Maybe it's just me but I like the RNG draws, literally because I don't know what the opponents has and the opponent doesn't know what I have. There is a chess match going on. That's not the case with Gwent, with Gwent you simply play the cards in order from start to finish; game after game after game. Playing against the exact same copy of decks over and over and seeing the EXACT results match after match. It's almost like a robotic simulation or something.
After playing quite some time and finally reaching Master my impression is that LOR is good game, but it's lacking a bit of depth to be a great game. While there is certainly a decent amount of it, the base concept of only having one permanent type (units) is somewhat limiting. The balancing seems to be pretty good compared to other games. The number of viable decks is quite huge considering the small card pool.
You described one of my biggest grievances with the game as it is right now. I think that's why something like the Journey has been introduced. When the gameplay is stale the way you can make people put up with it is giving them something to grind for/towards. Which of course summarizes the mobile game experience anyway.
Seeing the same cards in and of itself isn't even something I've got a major problem with, if only there'd be a decent amount of variety in terms of how things play out. But the binary nature of the cards and decks reflects on the game.
Old consume is something I like to use as an example to describe the good of old Gwent, it's a strong deck that's easy enough to get the basics of but to play it on a high level it takes a lot of practice since sequencing matters a lot and the correct sequencing can differ based on what you're up against. In OB a lot of decks looked easy to play until you tried to play them yourself. In Homecoming it's just as simple as it looks with few exceptions.
The game needs more variables to give the players more to ponder about and make netdecking less rewarding as you need to put time into actually understanding the deck, not merely crafting it.
If many here recommend LoR I'd like to give that a shot.
It seems Gwent makes you think like this, because you find all matches in Gwent the same. The problem in Gwent is not the relatively small amount of draw RNG, but the lack of variety in decks due to the devs continuously creating some OP cards (and decks) and not balancing the game. If players could construct many (viable) decks with little twists; different cards and strategies, nobody would say that draw RNG is needed to make it interesting because there would be so many different decks being played anyway. Having a lot of draw RNG is simply "creating variety" and "balancing" in a lazy and fake way. It reduces the fun from synergies and specific (counter)plays in your deck by not letting you draw the right cards. It's not fun at all when this happens too often, because then any strategic play has been reduced to a simple draw RNG gambling fiesta. There needs to be a bit of draw RNG and a lot of viable cards and decks.
I generally think this problem can be avoided without much draw RNG. A well designed game forces you to adjust your play patterns based on your opponent, kind of like it does happen in RTS games. Gwent doesn't achieve that to a sufficient degree.
I disagree, even with more variety, decks in Gwent still play out the same. While it's true that draw RNG is used to balance the game, it's not the main focus. No, that is to create more variety.
Incidentally, Gwent is arguably more difficult to balance precisely because the game is so consistent, which, incidentally, makes netdecks even worse (well, better, I mean, but the experience is worse).
On a related topic of draw RNG, there is an OTK (one turn kill) on turn 2!! However, it requires perfect draws with a perfect match-up, which happens once a blue moon. Regardless, it's still funny that it's theoretically possible.
The deck is Ionia/Demacia and you go second passing the first round, with the following cards:
Mobilize x1
Sparring Student x2
Shadowfiend x3
You play Mobilize making all the units in your hand 0 mana. Then you play Sparring Student twice and Shadowfiend thrice, making the board look like this:
5/5 Sparring Student
4/4 Sparring Student
4/3 Shadowfiend
4/3 Shadowfiend
4/3 Shadowfiend
----
21 damage
Yes, the opponent needs to have no units on board or no spells to snipe your units. Also, you need to go second and, more importantly, have the perfect hand. So, all in all, it's like winning the lottery.
The deck is Ionia/Demacia and you go second passing the first round, with the following cards:
Mobilize x1
Sparring Student x2
Shadowfiend x3
You play Mobilize making all the units in your hand 0 mana. Then you play Sparring Student twice and Shadowfiend thrice, making the board look like this:
5/5 Sparring Student
4/4 Sparring Student
4/3 Shadowfiend
4/3 Shadowfiend
4/3 Shadowfiend
----
21 damage
Yes, the opponent needs to have no units on board or no spells to snipe your units. Also, you need to go second and, more importantly, have the perfect hand. So, all in all, it's like winning the lottery.
