Most expensive perks (to date) and current updated list of Attributes (5) /Skill trees (12) and some new perks information

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Feel the difference? Things, not systems. Little things can make whole game. So if we speaking of CP2077, i'm sure devs make some purpose for non combat things and mechanics, just not in the character progression or stats.

That's kind of what I am getting at though. CDPR has shown a tendency to decouple actions the player can take in the game from the character progression. The best example is dialog. You don't have dialog abilities. Instead the results are primarily determined by the selections you make in the moment.

I think this can be a critical mistake when you're allowed more freedom to build the character a specific way (I say more because exactly zero games let you build your character any way you want). Not necessarily because it's a worse approach. It's because it cuts things out of the character progression. It'd be perfectly acceptable if there were other ways to progress and "build" a character. It's far less so when you look at the progression trees we've seen so far. Consider for a moment the sheer volume of combat oriented abilities there. Or, better yet, consider how many aren't combat oriented.

Thats why i started post with "I agree" :coolstory:. We all love then game contains *EVERYTHING*, but in reality that *EVERYTHING* can kill balance of game and make tons of useless or no fun mechanics. I think good game should have balance between number of opportunities and their usefulness and quality.

I don't buy this either. It's effectively saying we can't have nice things because it's hard. Furthermore, take a trip down memory lane and consider TW3 progression. Complicated? Nope. Pretty basic really. Balanced? Heh, not even close. Now imagine for a second how it's going to play out when you have 200 different ways to kill stuff.

The more important bit isn't that we can't do everything. It's there doesn't appear to be a lot of ways to progress a character beyond deciding how you're going to fight stuff. Even some of the options not directly related to fighting stuff are likely to be indirectly related to fighting stuff. I'm starting to get an Assassin's Creed vibe set in the year 2077 with better writers and character development.
 
We all love then game contains *EVERYTHING*

No we don't. Just things that are reasonably applicable and work for the better of the experience for those, who decide to try out those particular avenues. Not, for example, the "moisture of your hands while playing the guitar".

You are making it all sound unreasonably complicated. It's not.
 
No we don't.
We? Who? If you watch some questions to devs, some people asking for sex positions and such and if add it all up and it turns out that crowd in general wants absolutely everything. Again, if you didn't read, I am for variety, but all the mechanics must be made of high quality and be useful, otherwise I can easily do without them.

This thread is drowns in prejudices based on information that is less than 1 percent of the game's mechanics. If the game has battle perks =/= all perks will be only for battle. Yea you can get a specific view, for example, about difference between PnP and CP2077, but game isn't out yet and we can't feel it's "spirit" and such. Personally i don't give a f, if game won't have something if game is good. It's all just opinions and matter of taste.
 
We? Who? If you watch some questions to devs, some people asking for sex positions and such and if add it all up and it turns out that crowd in general wants absolutely everything. Again, if you didn't read, I am for variety, but all the mechanics must be made of high quality and be useful, otherwise I can easily do without them.

This thread is drowns in prejudices based on information that is less than 1 percent of the game's mechanics. If the game has battle perks =/= all perks will be only for battle. Yea you can get a specific view, for example, about difference between PnP and CP2077, but game isn't out yet and we can't feel it's "spirit" and such. Personally i don't give a f, if game won't have something if game is good. It's all just opinions and matter of taste.

Based on information that is less than 1 percent of the game's mechanics?... We have basically all the list of the character stats and skills. Now perks are coming out but is quite evident were the focus is.
 
We? Who? If you watch some questions to devs, some people asking for sex positions and such and if add it all up and it turns out that crowd in general wants absolutely everything. Again, if you didn't read, I am for variety, but all the mechanics must be made of high quality and be useful, otherwise I can easily do without them.

This thread is drowns in prejudices based on information that is less than 1 percent of the game's mechanics. If the game has battle perks =/= all perks will be only for battle. Yea you can get a specific view, for example, about difference between PnP and CP2077, but game isn't out yet and we can't feel it's "spirit" and such. Personally i don't give a f, if game won't have something if game is good. It's all just opinions and matter of taste.

"We" refers to certain individuals considering buying the game would be my guess.

1 percent is stretching it a bit isn't it? It's not 100% and things are WIP but at this point we can probably say we have information on far more than 1% of the game mechanics. Furthermore, the timeline is hitting the home stretch at this point. We're supposedly waiting for the finished product to be polished.

I won't argue against saying it's premature to fully judge the game at this time. It's why most of my posts here have phrases like, "My fear is....", "It looks like....", I have concerns...", etc. It's to convey a lack of absolute certainty on the comments to follow. Regardless, those concerns are there.
 
Okay.
Based on information that is less than 1 percent of the game's mechanics?... We have basically all the list of the character stats and skills. Now perks are coming out but is quite evident were the focus is.
We have list of stats yes and a brief description what are they. But skills? If you are about skills tree, jornos said about 15 approximately skill out of approximately 228. And little bit of info about skills in the cyberware and such. Looks loke we saw everything that game can afford, right?
 
