is about pure evil jerk and the option for us players is to either collude with him or beat his ass.

And I agree with your other points. And about your point about the 9P-4P-4D card, it may not happen. It may remain as it. At this time we don't know if this new faction will also be CDPR's favorite faction along with SK. If so, it may remain as it is, otherwise, it may be nerfed a bit as you mentioned. Only time will tell.
 
I can see Kovir joining the Sindicate, or forming its own faction. Mhm, given Esterad likes taxing stuff, I would love to see him as leader with passive "tax" ability: every three coins earned by the opponent one would be seized by Esterad.
 
@Charles5pencer

1) That's very subjective. There's many people who like or don't mind playing these factions. I'd also add that the world of Witcher is a dark sombre fantasy where it's made fairly clear that there aren't any moral factions. The only one not immoral would be the monsters, since they don't claim to morality.
That said, if you want to combat crime - you're in luck. There'll be plenty of criminal foes to defeat in the coming decks :)
2) I feel you there. I worry about that too, but (I hope) there's clever* people working on this and they'll experiment and adapt and end up with something that works. Not all games have to be HS after all.
3) I feel for you on this as well but I don't think that's right. I've been struggling to do all the seasonal trees and get the points for the next season. This season I've only done the end reward of the tree, I don't think I'll be able to get the scrolls nevermind the entire thing.
However I did manage to get at least that end reward and that costs more than the leaders. The crimson leaders cost 10 points a piece, 50 in total. That's really not that much and even less of a problem assuming you can pick one leader and experiment with a deck for them and get points as you go.

*And next expansion there'll be Cleaver People, get it?
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My main thought when reading the annoucement was regarding the picture at the top of it.
Who is this this woman in the group of five and why is Dijkstra not part of the group.
I do think it's clever to actively add ol' Hemmel to the mix and I don't mind them adding a new character as well
(whoever she may be) but if we're playing the criminal lords of novigrad, then I want to play as Dijkstra.
And I will be very dissapointed if it turns out that instead of getting Dijkstra whose character I like and care about I get some placeholder whom I don't know or care about.
 
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Now I wonder how often new expansions come out...

I am pretty new to the game, just throughout my second month on it, and I am far from having the whole collection... and now a new expansion comes, with new cards to craft (or buy) and new mechanics to learn and get used to... One of the reasons that made me move to Gwent, besides of course I enjoy playing it, is that it allowed me to have a soft entry joining a game during its childhood. And suddenly things seem to happen very quickly now, as if the devs wanted to meet their competitors asap. I am certainly not sure that I can afford this rate.

Anyway, let´s wait until the dust settles to have a clear estimation of damages :)
 
@dunadan5 I believe you misunderstand me on most of my points and misinterpreted what I meant with them.

That's very subjective.
Really? What a surprise! Did you notice, that I was writing my reasons why I do not like new expansion? It was nowhere near to statements that new exapansion is objectively bad because of immorality reasons. I was just explaining why I am very disappointed with it and why it is rather repulsive, than attractive to me. I was not hinting in any way in my post about making objective standpoint from which expansion theme is objectively bad. I was only giving my feedback, why I do not like new expansion. At example usage of words like "like/dislike" directs by definition to subjectivity, while statements using words like "good/bad" rather direct towards objectivity. Of course, it is possible to use manipulative techniques, where subjective statement is falsely presented as objective one, but I am pretty confident, I did not claim anywhere in my post that new expansion is objectively bad or that my statements are meant from global objectivity point.
There's many people who like or don't mind playing these factions.
I did not mention other people in my post, I was not claiming to represent anybody else than me, I was expressing only myself and my reasons why I dislike new expansion.

Not all games have to be HS after all.
That really goes without need to say. I came here from HS, which I stopped playing when I started playing Gwent. I dislike many things on HS, which I found out Gwent to do much better (not going to mention list right here, right now). I was only pointing out "business standards" present in "Gwent's older brothers". I did it for simplicity, because comparison typically saves lots of effort to explain something. Nonehtless, I can do it the hard way and try to explain purpose of pre-release sale and why it is typically done the way it is typically done, without using comparison of other games, it will just take much more words from me. In general, pre-release is way to "ensure" some business income without presenting full product yet. In other words, it means, that buyer is going into some uncertainity, he is taking risk, that final product, which is at the moment unknown yet, will not be fully to his image/liking. That is sphere, where customer increases his uncertainity, while producer decreases his uncertainity. Customer is in risk of buying product, which he may not like. Producer is getting advantage of having some income assured even if in the end, final product will be considered as bad one and after release, it will be unsuccessful and will generate much less income, than expected. In case, where pre-release price of product is same like price of product after release, there is no "rational reason" (however there are still present "emotional reasons", which are representing values like trust, empathy, will to support etc), why to buy pre-release pack, because you can buy same amount of kegs anytime later, if you wish so. At day of release, one month later, two months later, one year later, price "will be" all the time same. That means, same price for pre-release like for release product is presenting no "rational" advantage for customer. From that equation above, where customer is increasing his uncertainity for better price and producer decreasing his uncertainity for assured income, the left side of equation is nullified (or better said, customer increases his uncertainity without getting better price for it) and there is valid only right side. I one more time mention, that I talk about "rational reasons", while vanity products I do count among "emotional reasons". You see? It took much more effort from me in place, where I could make just a simple comparison and that is why comparisons are used in conversation.

The crimson leaders cost 10 points a piece, 50 in total. That's really not that much
I have impression, you misunderstood me even on this point. I agree, there should be no problem with unlocking leaders. My post was specifically mentioning leader reward trees, which for Thronebreaker means reward tree of Eldain, Gernichora, Queen Meve, Ardal aep Dahy and Arnjolf the Patricide. For Crimson Curse, that means reward trees of Dana Meadbh, Dettlaff, Queen Calanthe, Anna Henrieta and Svalblod. Unlocking those leaders is relatively easy, but completing their all reward trees? Good luck with it. I really wonder if there is in Gwent currently present anybody, who will up to the release date of Syndicate expansion have unlocked all leader trees for basic leaders, Thronebreaker leaders and Crimson Curse leaders. Because if you do not have those leader trees completed, you are going into next expansion with certain "deficit", which is potentially snowballing into bigger and bigger one. I doubt, there is even reasonable theoretical chance to achieve that and this was the reason, why I would wish to increase reward points generation frequency or decrease expansions release frequency.
 
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It would be really cool if one of the cards is Dijkstra, but using the false identity that he assumed in Novigrad.
I'm guessing Dijkstra won't be a part of the expansion at all. He's such a prominent character; If they had him, they'd have shown him.
The only thing that makes sense to me is that they're saving D for something else in the future.
 
Two words:

Under.

Whelming.


That's how I felt last night after the stream. "I'm sick of knights" I think was the Slama quote some time ago. So let's introduce thugs and beggars and shopkeepers and whatnot. Just silly. There was a vast world to scoop (Poviss and Kovir is a no brainer) from the Witcher Universe, but we had to go with NOVIGRAD (a city) as a new competitive faction out there. Novigrad. On his own.


Under.

Whelming.
 
Two words:

Under.

Whelming.

Underwhelming is one word, though. Sorry, couldn't resist.

Anyhow, you are disappointed about the "theme" of the expansion, but there is also the gameplay and the new Crown mechanic looks pretty cool.
 
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