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Two hotfixes in less than a week? That's pretty impressive. I honestly like all these changes. If you honestly feel Dettlaff: Higher Vampire didn't deserve a nerf, you are nuts my friend.
2 charges are fine, otherwise it's a potential 15 points card, it's a bit too much considering it's automatically respawn on the same turn.
Exactly! It's definitely still a good card. It was just over-tuned. I mean, they had to properly balance 100+ cards so I guess it's okay for a few to slip out.
What do you mean? The cards that were nerfed are still good. Dettlaff has a potential of 9 points and the Higher Vampire version is still really great. There are still a ton of vampire cards that are good in Monsters. Hell, they're one of the strongest factions currently.
Quote edited. -Drac
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Sounds like Dettlaff is now a mediocre leader at best.
Well deserved nerf! Got sick from all the Detlaff bois. Maybe all these netdeckers are going to try a different leader now. Or like always, spam the next broken deck.
I don't understand the Eskel+Vesemir+Lambert nerf.
Previously, this was a "9str unit" that cost 21 food + thin 2, which was fine enough to see play in most decks (because of the T1 alpha strike, esp if you add Roach to that)
=> now this is a "6str unit" that cost 24 food + thin 2.
The question is : does thin 2 cost 18 food (aka 18 str aka you need to bonify your deck by 18 when thinning).
=> I think Vesemir could be set at str 3 or 4, because that jumped from good cards to bad cards. You don't have alpha strike + this cost way too much food to consider even a good thinning solution.
=> that alpha strike was a 28 food investment. It is now a 34 food investiment that got nerf by 3str. aka by 9str.
At this point, this is not an educated nerf, it is a gamedesign decision.
The impact on the game without access to cheaper thinning is now Gwent transformed into a very randomized engine-land. This removed more skill and put randomized draws instead. Find a synergy, put lots of cards together and hope for RNG.
Add to this :
- +101 cards to the pool, meaning deck diversity you face is growing (so you need more stability to face this, unless you gamedesign dice + chifoumi and call this a strategy game).
- Birna Bran is thin 2 + str 5 but got nerfed by 1 food. Compared to Witchers, should she cost 23 "minus discards" ?
- Then you have Skalds that got -1str +1 food, putting them at 5 food => even in Bran this is Food negative. This is not normal.
- Roach +3 food nerf. Which is meh but still okay, I can understand.
Why not remove some food to Bran on top of this => welcome to Crimson random Curse, really.
That just killed Bran. Bran had good winrates, but not to the point to get like 10food nerfs like that. All previous deck got nerfed by 6 food, this is just... Wow.
The game need more thining solutions. Regular games can't roll through the full list, with a gold dillution of 1/25 and copper dillution of 2/25, coming from the regular boardgame industry where 1/15 is a 15 years norm, the game became really a dice thrower to say the least.
No tutors but combo moves that gives you like 10 or 20 str with two cards => this is the definition of random land.
Exemple :
- food cost of that card that buff +2str to 5 adjacent unit, outputting 10 str is 11. Okay, this is logical. Ignoring the 5 unit limitation, but let's say ok.
- food cost of that card that buff +10str to 1 unit is... 11. wtf, one unit ? Where is the difficulty of this, you can call this on the second card you play ?
I'm very disapointed by that extention. I'm trying to optimise a Bran list the best I can and result is low on each ressource, a deck that can't win regularly and basically stuck at "can't change stuff". This just nailed the game in a random drawing coffin I can't move out for me.
Bran is supposed to be the most stable guy, but it is stable to output low-level stuff OR play random OP engine decks that draws whatever stuff that synergy between themselves, and then buy a new 25 cards list if you want to change faction just for lulz because you construct your deck with over-speciallized cards and B&B cards are food negative for most decks now.
Why ? Are Bran W/R still in the high 70% now ? I was winning 2 games out of 3. I win now 2 games out of 5 or maybe 6. Put those W/R to 50/50 and you won't see me wondering what happened.