We have list of stats yes and a brief description what are they. But skills? If you are about skills tree, jornos said about 15 approximately skill out of approximately 228. And little bit of info about skills in the cyberware and such. Looks loke we saw everything that game can afford, right?

We know about the attributes. I assume these are meant to be our "stats". We know which skills are associated with those attributes. The only thing we don't know, to my knowledge anyway, is what each and every perk associated with the skills provides.

If we assume the game uses the "traditional" stat/skill/perk paradigm (aka, stats offer wide benefits, skills more specific benefits and perks even more specific benefits) it's a safe bet the list of perks associated with a given skill are going to be highly related to that skill. Given the way these abilities seem to followed a tiered design it points to this being the case.

On the other hand, modern games have tended to blur the lines with their progression in this regard (a very good example of this would be The Outer Worlds... which oddly felt like it had relatively fleshed out character progression). So perhaps it's not a safe assumption. At the very least I'd still anticipate a loose relation between skills and perks.

So no, I don't think it's fair to say we know about 1% of the character progression. It feels more like we have a pretty good grasp on how it's going to function at this point.

Obviously, if the lines get blurred as they do in other games it's difficult to say with certainty. Even if not, it's still hard to say with certainty. Which is why the fears are more concerns in the back of the mind, so to speak. Especially because if there are all these non-combat related progression choices one would expect they would be presented. Why would they cherry pick the combat related choices and show them but not the other stuff?

In the end it's hindsight at this point anyway. If the game is really complete and only needs polishing this kind of stuff probably isn't going to change radically between now and release.
 
That's why i wait for release. To see the game.

Fair enough.

Feedback now doesn't exactly hurt though. As things change and more information is known the feedback can change with it. Plus, it's hard to give feedback and expect anything of it when there isn't much of a time interval to provide it. With all the cloak and dagger anyway.
 
I wonder is Mantis Blades affected by Body attribute or Reflex?

For example in Shadowrun Hong Kong hand razors and cyber spur use close combat skill for accuracy and Strength for damage.

It make more sense that your strength/body is tied to damage you do with melee weapons, than to be tied to reflex.
 
I wonder is Mantis Blades affected by Body attribute or Reflex?

For example in Shadowrun Hong Kong hand razors and cyber spur use close combat skill for accuracy and Strength for damage.

It make more sense that your strength/body is tied to damage you do with melee weapons, than to be tied to reflex.
Reflex, those are blade. Also confirmed by last 2 videos.
 
You can not have it all but you can have all of it in a specific concentration.

Dont try to have all the skills or all the implants or all the perks. Use the ones specifically for YOUR build/playstyle.

A doctor is not an architect!
the time spent MASTERING a discipline leaves time for little else.
 
Then can you please tell me your source about the list of social and contextual actions related to each attribute in this game?

Well, I meant we know about the attributes in terms of name and possibly a bit of their intended function. If you're saying we don't know exactly how they will be applied within the game then yeah, we don't. I don't know of a source providing such information, sadly.

Most of my concerns are based on the skills and perks info has been released about.

Just look at the skills. I assume Handguns, Rifles, Blades, Street Brawler, Annihilation and Cold Blood are related to combat. Given there is Device Hacking and Target Hacking I'd also assume the latter relates to combat. Right there you have 6/12 or 7/12 highly related to combat.

Stealth, Athletics and Crafting are a bit more blurry. If I were to guess all three of those probably relate to combat either directly, indirectly or both in some capacity (abilities related to takedowns/taking enemies out without being detected, movement/damage reduction or avoidance, creating improvements for combat purposes, this sort of thing).

This leaves Engineering. I wouldn't be surprised if they do something weird there and make smart guns tie into it somehow. My gut is feeling an Outer Worlds science weapon vibe here, honestly (too bad we don't get a shrink gun in CP.... or do we? It could be a good thing to covertly pair with nipple tasers for complete coverage... :)). Because, well, I guess it needs a combat niche. Some of that is based on the capstone for tech weapon damage listed there. It's arguably not much to go on.

I guess you could make any of these have some non-combat applications. Even the weapon skills. Maybe an NPC is so impressed by your characters ability to clean or disassemble/reassemble a gun they're influenced by it, for instance (shit example, I know... gets the point across though). Some of those skills have a bit more leeway there, obviously.

If you look around for info on the perks floating out there the picture doesn't get better.

Yeah, it would be cool to have this type of info. Even if it's in a very basic, spoiler free form (ideally). It's a finished game, after all. I'd guess most of this stuff is done or how it's intended to be done is established by the developers. I suspect the hold-up there is the new and improved delay. The hype train needs spread out further, basically.
 
Do points need to be spent on passive abilities OR
are those an actual passive ability awarded with a main ability upgrade?
 
Do points need to be spent on passive abilities OR
are those an actual passive ability awarded with a main ability upgrade?
Some passives come from perks (some perks grant only passives). And some come from the skills themselves (accuracy with guns for example).
 
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