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Rarooney

Rarooney

Forum regular
#301
Dec 22, 2020
DexLuther said:
You can't guarantee anything. I'm QA (Not on Cyberpunk. I have nothing to do with CDPR), and I know for a FACT that's it's possible to work on fixes while adding content.

It's done all the time. DLC is rarely just DLC. Especially when large packs and free DLC. You may not know it, but both Witcher 3 DLCs changed stuff so that the DLC content would be accessible. Patches change things in the same way. In a way DLC are patches.

There's nothing stopping a patch that fixes a crash from also adding a bunch of new weapons, armor, or even whole new areas to the game.

Devs are also specialized. The dev in charge of making weapon meshes and textures has absolutely nothing to do with fixing crashes due to code trying to load the wrong file or something. The sound dev isn't going to be fixing lighting issues or working on improving the AI in the game. Even the ones that are specialized in the fields that are needed to get the game where it's supposed to be on all platforms aren't all going to be doing that.

There are many devs for each specialization, and they are all broken up into teams, and the whole thing is pretty fluid. A dev working on new meshes might be pulled from making new weapon meshes to fix issues that were found with the current meshes that caused NPCs to stretch or distort or whatever. Once they're done fixing what needs to be fixed, they go back to working on new stuff like they were before.

This is especially the case since most of the content that was pulled is in some stage of WIP. It's not like they are creating completely new content. They are taking the content they already started, finishing it up and putting it back.

There probably is a portion on the dev team that's working on DLC/Expansion Packs or whatever you want to call them, but even they aren't starting from scratch. Much of the DLC in any game uses assets that have already been created. You don't have to create a tree or door since you already have 50 different doors or trees that were already made for the main game (even if not all of them were used).

With all the devs broken into teams and working on things as needed, you can have patches that fix issues while also re-adding content that was cut and even adding brand new content all at the same time and even in the same patch.
Click to expand...
I am fully aware of this that you say, but in the current state of the game there is no chance that 'more content' is being added while the basegame is unplayable for the majority of the players. They will put out DLC and Expansions at a faster rate most likely. But I dont see them adding stuff while only the minority would be able to play it.
 
K

Kaspar.Hauser

Forum regular
#302
Dec 22, 2020
The flaws in this game will become apparent in the second run, when you don't have the "Wow" factor provided by the characters that you don't know yet, by the surprises provided by the main mission plot and the side missions about the relevant characters.

Then you'll start noticing some big flaws in the game, like:

A) Visual and animation quality disparity between main missions and side missions;

B) Uninteractive world. In witcher 3 we had less city parts, but the vendors were very different. In Cyberpunk 2077 there's a lot of "copy and paste" street vendors, different faces, but same structure, a bunch of generic phrases, but you can't buy from them;

C) There's no eating and drinking animations, so restaurants, bars and night clubs feels more like a gimmick;

D) No meaningful gameplay effects on having the apartment (I don't use the apartment for the majority of the campaign);

E) no reason to spare or kill enemies;

F) Physics are totally broken;

G) The collision system is very bad, enemies overlay each other, and you can easily trespass enemies and other NPCs because they are ghosts.

H) Most of the side activities are just rioting gang turfs, catching some stuff, saving someone, abducting some characters, stealing data but none of those have a direct impact in world lore - serves only for mindless grinding and that's it.

I) You can't choose to help one gang or another, to clean the district from gangs infestation, and even the fixers talk to you just by phone video. You never get to know them, there's no concern or character development. No secondary plots on them, they're just there for grinding money, street cred, just like NCPD work exists to grind money, street cred and maybe some good item spec.

J) Police system have to be implemented, instead of ,the "instant teleportation godlike street police, that let the gangs trample around and kill for fun, but bashes V for looking for them for more than 5 seconds and that gameplay mechanic is ok". All police officers hates V for no apparent reason, except for the one mission you make for them.

V have access to police radio for who knows why reasons (Vic only installs the database in kiroshi, not a radio signal interceptor).

So, delivering that kind of quality, it seems that the team spent a lot of effort with references, easter eggs and other secondary stuff, before doing the basics right.

