Leader Ability Play Rates and Win Rates in Season of Love

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Hello!
Here are the Leader Ability play rates and win rates! As always we have the data sorted by rank (see image below).

Season_Of_Love.png


The data is also downloadable in the .xlsx format
 
Thanks for the update.

Quite educational regarding play/winrates. It shows how many flocked around Lockdown in last Season (I won't specifically mention SK Warriors, as that seems to be standard in the top 5 now) but at the same time, they never managed to surpass 52% winrate in total.
Happy to see the MO leaders represented in winrates (although no in actual playrates).
 
That moment when you grinded the Lined Pockets mastery last month and it get's buffed in to a top tier Leader Skill directly after you finished the mastery:coolstory:
 
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DRK3

Forum veteran
Based on Pro Rank stats, we had 3 leaders that combined make up for more than a third of all playrate...

There are 42 leader abilities, in a perfectly balanced situation with equal playrates, each would have around 2.4%.
Of course asking the devs to balance around that goal is unrealistic, it might not even be beneficial to the game state, but it still gives an idea of how far we are from that.

Devs have been balancing old cards more frequently, but leader abilities, not so much, there are abilities that are laughable for years, and its not just those 4 or 5, almost all abilities could use some tweaks and changes.

Oh well, expect Lined Pockets to have the biggest rise next month, i know i did my contribution (for once, and most likely, the final time, a leader that im still missing mastery is buffed, to compensate the dozen of times i did a mastery when a leader was weak for it to be buffed after...)
 

Guest 4375874

Guest
So like I said last time despite many people disagreeing, OH(deathwish) is all but dead. What the heck did they think would happen after the constant nerfs instead of just nerfing Viy. Get rid of Viy there are so many other ways to make deathwish interesting.

The lockdown "Nerf" is hardly a nerf with the addition of Anna. That card essentially buffs all their leaders but adds flexibility to lockdown more than anything. Then there's the obvious Eist/Lippy shenanigan's - you should not be able to play your best cards twice...I thought that was the point of removing leaders like DS. NR still going strong, the only surprise here is SY missing from the top 5 but I suspect we will see that over the next month or two.
 
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in a perfectly balanced situation with equal playrates, each would have around 2.4%.
This situation never existed and never will. Not just in Gwent, but in any competitve game with different choices available for players.

If something is better by 1% on paper - players will choose that option instead of anything else available (the great majority of them at least).

And even if by some otherwordly miracle such a situation with perfect balanced choices would arise, there would be no actual difference - players would flock to the decks recently played by "influencers". Information is instant, decklists can be imported instantly, 100% no thought process required. Everything comes in a pre-digested state, which is standard expectation by the generic player. Most people don't want to think, they don't want to invent, don't want to find out "the hard way" - they want results, NOW. Failure or extra time investment is not an option. If they get beaten by something with their "92% winrate MUST TRY Tier 0 Metabreaker" decklist, they can always run to the forums crying for nerfs.

It is as predictable (although sad) as it can get. This is how games (and frankly, everything around us) work these days. Streamer clickbait mentality is a huge part of this issue, showing only wins with a certain deck, building a false perception of power level for a couple more likes.

As for winrates, that is at least an indicator of a bit more realistic power level. You can have all FoTM kids running the same Lockdown build, their actual winrate shows the realistic (or at least close to realistic) power of the deck.
And as far as winrates go, the previous season shows pretty nice values. The TOP 5 all near 50-55% and top 10 close to 50% is indeed a sight to behold.
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So like I said last time, deathwish is all but dead.
You might remember I mentioned to you Carapace being competitive last month.

3 out of 6 MO Leaders in the TOP 10 is a fine representation in my opinion.
I for one am quite happy to see Overwhelming Hunger out of the toplist for a change. Still, because of the re-emergence of Viy, it will see a higher representation this season, along with Blood Scent.
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there are abilities that are laughable for years
True. At least we see some steps in getting back certain Leaders from the dumpster instead of focusing on the usual top 5.
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expect Lined Pockets to have the biggest rise next month
Easily a high Tier 1 deck - I expect it within the top 5 decks by winrates, and definitely in the top 5-10 in actual playrate this season.
 
