Is TW3 getting downgraded for the sake of consoles?

[prince_of_nothing]

These fears seem much ado about nothing, although I understand why PC gamers would be worried given that recently released hyped to oblivion games like Watch Dogs ended up being not only downgraded, but very un-optimized on PC.. But CDPR isn't Ubishit, and CDPR has not only very strong roots as PC developers, they also clearly do not want their artistic vision to be compromised which is why the game is being released on current gen consoles only. If it were being released on last gen consoles, then yeah, that would be worrisome indeed.

While I think it's ridiculous to state that PC gamers are "entitled" to better graphics than the consoles, I think CDPR have a professional obligation to make sure that each of the platforms' capabilities are fully exploited, and since the PC is naturally the most powerful and capable of the platforms, it should have a higher graphical ceiling. With the inclusion of the Ultra setting, I'd says that's proof of CDPR taking into account the PC's greater capabilities.

Likely nothing is going to satisfy elitist PC gamers though other than CDPR abandoning consoles completely, as they view consoles as a threat to PC gaming and underestimate the capabilities of the current gen consoles. The current gen consoles are definitely a nice step up from last gen, which were severely crippled by mediocre memory capacities. Since both the Xbox One and PS4 come furnished with 8GB of memory (and can use GPGPU), asset quality and World complexity should be high quality all around..

Hair and fur physics should be intact on the console versions, as NVidia's hairworks uses DirectCompute and not PhysX. Since cloth physics on the other hand uses PhysX, it will likely be scaled back on the consoles. By scaled back, I mean it will likely be limited only to major characters and the complexity will be simpler than what you can find on the PC version since it will be running on the CPU..

 

[Thebull94]

These fears seem much ado about nothing, although I understand why PC gamers would be worried given that recently released hyped to oblivion games like Watch Dogs ended up being not only downgraded, but very un-optimized on PC.. But CDPR isn't Ubishit, and CDPR has not only very strong roots as PC developers, they also clearly do not want their artistic vision to be compromised which is why the game is being released on current gen consoles only. If it were being released on last gen consoles, then yeah, that would be worrisome indeed.

While I think it's ridiculous to state that PC gamers are "entitled" to better graphics than the consoles, I think CDPR have a professional obligation to make sure that each of the platforms' capabilities are fully exploited, and since the PC is naturally the most powerful and capable of the platforms, it should have a higher graphical ceiling. With the inclusion of the Ultra setting, I'd says that's proof of CDPR taking into account the PC's greater capabilities.

Likely nothing is going to satisfy elitist PC gamers though other than CDPR abandoning consoles completely, as they view consoles as a threat to PC gaming and underestimate the capabilities of the current gen consoles. The current gen consoles are definitely a nice step up from last gen, which were severely crippled by mediocre memory capacities. Since both the Xbox One and PS4 come furnished with 8GB of memory (and can use GPGPU), asset quality and World complexity should be high quality all around..

Hair and fur physics should be intact on the console versions, as NVidia's hairworks uses DirectCompute and not PhysX. Since cloth physics on the other hand uses PhysX, it will likely be scaled back on the consoles. By scaled back, I mean it will likely be limited only to major characters and the complexity will be simpler than what you can find on the PC version since it will be running on the CPU..

100% agree. It is quite sad really, considering how condescending and pretentious they seem, it makes me wonder why gamers in general let them get away with disrespecting other valid gaming alternatives.

Anyway, on topic this game will look sweet.

 

[Garrison72]

These fears seem much ado about nothing, although I understand why PC gamers would be worried given that recently released hyped to oblivion games like Watch Dogs ended up being not only downgraded, but very un-optimized on PC.. But CDPR isn't Ubishit, and CDPR has not only very strong roots as PC developers, they also clearly do not want their artistic vision to be compromised which is why the game is being released on current gen consoles only. If it were being released on last gen consoles, then yeah, that would be worrisome indeed.

While I think it's ridiculous to state that PC gamers are "entitled" to better graphics than the consoles, I think CDPR have a professional obligation to make sure that each of the platforms' capabilities are fully exploited, and since the PC is naturally the most powerful and capable of the platforms, it should have a higher graphical ceiling. With the inclusion of the Ultra setting, I'd says that's proof of CDPR taking into account the PC's greater capabilities.

Likely nothing is going to satisfy elitist PC gamers though other than CDPR abandoning consoles completely, as they view consoles as a threat to PC gaming and underestimate the capabilities of the current gen consoles. The current gen consoles are definitely a nice step up from last gen, which were severely crippled by mediocre memory capacities. Since both the Xbox One and PS4 come furnished with 8GB of memory (and can use GPGPU), asset quality and World complexity should be high quality all around..