And most of the gimmick stuff were just useless things to help youtuber's job easier to entertain their public, without any kind or consequences in the gameplay, that doesn't really add for the immersion or gaming experience, which would be ok, if the BASICS were done right.
 
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Reactions: harblec, Rarooney and KaMe_90
amblin83

amblin83

Fresh user
#303
Dec 22, 2020
To be fair, there're not that many first person RPGs out there, one direct competitor would be the fallout 4 but FO had an entirely different combat system built around VATS which is much slower paced .

this game's combat is more like a FPS , not just 6 hours of carefully scripted bang and whistles but 60+ hrs of open world, so it's a very challenging and bold move to even try packing enough detail and tight, engaging story telling into that many hours of gameplay.

because when you see a fast paced first person game with guns, you'd immediately compare it against other fast FPS games such as COD. But cod only had 7 hours of story to tell, they can handpick the perfect environment for each scripted battle , this is simply not feasible in this game....
 
Last edited: Dec 22, 2020
Dustcoat_Wanderer

Dustcoat_Wanderer

Fresh user
#304
Dec 22, 2020
Schnittlauch01 said:
I really feel like sitting in a restaurant here. When asking about the daily menu I'am told, there will be stake and beans, so I ordered. When the waiter came back, I was served fish and chips. Really liked the food, but still, its not what I had ordered.
Click to expand...
Well in all fairness, it's more like they serve you a slice of bread with some cold-cuts of roast beef on it with some cheap super-market canned beans while you see Gordon Ramsey in the klitchen. Still beef and beans, but Gordon Ramsey is just there for star power and getting advertising by helping sell a inferior product. Roast beef sandwich is good, but I was promised a 5 star restaurant experience.
 
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Rarooney

Rarooney

Forum regular
#305
Dec 22, 2020
PrincessAmanda said:
Aside from cut content lifepaths prologue seemed rushed as well.

My alternatives :
1) Nomad V is living in the place where you meet withh Jackie for the first time as Nomad. It looks like a perfect starting location, theres even bed. Small side missions on the desert would be focused arround gathering money for the bribe to cross the border. Theme - Escaping the past.

2) Corpo V, after good introduction in Arasaka HQ, V goes to the fancy home for the night. The next day V has to go on some boring meetings, make deals with buisness people, bribe someone etc. Just to experience what it is like to be a corpo. Theme - The Fall.

3) Street Kid V is a hobo. On random occasion V is helping someone on the street and catches Padre attention. He takes us under hes wings and offer us to be one of hes goons. We pledge obedience to Padre, doing variety of dirty jobs. Theme - Fighting for a better life.

Those are like B movie ideas, I know - but still better than what we've got. Not to mention how little lifepath choice matters in the later game.
Click to expand...
Quite fun how you put it as B movies, and I agreed and then you said "Still better than what we've got" and I still agree, difference is they got paid to do it.
 
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warbaby2

warbaby2

Forum veteran
#306
Dec 22, 2020
Kaspar.Hauser said:
And most of the gimmick stuff were just useless things to help youtuber's job easier to entertain their public, without any kind or consequences in the gameplay, that doesn't really add for the immersion or gaming experience, which would be ok, if the BASICS were done right.
Click to expand...
For which they got their little cameos in the game... seriously, though, I know one of the themes of Cyberpunk is style over substance, but that shouldn't extend to how the game is made!
 
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Ezylox

Ezylox

Forum regular
#307
Dec 22, 2020
They didn't lie about anything, they just needed time and they realised they wouldn't be able to implement many things when the game was delayed for the first time. They probably thought about delaying the game indefinitely but unfortunately couldn't because of shareholders, now we can only hope they will fix everything and enhance the game
 
KaMe_90

KaMe_90

Fresh user
#308
Dec 22, 2020
Kaspar.Hauser said:
The flaws in this game will become apparent in the second run, when you don't have the "Wow" factor provided by the characters that you don't know yet, by the surprises provided by the main mission plot and the side missions about the relevant characters.