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Guest 4375874

Guest
This situation never existed and never will. Not just in Gwent, but in any competitve game with different choices available for players.

If something is better by 1% on paper - players will choose that option instead of anything else available (the great majority of them at least).

And even if by some otherwordly miracle such a situation with perfect balanced choices would arise, there would be no actual difference - players would flock to the decks recently played by "influencers". Information is instant, decklists can be imported instantly, 100% no thought process required. Everything comes in a pre-digested state, which is standard expectation by the generic player. Most people don't want to think, they don't want to invent, don't want to find out "the hard way" - they want results, NOW. Failure or extra time investment is not an option. If they get beaten by something with their "92% winrate MUST TRY Tier 0 Metabreaker" decklist, they can always run to the forums crying for nerfs.

It is as predictable (although sad) as it can get. This is how games (and frankly, everything around us) work these days. Streamer clickbait mentality is a huge part of this issue, showing only wins with a certain deck, building a false perception of power level for a couple more likes.

As for winrates, that is at least an indicator of a bit more realistic power level. You can have all FoTM kids running the same Lockdown build, their actual winrate shows the realistic (or at least close to realistic) power of the deck.
And as far as winrates go, the previous season shows pretty nice values. The TOP 5 all near 50-55% and top 10 close to 50% is indeed a sight to behold.
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You might remember I mentioned to you Carapace being competitive last month.

3 out of 6 MO Leaders in the TOP 10 is a fine representation in my opinion.
I for one am quite happy to see Overwhelming Hunger out of the toplist for a change.
I don't really agree there. Their winrates are not great and play rates combined aren't even worth discussing, look outside pro rank. MO players are just scrambling to find a strategy that works because everything else is bad, that isn't an improvement it's finding the least worst thing to play. People in pro ranking are accustomed to meta decks and were caught off guard by a few like Arachas swarm because they've been out of the meta for a while. Let's see if this holds up...I assure you it wont. Look no further than Vampires that supposedly got a "buff" yet blood scent is nowhere to be seen. There's more to the stats than just how many leaders are there.

I'm all for the other MO leaders getting highlighted but there really hasn't been any improvements. All those leaders have received nothing but nerfs in the last few months.
 
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Guest 4416545

Guest
I think this playrates/win can lead to error really easy, like lockdown leader represent kolgrim deck and ball deck togueter, and same with ursine since It mostly represent Warriors with cerys than lippy.

So for me this only represent that this season of love was very balance with a lot of decks on the meta to choose and be competitive with it, and i think this season its gonna be a step back in that sense since i feel this season there are not so much competitive decks.

About what you guys are talking about mo, keep in mind Kelly was among the strongest deck but same time its reallly hard to play It as you should, so that winrate with it do not represent his strenght at all. I remember very well that when i was climbing around 2550 u could find a lot of kellys at that mmr, way way more that around 2400-2500, so even mo got his place in this season with arachas Kelly and koschey.

And yes, i expect too pocket line to have a hillarous playrates and winrate at the same time, and i expect way less variaty since lined pocket just breaked this balance, this deck alone kik out of the meta a lot of the decks from season of the love.
 

Guest 4375874

Guest
I think this playrates/win can lead to error really easy, like lockdown leader represent kolgrim deck and ball deck togueter, and same with ursine since It mostly represent Warriors with cerys than lippy.

So for me this only represent that this season of love was very balance with a lot of decks on the meta to choose and be competitive with it, and i think this season its gonna be a step back in that sense since i feel this season there are not so much competitive decks.

About what you guys are talking about mo, keep in mind Kelly was among the strongest deck but same time its reallly hard to play It as you should, so that winrate with it do not represent his strenght at all. I remember very well that when i was climbing around 2550 u could find a lot of kellys at that mmr, way way more that around 2400-2500, so even mo got his place in this season with arachas Kelly and koschey.

And yes, i expect too pocket line to have a hillarous playrates and winrate at the same time, and i expect way less variaty since lined pocket just breaked this balance, this deck alone kik out of the meta a lot of the decks from season of the love.
what are you defining as strong because Carapace has never been a consistently well performing deck so the stats don't support your argument. A few persons being successful with Kelly doesn't make it strong. How do the majority perform? That's what matters
 
I'm waiting to see what happens with Lined Pockets in the season of the bear, the difference between the two seasons will be interesting.
 

