Just started Fallout 4, What CP could have learned

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In what way is Fallout 4 a better game than CP2077? I don't understand how anyone who has played CP2077 can make this statement.
I feel the same way but in reverse. I don't see how anyone who has played CP2077 can say it's better than 90% of games.

I've been writing these things out countless times here and it's gotten really old at this point and there are plenty of youtube videos that do an amazing job of breaking this down but I'll give a few of the game breaking flaws of CP2077 that stick out most for me off the top of my head.
  1. CP2077 has probably the worst AI I've ever seen in a AAA game which makes playing the "game" a horrible experience and while I don't remember being impressed with Fallout 4 AI, I don't remember it being so bad that it was akin to a perpetual form of electric shock torture never allowing any hope of being immersed in the game world.
  2. The entire CP2077 experience outside of the torrent of dialog telling me a story and pretending like I have a part in it consists of "Go here, kill this." At least in Fallout 4 (*spit*) there were other things you could do like the base building.
  3. If CP2077 were a person, it would be an escaped mental patient who suffers from schizophrenia and pathological lying. It's like a patchwork of multiple incomplete games that were never fleshed out stitched together. The game has no idea what it wants to be or what it was supposed to be and spends the majority of it's existence doing it's best to convince the player that it's something it obviously isn't. I'm all for appreciating something for what it is but there isn't much to CP2077 worth appreciating.
  4. One of the type of games CP2077 tries to be is a looter shooter, dumping a constant flow of the same boring guns on you in different colors of rarity. I have Pistol X and it does 95 DPS with 15% chance to Crit. I kill 5000 people, now I have 5000 Gun X with 5000 variations of different percentages. So boring.
  5. The one thing about CP2077 that almost everyone agrees is masterful, the construction of Night City...they did nothing to make it feel alive. It's all dead, heartless and soulless which is a good description of the game in general.
Like you with how you feel about me reluctantly saying Fallout 4 is better than CP2077, I don't really understand how someone could have played games before and then think CP2077 is a good game by any standard except maybe compared to ET on Atari. If you want a better and more fleshed out explanation of how this game fails so hard I'll share a few video which I think does a great job of showing this and you can watch at your own risk.

 
Both games suffer from creating a fake urgency in the beginning. IMHO it would be better for an open world game to start slower. For the CP77 story I already made a suggestion for a tweak so it would become more compatible with an open world.
After the heist, the player should only get the information, that the chip can't be removed easily. But the story should wait till the end before telling the player, that the chip is killing him/her. This way, the player CAN do main-quest only, without feeling FORCED to do main-quest only
 
Repeating myself...
The saving grace for Bethesda badly written extrinsic player motivation in regards to the main quest, is that it's so boring you'll forget about it. And find your fun in exploring a world with side quests that are often more fun. While "saddly" with Cyberpunk 2077 the extrinsic motivation pushed by the game actually works.

All in all though, i think comparing the writing of Bethesda and CDPR is like comparing your Saturday comic strip with Steven King or some other author of bigger note. That's not saying that your saturday morning comic strip can't be fun, but there's quite the difference.

Bethesda is delivering a great modding basis. And gives you enough blandness to form your own idea of your character to let people feel as if they're making decisions (Joining the Dark Brotherhood and being an evil badass, while in actuality it doesn't matter for the main quest). And at least lately they're looking a bit more into palyers joining different factions which somewhat impact the quests (Skyrim Vampire DLC, Fallout 4 main quest).
And yeah, i still think they're fun despite all flaws.
 
Yeah cause having your kid stolen is the perfect time to start growing crops.

It's just as idiotic.
Almost all games which are open world have this, I think a few manage it, like divinity. But any game that gives the impression of urgency need to be extremely linear like the Last of us part 1.

But almost all other games you will find these silly things. And as someone mentioned, surely buying a new car is exactly your first thought when you have weeks left to live.
 
@Gillian_Seed I don't need a video to tell me why a game I like is bad, I wanted you to explain why Fallout 4 is better than CP2077 which you failed to do.

1. Both CP2077 and Fallout 4 don't really have much of an AI, but CP2077 does a better job with it's NPCs at least trying to do basic actions. It's more a case of the player character being loaded with ways to kill them and them not really having much to compete with us. Fallout 4 is completely barebones in terms of NPCs doing things.

2. CP2077 absolutely has massive variety in both it's main and side quests, which Fallout 4 doesn't. The "Go here, kill this" is part of the GIGs and even they have more variety than what Fallout 4 has.

3. ????

4. The game most definitely doesn't try to be a looter shooter. It has loot which you're not forced to loot. It has unique loot as well, but you can pretty much play the game with whatever gun you enjoy, since most of them can be easily upgraded. Looting every ashtray and every gun is up to you. Destiny 2 is a looter shooter in which the loot hunt is what the core game is about. In CP2077 the loot is a form of progression, but it is in no way overbearing. I barely loot anything, I don't wear the hat slot because I don't really like it. I'm playing the game how I want to play it and the game doesn't punish me for it.