Previously, this was a "9str unit" that cost 21 food + thin 2, which was fine enough to see play in most decks (because of the T1 alpha strike, esp if you add Roach to that)
=> now this is a "6str unit" that cost 24 food + thin 2.
The question is : does thin 2 cost 18 food (aka 18 str aka you need to bonify your deck by 18 when thinning).
=> I think Vesemir could be set at str 3 or 4, because that jumped from good cards to bad cards. You don't have alpha strike + this cost way too much food to consider even a good thinning solution.
=> that alpha strike was a 28 food investment. It is now a 34 food investiment that got nerf by 3str. aka by 9str.
At this point, this is not an educated nerf, it is a gamedesign decision.
The impact on the game without access to cheaper thinning is now Gwent transformed into a very randomized engine-land. This removed more skill and put randomized draws instead. Find a synergy, put lots of cards together and hope for RNG.
Add to this :
- +101 cards to the pool, meaning deck diversity you face is growing (so you need more stability to face this, unless you gamedesign dice + chifoumi and call this a strategy game).
- Birna Bran is thin 2 + str 5 but got nerfed by 1 food. Compared to Witchers, should she cost 23 "minus discards" ?
- Then you have Skalds that got -1str +1 food, putting them at 5 food => even in Bran this is Food negative. This is not normal.
- Roach +3 food nerf. Which is meh but still okay, I can understand.
Why not remove some food to Bran on top of this => welcome to Crimson random Curse, really.
That just killed Bran. Bran had good winrates, but not to the point to get like 10food nerfs like that. All previous deck got nerfed by 6 food, this is just... Wow.
The game need more thining solutions. Regular games can't roll through the full list, with a gold dillution of 1/25 and copper dillution of 2/25, coming from the regular boardgame industry where 1/15 is a 15 years norm, the game became really a dice thrower to say the least.
No tutors but combo moves that gives you like 10 or 20 str with two cards => this is the definition of random land.
Exemple :
- food cost of that card that buff +2str to 5 adjacent unit, outputting 10 str is 11. Okay, this is logical. Ignoring the 5 unit limitation, but let's say ok.
- food cost of that card that buff +10str to 1 unit is... 11. wtf, one unit ? Where is the difficulty of this, you can call this on the second card you play ?
I'm very disapointed by that extention. I'm trying to optimise a Bran list the best I can and result is low on each ressource, a deck that can't win regularly and basically stuck at "can't change stuff". This just nailed the game in a random drawing coffin I can't move out for me.
Bran is supposed to be the most stable guy, but it is stable to output low-level stuff OR play random OP engine decks that draws whatever stuff that synergy between themselves, and then buy a new 25 cards list if you want to change faction just for lulz because you construct your deck with over-speciallized cards and B&B cards are food negative for most decks now.
Why ? Are Bran W/R still in the high 70% now ? I was winning 2 games out of 3. I win now 2 games out of 5 or maybe 6. Put those W/R to 50/50 and you won't see me wondering what happened.
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Is it just me or is anyone else getting this issue:
the premium Traveling Merchant will go purple with background with some kind of cursive looking text going from left to right seemingly at random in hand or on the filed with no way of reproducing it with it not occurring in the deck builder as far as I'm aware
also
I noticed the premium Aelirenn Scoia'tael animation be bugged with her left arm that swings the sword clipping through her torso off and on, but for the most part making her look like she's missing an arm while swinging the sword out of view with her left hand on her right hand side
the premium Traveling Merchant will go purple with background with some kind of cursive looking text going from left to right seemingly at random in hand or on the filed with no way of reproducing it with it not occurring in the deck builder as far as I'm aware
also
I noticed the premium Aelirenn Scoia'tael animation be bugged with her left arm that swings the sword clipping through her torso off and on, but for the most part making her look like she's missing an arm while swinging the sword out of view with her left hand on her right hand side
I would have preferred that they decrease his provisions to 11 or 12 and have him keep his 2 damage pings. Dettlaff enabled a new playstyle for MO that will now likely wither away until further updates. I'm sceptical about three 1 dmg pings being enough for an efficient control deck; players using Dettlaff after this nerf will probably go for a point-slam oriented approach which is more of the same (bring on the Speartip and more thrive units).
