[#10127] You have reached your quota of positive votes for the dayGeraltofbsas said:I disagree, i think TW2's story was easy enough to understand, and if you actually care about the game, like most did, the journal provides you with more than enough background to get into it.
As you probably know, that you dont like something, doesnt mean its wrong or its because a fault it has, and if we add that you dont care for the books or the first game, then its likely you just dont even like the universe much, but rather secondary things attached to it that might entertain you, like in this case, gameplay or graphics or whatever, cause you did say you liked the game.
Not all things in life can be made in a way that they appeal to you or to everyone without sacrificing what they were meant to be, there is a threshold where no matter how well done is something, some people still wont feel attracted to it, and its perfectly natural. This is why different genres exists actually.
I say this because while TW2 wasnt perfect, its a sequel, and it has 9 books behind it, so if you actually like the universe to begin with, but truly cant get into it even when you like it, whats logically going to happen? you'll try to see if the first game or the books can get you into it, because its a matter of accessibility. You want to get into the content, but have some problems, so you try by other means to access it.
But if you dont even want that to happen, you cant realistically expect the game to drag you into it all by itself. A minimal level of pure basic interest has to exists within the person playing it, and a game can and should make you feel welcomed into the universe, but a game cant make you want to be welcomed into it, and not only you have the journal but you have internet too to clear some doubts about what are the different countries fighting for or whats their history.
It may be that you just have an extremely low level of interest and appeal for the witcher universe, and im sorry to say that while that can change a bit, it wouldnt be right to ask for it.
You like monster hunting, alright, but thats just one part of many that the witcher universe has and is loved for, so unfortunately it'd be unfair if the witcher suddenly turns all into monster hunting, wich is what you thought the game was about and should've been, and abandons all other things that were in it, like the politics for example.
Also, if i had a coin for everytime i've heard someone couldnt follow or get into a movie/game/storyline/etc, and it turned out that the art was perfectly fine but it was the person that didnt even felt interested into to it so they lacked attention, i'd have like...hundreds of dollars/pesos/>
It was either what you have now or treating the players who majority have read the books and played the first game like idiots. A lot of us already know what the politics are and we don't have to spoonfed what everyone feels about a stuff in the game.JSPoole said:
It'll help if you were specific as to what parts you didn't like and how you think they should've been handled.
I went into the 2nd game on 360 with no clue what a witcher even was. I took it slow and paced myself. If you read the codex entries then it really clears things up. Honestly, if you dont like reading this may not be the best game for you. I'm not saying you wont enjoy it, but you may not get as much out of it as the guy who likes reading the codex and in game books. Also, the wiki did an amazing job on explaining things as well.
No, it's not. Can you be more specific what the mistake was exactly?Triangles said:
There was enough information within the game, the journal for example.
But you have to read it, no one will do that for you.
The audacity of some people to blame the game developers for bad design, when they apparently are lazy enough to not be able to read a bit on the web and just want to be spoon fed.
No one read 2nd or 3rd book in the series, skips previous ones and expect to know and understand everything, then why is it acceptable for story driven games?
It's like expecting return of the king to have blow by blow summary of what happened in fellowship of the ring and two towers.
If you really want to know everything then play tw1, read witcher books, check wiki or at least game's journal.
It's like expecting return of the king to have blow by blow summary of what happened in fellowship of the ring and two towers.
If you really want to know everything then play tw1, read witcher books, check wiki or at least game's journal.
Hey first of all i dont think you're bashing the game or whatever, but i want to ask you, did you start in the Dragon Age world by playing the second game first? or did you start watching/reading the game of thrones universe from the middle?JSPoole said:
I guarantee that 90% of the people who played Skyrim had little idea of the depth of lore behind the game. That's because it's presented as a lighthearted fantasy dungeon delver, and the more sophisticated stuff is under the hood and requires some reading and analysis.
The Witcher games put more of the sophistication on display, because they're more cinematic games, and they refuse to dumb down smart dialogue or complex story lines because some people might not be able to keep up or willing to try to figure things out. There is some validity to the criticism that you don't get much of an introduction to what witchers are or how the world state got to be the way it is. But it is the 2nd game in the series, so that's to be expected. If they started the game with a tedious exposition rather than just throwing you in, there would be people criticizing that.