5. Night City is amazing and it's only going to get better.

As to how I think CP2077 is a good game, it's quite simple. In RPG's I enjoy the story and the atmosphere, which are two things this game excels at. Night City is the best city ever made in a video game and I'm also playing the game on PC with full ray tracing. Quite frankly CP2077 is the most beautiful game in the world right now. I don't know how it is on console and I wish that version gets fixed, but it isn't my concern.

CP2077 with all it's bugs and missing features is still way better than any RPG Bethesda has released since Oblivion. You're free to not like it though. That's your thing.
 
@Gillian_Seed ...CP2077 does a better job with it's NPCs at least trying to do basic actions...
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mbrto

Forum regular
f4 is nice and all but cyberpunk actually made me care about the story and the characters
 
LOL. Cyberpunk literally have nothing to learn from Fallout 4 which is by far the worst Fallout game ever created (along with 76 probably but I've never played that game).
I'd love it to have more RPG elements like New Vegas or DAO but that would probably mean another 2-3 years of development so I'm happy with the final product (at least on PC).
 
I think that the only game that plays well with the urgency is Fallout 1. You have a strict timetable to finish the first main quest, to save your vault and then you can advance as you like, with other side missions, till you get to the very end.
 
iam sorry, but this has gone too far. how can you even compare that piece of shit to a game like CP2077 is beyond me.
 
CP2077 with all it's bugs and missing features is still way better than any RPG Bethesda has released since Oblivion. You're free to not like it though. That's your thing.

Are you serious? It's not even an RPG. Even CDPR have stopped calling it that and now refer to Cyberpunk 2077 as an 'action adventure. It's about as much an RPG as your average Assassin's Creed game, and on a very similar level in gameplay.

1) Fallout 4 NPC's are on pretty much the same level as Cyberpunk's for their AI - they sleep, they fight, they farm and do chores, but not much else, BUT that game is years older.

2) I think we can all agree that outside of Cyberpunk's very short main story everything else is filler - 'clear the map markers' gameplay like something from an Assassin's Creed game, and copy/paste kill/collect gigs delivered like something from a dull MMO.

4) It's a looter shooter. End of.

5) Night City LOOKS amazing, but that's all.
 
iam sorry, but this has gone too far. how can you even compare that piece of shit to a game like CP2077 is beyond me.
I think some might misunderstand the purpose of this post.

It was not meant as a compare Fallout 4 vs Cyberpunk!!

I compared how the main story is presented to the player and that of an open world, not every single aspect of Fallout 4 :)

Sticking to that, I think Fallout does a better job here as it allow players more freedom in order to explore and figure out how do go about it compared to CP. Even if you just want to go directly from A to B in Fallout and complete the main quest, it have a lot of replayability compared to CP, which in my opinion have close to zero. Because in Fallout with all the other functionality, you can play this game as a sandbox, you can't do that in CP, because there is no content to support it. You can decide in which order you want to do the side missions, but eventually it end up the same place anyway.

Which is why I think Cyberpunk would have been better using such approach compared to having to play the same story over and over again. Nightcity is a really cool place, so shitload of functionality and stuff could be added to it if CDPR wanted it and the experience itself would be able to carry the game, even without Keanu and the impending death of V. I personally just think they spend way to much time on the Keanu story compared to this, especially when it is as linear as it is and knowing how the game ends, to me there is just not a lot of replayability, despite what they said there would be.
 
The only thing CDPR should learn from bethesda games is the loot system. Anything else should be avoided really really hard.

BTW, even if they share some design flaws, CP77 is a much better game than F4.
 
The only thing CDPR should learn from bethesda games is the loot system. Anything else should be avoided really really hard.

BTW, even if they share some design flaws, CP77 is a much better game than F4.


Well, they can learn this - CDPR promised to set a new standard in open world gaming and completely failed.

Skyrim actually DID set a new standard for open world games back in 2011.
 
I think bethesda's greatest strength is exploration which i think Nintendo has perfected even more in Botw
i feel that Cyberpunk's Gigs could have been explorable areas without having some dumbass fixer telling me what i should do it ruins whatever sense of discovery these areas could have had
 
Well, they can learn this - CDPR promised to set a new standard in open world gaming and completely failed.

Skyrim actually DID set a new standard for open world games back in 2011.
A standard that was set again by TW3 4 years later (far from a perfect game). Talking about open-world RPGs.
 
I have to say that vanilla F4 was a bit of a disappointment when it came out for me too, however, something that I enjoy in Bethesda games is the Creation Kit and an ability to mod the fu** out of the games.
I still play Skyrim and F4 when I can't decide what else to play but I usually run each with 100+ mods, makes a world of difference.

That's something that I truly hope for Cyberpunk, at least on PC. With tools given to the community (hopefully one day), this game will be modded to hell and back and would pretty much guarantee the longevity and better experience for years to come, at least for players like me.
 
2) I think we can all agree that outside of Cyberpunk's very short main story everything else is filler - 'clear the map markers' gameplay like something from an Assassin's Creed game, and copy/paste kill/collect gigs delivered like something from a dull MMO.

I wouldn't call side quests in this game "filler". Even gigs and NCPD missions have lore to it if you care to investigate. I'd go as far to say that I enjoyed side content in this game more than that of Witcher 3.
 
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