I would like to see variety created through having multiple viable cards and decks, not draw RNG in the same few tier 1 decks.
Gwent becomes difficult to balance due to bad mechanics like Poison, Defender, Destroy and binary artifacts. The provision system can work really well, but I think it's not properly used. Cards should be balanced around their provisions, having a value range and a cap that can be reached when played optimally (with a few expensive exceptions like Scorch). However, the devs seem continuously focused on creating a few OP cards and mechanics for huge point swings instead of balancing the game overall. That makes it imbalanced and reduces variety by continuously having only a few top tier decks.
Crazy! Imagine a world championship won like this.
Im all for good CCG card games out there, coming from MTG, Pokémon, Hearthstone, (just 2 weeks ago) Gwent, but Legends of Runeterra? Heck, even tried the P2W Artifact game by Valve, which obviously is a failure.
Not sure about that. Saw a few youtube vids, looks pretty cartoonish to me. That itself turns me off. That's why I stay away from games like Fortnight.
Not sure about that. Saw a few youtube vids, looks pretty cartoonish to me. That itself turns me off. That's why I stay away from games like Fortnight.
LoR's endgame can quite often be really horrible, with both players out of cards and drawing one card each round, hoping to get the best one. That's pure RNG and a very bad experience. In later rounds, I think players should draw more cards, with a mulligan. Let the game be decided through play and not some dumb card drawing. Yes, take a lesson from Gwent.
I mean that's not very fair. There are so many card draw tools available, and including them to avoid what you are talking about is part of the game. Some form of Trifarian Assesor/Progress Day/Glimpse Beyond/Rummage are necessary in every deck. You just have to find the right balance for what you are looking for.
Besides that I totally agree with you about draw RNG being a downside in LoR. I'm always down for adding more tutor cards into LoR. I like the consistency and small deck sizes of Gwent. I just can't stand Gwent anymore because of the terribly bland card design.
^ I've fixed both of your comments. Well, you get my point.
Yes, there are card draw tools. But isn't it bad that you need to auto-include these? And you still need to draw them - same story all over. I too find the draw system of Gwent much better.
Time to be less traditional and more revolutionary.
Anyone tried the new expansion/launch of the game?
As in any card game, there is some powercreep but the mechanisms look interesting. Only tried in expedition but really enjoying it so far.
Also, I tried the mobile version. The game might have been planned for it from the beginning but at first glance it's so much more swift and user friendly than gwent mobile... The hand is tucked on the side until you click on it or play, a single click open details, click again to come back. Click in 'void' or draw back to cancel (no right click or long touch). The card arts are zoomed on board, not especially fan of this one, but it's not bothering either and I guess it may improve clarity.
Anyway, of course there are some bugs/points to improve but overall seems like a smooth and successful launch to me.
As in any card game, there is some powercreep but the mechanisms look interesting. Only tried in expedition but really enjoying it so far.
Also, I tried the mobile version. The game might have been planned for it from the beginning but at first glance it's so much more swift and user friendly than gwent mobile... The hand is tucked on the side until you click on it or play, a single click open details, click again to come back. Click in 'void' or draw back to cancel (no right click or long touch). The card arts are zoomed on board, not especially fan of this one, but it's not bothering either and I guess it may improve clarity.
Anyway, of course there are some bugs/points to improve but overall seems like a smooth and successful launch to me.
Wow LoR actually works on my phone while Gwent doesn't at all. GG Riot.
Next to powercreep, they also added more RNG and some toxic mechanics like Maokai milling your deck down to 4 cards when he levels up and some cheap cards that draw cards from YOUR deck (see the cheap and lame insta-lose combo?). Some new stuff is good and some of it is bad. It cannot be called balanced, but most of it is fun and flashy.
I haven't seen anything over powered yet. I love that this game is fun and the deck building is very interesting.
So you haven't encountered the Maokai - Nautilus tosser deck yet, obliterating your deck and going deep in round 5. One of the most broken things I have seen. Any "normal" deck doesn't seem to have a chance.
I have to admit that the drawing from opponent's deck is frustrating. Maokai and deep so far don't bother me that much