It's too bad really. Some of the nerfs recently have been very questionable (Eredin, Witchers, Spear & Shield). It feels like CDPR presses the panic button when there are outcries from the community and fail to bring overpowered/overused cards to a sweet spot where they can still be used competitively. It's good that they have a hands-on approach in terms of balancing the game but there's a lack of "know how" sometimes when they do decide to make changes.
Before the nerf, Dettlaff: Higher Vampire was at worst 5 points and at best 20 points for 10 provisions. That was just insane. How can you think this was okay? No other 10 provision card can get you that much value that easily. 5 or 15 for 10 seems much more reasonable now. You just need something to get that value which isn't all that hard unless you're facing Nilfgaard.
Also, I know you don't like the change to Dettlaff (leader) so let me help you understand why this is perfectly okay. Monsters have a lot of cards to support the vampire archetype. Dettlaff isn't JUST a control leader, that's what all of you who are upset don't understand. You see three pings of damage but completely forget about his true potential. He is at best 9 points. Which is five more points than Eithne at her best. He also supports the card Crimson Curse and the Vampire archetype in general. He also has a pretty decent provision cost.
Dettlaff decks were absolutely ridiculous and they deserved a nerf. They have removal, movement, engines, small AND tall units. They still have all that. Three points less of damage isn't going to kill the leader.
People can think whatever they want but you're kind of spot on here. The card only took a single turn of setup and the counters consisted of locks, which can be countered themselves, banish, which takes additional damage to work outside of Gaunter, and potentially tall removal. If anything is/was objectively overpowered it was that card. 15 value in an ideal case is much more reasonable. Even then 15 value for 10p is still quite good, even if it can be countered.
Dettlaff wasn't a problem exclusively because of the leader. It's more the entire package. The tools available to MS and certain neutrals paired with it. As much as it did need nerfed I think this is yet another example of changing a single number to make a problem go away.
There are faction-specific lock units for SK, ST, NG (quite obviously) & NR. Guess what? All of them trade up in terms of provisions when locking Dettlaff HV. It is sensible to run at least 1 lock for other match ups as well given that most decks have something that brings added value to the board after the turn that they're played. So this is not a case of having a dead card in hand vs. an absence of Dettlaff HV as it were for artifact removal cards that were included for the sole purpose of countering Spears/Sihil.
Should I mention all the other cards that suppress Dettlaff HV? I feel like I shouldn't have to but I'll take the time to answer you as you did for me.
Dorregaray of Vole, Aguarra, Geralt: Yrden (on Kayran), Leo (on Kayran), Geralt of Rivia (on Kayran), Peter (on Kayran), Scorch (on Kayran), Curse of Corruption (on Kayran), Crach ping + Regis Bloodlust/Ifrit/bombs, Eithne ping + Regis Bloodlust/Ifrit/bombs, Dettlaff ping + Regis Bloodlust/Ifrit/bombs, Brouver ping + Regis Bloodlust/Ifrit/bombs.
Now let me explain to you why the leader nerf is not fine. The change doesn't further enable the vampire archetype; it further disables it with the less likely outcome of Dettlaff spawning a token. Dettlaff is a control leader by design and 9 points of "true potential" won't always be achievable just like how you can fathom that a succession of NR engines could theoretically bring X amount of points if they all survive. Crach is a non-conditional 8 points, Woodland is a non-conditional 8 points, Meve is a non-conditional 8 points... so what of it?
Also, don't mention Crimson Curse for the sake of me taking your argument seriously. CC is not a competitive card.
I stand by it: The nerf should have been to bring his provisions down to still make him a prominent leader in the meta without having him completely dominating it. Woodland will likely replace him now.