Hair and fur physics should be intact on the console versions, as NVidia's hairworks uses DirectCompute and not PhysX. Since cloth physics on the other hand uses PhysX, it will likely be scaled back on the consoles. By scaled back, I mean it will likely be limited only to major characters and the complexity will be simpler than what you can find on the PC version since it will be running on the CPU..

Well then let me be the first to congratulate MS and Sony for being the vanguard of technical hardware innovation. 8 gigs of memory...revolutionary. But all that technical wonder aside, hardly any of us PC elitists are calling for better visuals in a Witcher game. I realized this would never be an issue once I fired up TW1 back in 2009.

 

[Thebull94]

Well then let me be the first to congratulate MS and Sony for being the vanguard of technical hardware innovation. 8 gigs of memory...revolutionary. But all that technical wonder aside, hardly any of us PC elitists are calling for better visuals in a Witcher game. I realized this would never be an issue once I fired up TW1 back in 2009.

When did he use the word 'revolutionary'? I did skim through his rather large post, but I must have missed it. Or you made the term up in an attempts at discrediting his post. Which is it?

 

[GuyNwah]

Moderator: Stop sniping now. It's not tolerated on this forum, and members who persist in it will be removed if that is what it takes to maintain decency and order.

 

[prince_of_nothing]

Well then let me be the first to congratulate MS and Sony for being the vanguard of technical hardware innovation. 8 gigs of memory...revolutionary. But all that technical wonder aside, hardly any of us PC elitists are calling for better visuals in a Witcher game. I realized this would never be an issue once I fired up TW1 back in 2009.

I never said anything about 8GB of memory being revolutionary, or even amazing. My point in talking about the 8GB of memory was to show that it's a MASSIVE leap over the last generation....and it is. Going from 512MB to 8GB is a huge upgrade..

Having 8GB of memory allows CDPR to make the Witcher 3 completely seamless on both consoles, something which would likely not be possible on last gen without some serious compromises. Also, the PS4 and Xbox One use HUMA, so their memory architecture is unified which makes it more efficient than the discrete memory architecture found on the PC. More efficient, but not necessarily better overall as discrete memory has advantages as well..

At any rate, the Witcher 3 being multiplatform next gen only is both good for CDPR, and good for gaming in general..

 

[GuyNwah]

The actual "hUMA" capability of the AMD processors in the consoles is unclear and disputed. They are still a huge advance over the last generation of consoles, especially in places where it counts: memory capacity and GPU capability. Enough of an advance that the assumption "in order to get the same content on the consoles, we have to hold back on the content" is no longer valid.

 

[sidspyker]

First AMD said consoles have hUMA, then they said that's not correct no hUMA so it's all a bit elusive. Letting aside what they "can" do with graphics if they targeted extremely high end PCs(AKA nobody gets to play the game) there isn't much that is 'holding back' games at present. That may(and will) very well change in the next 2 or 3 years but for now PS4/XB1 provide a good baseline where they decide what all features can be put in the game.

TL;dr- Consoles in their present state are not holding back anything of value unless you only want GTX Titan users to be able to run the game.

 

[mavowar]

My list of why PC gaming is better than Console Gaming. While it is opinionated I did my best to stay fact based as possible. I also extend an olive branch to console gamers to make a list likewise and post.

1. Mouse and keyboard support
Well, duh. Console users who have grown up with a controller in hand might argue, but there's still no better way of playing just about any game in any genre – not just shooters – than the combination of keyboard and mouse. It just works, offering orders of magnitude more precision and speed than fiddly analogue sticks.

2. High screen resolutions
While Microsoft and Sony scream about 'true HD' in their games – but in many cases don't actually deliver it – the PC has been happily running games at 1080p and above forever and a day. In fact, the near-HD default res of 720p is very early 2000's era ; even a low to medium rig can handle 1080p with a nice set of graphical settings clicked on!!!!

3. Free mods
PC gamers have been coding mods (modifications) such as add-ons, total conversions, unofficial levels and all manner of other gubbins for… well, pretty much forever. And then distributing it for free, for the sheer love of it.

4. Upgradeable hardware
With the aforementioned higher resolutions and textures, chances are a new PC game already looks better than its console counterpart right now. But even if you can't run it with all the visuals tweaked to the max, processor and graphic cards prices drop so quickly that it's hardly bank-breaking to refit your rig in a year or so, for better graphics and more speed.

5. Cheaper games
Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo's licensing and publishing costs inevitably drive up the cost of every single game released, and even pre-owned games tend to be far pricier than the PC equivalent.

6. You're not tied to one online service
Imagine not having to rely on a single, central server such as Xbox Live or PlayStation Network whenever you go online. Imagine not having to suffer downtimes, silly licensing agreements, or daft console-restricting DRM. Oh wait… that's the PC online, isn't it?