Then you'll start noticing some big flaws in the game, like:

A) Visual and animation quality disparity between main missions and side missions;

B) Uninteractive world. In witcher 3 we had less city parts, but the vendors were very different. In Cyberpunk 2077 there's a lot of "copy and paste" street vendors, different faces, but same structure, a bunch of generic phrases, but you can't buy from them;

C) There's no eating and drinking animations, so restaurants, bars and night clubs feels more like a gimmick;

D) No meaningful gameplay effects on having the apartment (I don't use the apartment for the majority of the campaign);

E) no reason to spare or kill enemies;

F) Physics are totally broken;

G) The collision system is very bad, enemies overlay each other, and you can easily trespass enemies and other NPCs because they are ghosts.

H) Most of the side activities are just rioting gang turfs, catching some stuff, saving someone, abducting some characters, stealing data but none of those have a direct impact in world lore - serves only for mindless grinding and that's it.

I) You can't choose to help one gang or another, to clean the district from gangs infestation, and even the fixers talk to you just by phone video. You never get to know them, there's no concern or character development. No secondary plots on them, they're just there for grinding money, street cred, just like NCPD work exists to grind money, street cred and maybe some good item spec.

J) Police system have to be implemented, instead of ,the "instant teleportation godlike street police, that let the gangs trample around and kill for fun, but bashes V for looking for them for more than 5 seconds and that gameplay mechanic is ok". All police officers hates V for no apparent reason, except for the one mission you make for them.

V have access to police radio for who knows why reasons (Vic only installs the database in kiroshi, not a radio signal interceptor).

So, delivering that kind of quality, it seems that the team spent a lot of effort with references, easter eggs and other secondary stuff, before doing the basics right.

And most of the gimmick stuff were just useless things to help youtuber's job easier to entertain their public, without any kind or consequences in the gameplay, that doesn't really add for the immersion or gaming experience, which would be ok, if the BASICS were done right.
Click to expand...
So true.... It's really sad, that moment when I boot up GTA San andreas and the game let's me interact with tons of things and NPC's and ACTUALLY roleplay more than CP2077... It's really fuckin sad....
 
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Rarooney

Rarooney

Forum regular
#309
Dec 22, 2020
Mario_Szabo said:
Well next time NASA is advertising the will land on Mars colonize it and build a city and then.. Well we landet on the moon and brought back some stones. Well after all it was just planning and subject to change. :shrug:
Click to expand...
This made litterally no sense? President saying I will make America great again, and the result differed is like wishes, not promises. Same with your moon and stone. People selling you a toothbrush but you get toothpaste instead is worse and litterally false advertisement.
 
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DexLuther

DexLuther

Fresh user
#310
Dec 22, 2020
Rarooney said:
I am fully aware of this that you say, but in the current state of the game there is no chance that 'more content' is being added while the basegame is unplayable for the majority of the players. They will put out DLC and Expansions at a faster rate most likely. But I dont see them adding stuff while only the minority would be able to play it.
Click to expand...
Like I said, they can fix issues and add content at the same time. It wouldn't be huge content drops (probably).

The January patch could fix a ton of issues AND add the game's AI (that they had to cut apparently because it was broken) AND add 50 cars that they also had to cut because they weren't finished in time for launch. That's just an example.

There's tons of people at CDPR and they aren't all working on fixing the game. Some might be finishing up content they cut, while others are working on completely new content and the rest are fixing issues.

Fixing issues is important, but the whole crew isn't working on that because not all of them can and they'd also get even more behind on other things. Patches don't have to focus solely on fixing issues.
 
Tracido

Tracido

Forum veteran
#311
Dec 22, 2020
KaMe_90 said:
So true.... It's really sad, that moment when I boot up GTA San andreas and the game let's me interact with tons of things and NPC's and ACTUALLY roleplay more than CP2077... It's really fuckin sad....
Click to expand...
Had to.
 
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Mk3rd

Mk3rd

Forum regular
#312
Dec 22, 2020
I get some of the gripes here but some of it also falls to this: Just a reminder
 
Tracido

Tracido

Forum veteran
#313
Dec 22, 2020
Mk3rd said:
I get some of the gripes here but some of it also falls to this: Just a reminder
Click to expand...
GTA delivered more, so, you're saying trust Rockstar first, got it.
 