As for comparing the world to ASoIaF (not even going to mention Thedas because that's cartoonland in comparison), the milieu is different, but Sapkowski's world is well drawn and compelling. It is more of a late medieval and Slavic/ Central European vibe than ASoIaF's War of the Roses. Both authors draw on their knowledge of history as well as myth and both do a good job of it.
The Witcher games put more of the sophistication on display, because they're more cinematic games, and they refuse to dumb down smart dialogue or complex story lines because some people might not be able to keep up or willing to try to figure things out. There is some validity to the criticism that you don't get much of an introduction to what witchers are or how the world state got to be the way it is. But it is the 2nd game in the series, so that's to be expected. If they started the game with a tedious exposition rather than just throwing you in, there would be people criticizing that.
As for comparing the world to ASoIaF (not even going to mention Thedas because that's cartoonland in comparison), the milieu is different, but Sapkowski's world is well drawn and compelling. It is more of a late medieval and Slavic/ Central European vibe than ASoIaF's War of the Roses. Both authors draw on their knowledge of history as well as myth and both do a good job of it.
The Witcher 2 had an extremely thick plot. New concepts, characters, factions and ideas were introduced in a machine-gun fashion. It tried to juggle plots at several levels and couldn't get proper exposition for all of them.Veleda said:
As someone who didn't read the books I did follow the plot, more or less. Find the kingslayer who turns out is working for some emperor in the south who's trying to incite war via pinning the death of kings of the north on the mages.
The nuances however still elude me. I know what the Scoiatel are but I don't know which faction Roche and his blue stripes have allegiance to. I know there's a lodge but the only character I remember by name was Triss and couldn't tell you which sorceresses plotted against which.
I could tell you something about the wild hunt and how Geralt was supposedly a wraith rider at some point but I don't have a clue what happened in Rivia or why he got mistaken for a haystack.
I do recall Thaler and know that Dandelion is a spy, but I couldn't tell you who are those two working for. I don't know who the Order of the Rose nor Floatsam's boss guy is working for.
And it's not because I don't like politics - I enjoy game of thrones immensely along with it's fine, measured political intrigue.
W2's plot is extremely ambitious as the player is expected to go from completely clueless to expert in politics. Particularly jarring are moments when the player character starts going off on politics I, the player, have no idea about. This pace forces extensive exposition dumps as simply there's no other practical way to convey that information in a more natural tone.
I am sorry, but if you didnt know that Roche is immensely loyal to Temeria you can not have paid enough attention. You just cant.
The abundance of Books ! Well written - various ones tell the story of the same events through the eyes of the different races - which is quite a realistic portrayal of history, which I appreciate, and definitely adds to the ambiance, if not entirely responsible for it.Veleda said:
My understanding is these were designed by the guy - whose name I forget - who used to have Todds job. It seems to me the best of them by far originate with Morrowind and before (a game thats been on my desktop since release, which unfortunately cant be said of its successors).
I think it's fair for me to say tho, that the upcoming related game may be closer to this past than the present edition, and I don't mean its internal chronology.
@Fizzbizz: read the codex, its excellent and its all there.
JSPoole said:
From what I saw in your OP ... You don't play RPGs the way they are meant to be played.
Hardcore true RPGs would require you to know about the lore and background of the game world, Witcher 2 had really good journals that you could read to understand the lore, though if you did not do that, then I'm afraid you were doing it wrong from the first place.
The reason why Skyrim got away with not letting people really delve into its lore is because the game is not focused at the lore and story at all ... Hell .. The CIVIL WAR IN SKYRIM is not even that important to the game world, after I supported Ulfric and liberated Skryim ... The NPCs react like you are just a commoner when you SAVED THEIR LANDS FROM THE THALMOR!
Different games for different tastes, but please try to immerse yourself in the world when playing RPGs, it's how it's meant to be played, and that's why I love them.
Then read the in-game journals, lolTriangles said:
Design mistake my buttocks.
He'sfizzbizz said:
interrogating Geralt under suspicion of killing Foltest, and in hot pursuit of Foltest's killer,
I take your word for it, since I came into TW2 well versed in the world, but geez. It's hard to imagine even that escaped people. I'm sorry, I simply don't want to sit through the cutscenes that it would require to get people up to speed. I have to join the chorus saying "read the codex already." Maybe that's just not the habit of modern gamers, but that's why people complain about casuals.