7. No extra dosh needed for playing online
Both Xbox and Sony charge extra to access the NET!!!!

8. Unlimited storage space/faster storage
The Xbox One The PlayStation 4 have to struggle with turgid Blu-ray access and enforced installs. PC games, meanwhile, just sit happily on the potentially unlimited storage space of your hard drive. Easy.

9. Save game hacking
Like modders, PC gamers are rabidly enthusiastic about pulling apart save games and data files, fiddling therein, and finding ingenious ways to cheat or fix corrupted files. Try doing that with your Wii.

10. Unofficial fixes for older games
PC games such as Vampire: The Masquerade often get unofficial, free, support long after publishers have gone kaput and official support is abandoned, thanks to the tireless efforts of their fans. Bug fixes, enhancements, new hardware support – it's all there.

11. Abandonware
The geek term for 'old games which you can't buy any more'. There are a huge number of classic PC titles out there from years gone by, and many thousands are available to download, legally, for free.

12. PC gamers tend to be older and more mature as you need money to build a decent rig. That leaves all the 12 year olds out who are GODs and all of whom have banged your mom ,even if she is dead because you know that's cool when your 12 I guess.....

Agree or Disagree I care not. I grew up on Consoles and know there worth ,but I also started PC gaming a few years after my first Console(Atari 2600). My first PC was a Commodore 64 Load"*",8,1 I also remember the old Bulletin Board System(early internet) and even then as a 7 year old child I knew PC game was vastly superior. For surprise most of the same reason that still apply today.

I feel it is the Dev responsibility to use each platform, to the best of it's abilities anything less is a disservice to any gamer be it a console,PC, or even Mobile. I am watching mobile with a keen eye lately. It really has an opportunity to become something special. i really like Nvidia's push into Hand Helds and Mobile gaming. The Nvidia Grid System has the potential to be a real game changer but as with all things time will tell.

As a reminder this is my outlook(very fact based) only agree or not is cool with me, I welcome a rebuttal from console users as long as it is respectful and not flamebait. Please use facts as much as possible. Thank you and have a great day-

Also, while I do not own a console at the moment If I did buy one I would lean towards the Xbox One. I like it's multi-Media set up/ I also tend to like Microsoft exclusives more so than Sony. That said I also wish there was no such thing as Exclusives. I understand the business side of having exclusives though. So I suppose they are a necessary evil for a platform to survive/be successful etc.....

 

[Mr. Barvo]

First AMD said consoles have hUMA, then they said that's not correct no hUMA so it's all a bit elusive. Letting aside what they "can" do with graphics if they targeted extremely high end PCs(AKA nobody gets to play the game) there isn't much that is 'holding back' games at present. That may(and will) very well change in the next 2 or 3 years but for now PS4/XB1 provide a good baseline where they decide what all features can be put in the game.

TL;dr- Consoles in their present state are not holding back anything of value unless you only want GTX Titan users to be able to run the game.

It's not entirely true that nobody gets to play the game if it where only playable on high/mid end computers. Recent news are stating that pc gamers spend more and more money on high end components: http://jonpeddie.com/publications/pc_gaming_hardware_market_report/

"We continue to see a shift in casual console customers moving to mobile. While this is also occurring in the lower end PC gaming world, more money is being directed to mid and high range PC builds and upgrades by gamers. Committed PC gamers are generally not interested in pure content consumption platforms. They are power users and pay thousands for the ability to play games at very high settings and then do business, video/photo editing, content creation and other tasks with maximum horsepower at their disposal in a desktop ergonomic environment.”

Though it's not necessary to just make it to those people. It isn't that hard to make a game run on low end PC's, which is in parity with the consoles and therefore make it for the consoles as well. So for now and a couple years ahead they won't hold back graphics, as long as the devs does make use of high and mid en PC's. But of course this is just about graphics. Console ports brings much more trubble to PC's, like UI, controlls and much more like if FOV slider fails to appear.

 

[sidspyker]

I don't think you understood what I meant to say, there's nothing meaningful I can think of at the moment which could be implemented specifically on PCs which the consoles would not be able to run(maybe SVOGI), atleast for now. What I mean was, if the objective it to chase some meaningless tech that adds nothing of value only to cram your game full of the NEWEST TECHNOLOGY then you should probably aim for Titans and Titan-Z, a meaningless pursuit.

One of the key pieces of tech that I had hoped TW3 would use was PBShading, and after seeing it in the swamp demo and reading an interview confirmed it's used in the game I can say I'm quite happy.

This is purely from a technological perspective, not PC vs consoles or pros and cons I'm referring to.