Rarooney

Rarooney

Forum regular
#314
Dec 22, 2020
8u88l3gum said:
HOLY HELL.. that's over 12 hours a day since the game came out.. Who is feeding you?
Click to expand...
I waited 8 years for this, I had a two week period planned to embrace all the 'content' of this game and I have instead pushed myself to do as much as possible to get a good look over the game ;)
 
warbaby2

warbaby2

Forum veteran
#315
Dec 22, 2020
Mk3rd said:
I get some of the gripes here but some of it also falls to this: Just a reminder
Click to expand...
Yea yea, but as we also established: There are limits to this excuse...
 
8u88l3gum

8u88l3gum

Fresh user
#316
Dec 22, 2020
Mama Wells makes good pie.. Just give'r some time,)
 
Gesph

Gesph

Fresh user
#317
Dec 22, 2020
I wholeheartedly agree with your entire post. This is what was advertised over and over, what made me and many more buy this game. Beyond bugs that can be fixed with patches, my major disappointment is that this game does not include even 50% of the features that were promised or advertised. They created an incredibly big hype over these videos when most of their content never actually happened in the game.

Spot on mate. This is the main issue with this game. The biggest let down I've ever had in all my gaming life (and I've been playing games for more than 30 years).
 
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Rarooney

Rarooney

Forum regular
#318
Dec 22, 2020
DexLuther said:
I have to agree with you here. This game had to go through submission for Microsoft and Sony, so they had to have seen the issue.

Even the "They trusted us" excuse doesn't work. Patches have to go through submission too, so Sony and Microsoft submission people HAD to have seen that even with the day 0 patch the game was nowhere near passable. The people that handled the submission at Microsoft and Sony and passed it even after seeing the state of the game with the day 0 patch applied dropped the ball.

There's absolutely no way the game or the game + day 0 patch should have passed submission in the first place.

If it was just the base game with no patch, I could understand. Agreements are routinely made where a game will pass submission on condition that certain issues be fixed, which is why day 0 patches exist in the first place. Then day 0 patch goes to submission, submission people install base game then apply day 0 patch and check the game again as they did the first time, this time also checking that the issues that were promised would be fixed are actually fixed.

The game somehow passed initial submission AND day-0 patch submission + conditions from the first submission.

Everyone's blaming CDPR (and rightly so), but the console companies are also to blame. They could have probably avoided this completely by failing the Cyberpunk submission like they should have, which would have FORCED CDPR into another delay. Sure they could have still launched PC only for now, since there's no submission at all on PC, but I doubt they would have launched PC only.
Click to expand...
Well said and I must agree. CDPR has however to take full responsibility for this disaster of a launch. With the reputation they behold should be worth more. They could easely told the companies "This is far from the standard of our games and this Will backfire beyond imagenation" They were fully aware this backlash would happen and went through with it anyway. That is on them and them alone. PS taking game off store is proof of this being a possible circumstanse.
Post automatically merged: Dec 22, 2020

IskrasFemme said:
Me or then? I never write something like this... :)
Click to expand...
You quoted CDPR?
 
gregski

gregski

Moderator
#319
Dec 22, 2020
A kind request - before starting a new thread, make sure a similar one doesn't existing on forums already.

Merged. Please continue here.
 
Ezylox

Ezylox

Forum regular
#320
Dec 22, 2020
Rarooney said:
Well said and I must agree. CDPR has however to take full responsibility for this disaster of a launch. With the reputation they behold should be worth more. They could easely told the companies "This is far from the standard of our games and this Will backfire beyond imagenation" They were fully aware this backlash would happen and went through with it anyway. That is on them and them alone. PS taking game off store is proof of this being a possible circumstanse.
Post automatically merged: Dec 22, 2020


You quoted CDPR?
Click to expand...
They can't, not anymore. Shareholders don't care if the game doesn't meet CDPR standards, they only care about money so they pushed for deadlines to make a profit and then vanished into oblivion, leaving CDPR alone to handle the backlash
 
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