Guest 4416545

Guest
what are you defining as strong because Carapace has never been a consistently well performing deck so the stats don't support your argument. A few persons being successful with Kelly doesn't make it strong. How do the majority perform? That's what matters
Mmmm no, just no, the majority do not means nothing about if a deck is strong by It self or not. One thing is how strong its a deck and other thing is how easy/hard its to play with it.

By example, if you give line pocket to a Guy Who just started he Will get to pro rank really quickly, he Will learn It in no time and he could make 20 blunders while all his Games with It and he Will climb fast as hell, because this deck its just novigrade Justice round 1 and from there on easy game, you can play bad with It and still get wins.

Now, if you give Kelly from season of love to a Guy Who just started, like Damm, sure he could get to pro prank but he Will need a lot of Games and a lot of knowledage about Kelly deck and about the game in general, any blunder/mistake with It can easy means a lost even tho It was one of the strongest.

And to end, for me another thing that matters among from what i said its what are top 10/20 playing, if in that top lets say 8 of them are playing Kelly on 2600 mmr ( and i think that was more or less what happen in season of love) well then its strong without a doubt even if the bast majority cant get a lot of wins with It, and as i said last season i climbed close to that mmr and there were hella kellys there, way way more than what i found around 2400-2500.

Psdt: Sorry about my bad english :)
 
Mmmm no, just no, the majority do not means nothing about if a deck is strong by It self or not. One thing is how strong its a deck and other thing is how easy/hard its to play with it.

By example, if you give line pocket to a Guy Who just started he Will get to pro rank really quickly, he Will learn It in no time and he could make 20 blunders while all his Games with It and he Will climb fast as hell, because this deck its just novigrade Justice round 1 and from there on easy game, you can play bad with It and still get wins.

Now, if you give Kelly from season of love to a Guy Who just started, like Damm, sure he could get to pro prank but he Will need a lot of Games and a lot of knowledage about Kelly deck and about the game in general, any blunder/mistake with It can easy means a lost even tho It was one of the strongest.

And to end, for me another thing that matters among from what i said its what are top 10/20 playing, if in that top lets say 8 of them are playing Kelly on 2600 mmr ( and i think that was more or less what happen in season of love) well then its strong without a doubt even if the bast majority cant get a lot of wins with It, and as i said last season i climbed close to that mmr and there were hella kellys there, way way more than what i found around 2400-2500.

Psdt: Sorry about my bad english :)
HAHAHAHAHAHA

Yeah right.

Have you ever played with a SY deck to say somethink like that?

The SY deck are the most dificult deck to pilot because you need to know when and where you have to spend your coins. I do agree lined pockets its a strong deck, but say its easy to pilot its nonsense.

How many times you played against a SY deck and your opponent lost by 2 or 3 points but he have like 4 or 5 coins and no units to spend it? And, of course, you dont have SY decks in the starting packs, so a new player hasnt the firts knowledge to pilot it
 

Guest 4416545

Guest
HAHAHAHAHAHA

Yeah right.

Have you ever played with a SY deck to say somethink like that?

The SY deck are the most dificult deck to pilot because you need to know when and where you have to spend your coins. I do agree lined pockets its a strong deck, but say its easy to pilot its nonsense.

How many times you played against a SY deck and your opponent lost by 2 or 3 points but he have like 4 or 5 coins and no units to spend it? And, of course, you dont have SY decks in the starting packs, so a new player hasnt the firts knowledge to pilot it
Buddy, u are talking to a guy who unless he wants to get the title from "get between 200 best player on pro rank" only plays hidden caché on ladder, so yes, i played hella Games with sy to know if lined pocked its a joke or not and from my 600 wins and god know how many Games i lost with sindicate i can say its a joke and really easy to play with it compared with whatever sy you want.

The Coín manage with líne pocket its really easy to deal since you dont need to hold no coins for nothing more than Steal something with philippa or delete all in enemy board with thrill and maybe hold 9 for boat.

But well, if you think líne pocket its hard to play... Well just think whatever you want, but thats not the topic and im not gonna bother enter now in why line pocket its op.
 
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