 

[Mr. Barvo]

Well, what i was saying was that many people buy better hardware, alltough there isn't much to max it.

Whats meaningfull or not is a rather subjective question. Of course you can turn upp the textures to max quality on a good PC, but textures are more about how they are designed and not that much which resulution they are running on (to an extent).

Graphics are also a lot about software. But isn't it mind-blowing what you could create and play on a PC several times faster than consoles? (And no! You don't need a Titan Z for that) Or maybe thats just me wishing for better eye candy.

But anyway this game is going to be awesome

 

[sidspyker]

I'm afraid you and I are talking about completely different things

 

[Bellator Pius Gratus]

Have a friend who was invited to test Watch Dogs on console, and it was lagging so much it was embarrasing. His words. If I remember correctly this was before pushing the release date to 2014.

Oh well, I know nothing of graphics, and consider atmosphere and writing just as important, but I do love CDPR, and consider them the best devs in the business. And I trust them. They aren't cutting corners.

That said, I know how I feel about the difference between Witcher 1 and Witcher 2.

And I'm not talking about graphics, but mouse and keyboard vs. controller. Controllers weren't made with little me in mind, and even if I grew up playing Nes,Snes and Sega, and have completed several xbox titles with friends, I always opt for mouse and keyboard. I feel I have better control with mouse and keyboard. My moves and playstyle don't look as ridiculous, limited or...half-assed, as it does when you put a controller in my hands.

So I wonder how mouse and keyboard players will experience Witcher 3? As long as I get full control, mapping controls to my liking(and not locking certain keys as some devs do) and preferred choice I am happy. Not calling it downgrade, but to me it felt like inventory and anything related to managing items or brewing potions in Witcher 2 was made with consoles in mind. Grid system is back for Witcher 3, yes(thank you devs!), but will it be like the good old days? : I keep watching E3 footage and they play with controller, 'cycling' between items. I want to se some Witcher 3 mouse and keyboard footage dammit! ^_^ Love you devs! :lol:

EDIT: Obviously, I trust that whatever we choose to play the game with, it will be to our satisfaction and not feel downgraded in any way. ^_^

 

[Elegast7]

Why is this post not deleted mods? It is seeking to provoke arguments with the title "Why PC is better than console", and I was recently banned for a similar reason (despite me trying to end the argument, I still got the brunt of it...) yet this man has been warned and continues to go off topic with controversial matters..... He also has called me an idiot etc, so really what are people like me to do where whenever we question him we get our post deleted / banned (like me) yet he gets away with making these clear flame bait posts, and personal insults. So really. What is going on? I mean he is making absurd claims, one of which is that 'PC gamers are more mature because they can build a PC' and passing it off as fact? Why is he not being dealt with?

I don't think his post was to provoke arguments, he said multiple times it's his opinion and he's cool with people not agreeing with him.
Sounds like it's a bit personal for you, isn't it?

 

[GuyNwah]

Moderator: Posts have been deleted. "Stop violating forum rules" is not an invitation to enter into a public dispute and continue to do what you were told violates forum rules.

 

[Glaroug.531]

When I saw this thread I thought to myself, "Glaroug, the Gameboy is the greatest console every made :yes "

And then I thoguht, "Glaroug, what if instead of slaying monsters, Geralt caught them and put them in his pocket? What is Geralt was not a Master Monster Slayer, but rather a Master Monster Catcher?" Hmmm......Already we have a new upcoming witcher with ASH hair.......

You want this CDPR :yes

 

[jediknight16]

I hope it's not gonna have anything in common with Watch Dogs or Ubisoft. And for what I know CDPR has nothing like Ubisoft, it's a whole different company. The witcher is developped on pc AND for pc gamers, and will be ported on consoles, not the opposite. The developpers already said many times the game would look much better on high-end pc than console, as always. That's enough for me

 

[Scholdarr]

I hope it's not gonna have anything in common with Watch Dogs or Ubisoft. And for what I know CDPR has nothing like Ubisoft, it's a whole different company. The witcher is developped on pc AND for pc gamers, and will be ported on consoles, not the opposite. The developpers already said many times the game would look much better on high-end pc than console, as always. That's enough for me

Actually porting has little to do with visuals. But anyway, not important.

 

[MOLEMAN1980]

I'm not going to complain because i'm still rockin the xbox360 version OF WITCHER2 as well as PC.
I think they did a fantastic job on both systems and i like the low lighting on the xbox360 version.
You get textures pop in and out sometimes on xbox360 and little bugs but it's still pretty solid with the limitations of the xbox360 console.
I think the new consoles have a lot to offer,but it's up to CDPR to incorprate the lenix and os base software into the Witcher 3,whether it's Mantel or Dx11.