Oversexualizaton in Cyberpunk

[KnightofPhoenix]

I've always said story should dictate this issue if they want to avoid fanservice. Show skin and sex where the story and setting call for it, problem solved. We can be sure if The Witcher games seemed slanted in a sexist direction ( to some) this game is really going to get their panties in a twist. And so be it. CDPR is not beholden to the modern idea of equality.

The problem with the Witcher is that it sometimes showed skin when the story doesn't call for it, quite the opposite (Saskia and Ves).
So it's something CDPR needs to be aware of, and consider that a balanced oversexualization would fit the setting better and would be a testimony to their sense of social responsibility.

Because just like I don't want to see games where they portray race X as all criminals, animals and thieves, I don't want to see a game where only women are sexualized and / or have no depth or character. It's really a fair request, that doesn't compromise the "edgy" or the setting, quite the opposite.

 

[Aver]

Yea they don't in normal life because it's not considered as acceptable for a mess of reasons that I won't get into now.

But go on Tumblr and follow women, and you'll be seeing a lot of male butt shots on your dash. Last one I saw was a few seconds ago

Yes, I know, but we are talking about everyday life - about what guys should wear on streets. In proper clubs (strip clubs) it's ok if guys would wear sexy clothes.

Guys watch porno in the Internet, but they don't want to see naked women on the streets (at least most of guys) .

 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Yes, I know, but we are talking about everyday life - about what guys should wear on streets. In proper clubs (strip clubs) it's ok if guys would wear sexy clothes.

Yea, but it's 2077. CDPR has a lot of leeway and flexibility with the setting, much more than the Witcher.

 

[gregski]

So it's something CDPR needs to be aware of, and consider that a balanced oversexualization would fit the setting better and would be a testimony to their sense of social responsibility.

Because just like I don't want to see games where they portray race X as all criminals, animals and thieves, I don't want to see a game where only women are sexualized and / or have no depth or character. It's really a fair request, that doesn't compromise the "edgy" or the setting, quite the opposite.

Wait, what sense of social responsibility are you talking about? Any examples? And since when is it a requirement for a game developer to be socially responsible?

 

[Aver]

Yea, but it's 2077. CDPR has a lot of leeway and flexibility with the setting, much more than the Witcher.

But still it would look ridiculous and stupid if they would wear clothes that you can see on tumblr etc. I expect to see guys in unbuttoned shirts and stuff like that, but nothing more.

 

[racan]

The problem with the Witcher is that it sometimes showed skin when the story doesn't call for it, quite the opposite (Saskia and Ves).
So it's something CDPR needs to be aware of, and consider that a balanced oversexualization would fit the setting better and would be a testimony to their sense of social responsibility.

Because just like I don't want to see games where they portray race X as all criminals, animals and thieves, I don't want to see a game where only women are sexualized and / or have no depth or character. It's really a fair request, that doesn't compromise the "edgy" or the setting, quite the opposite.

I suppose that's a good point. Both men and women can be sexualised. It's more an issue of keeping the appeal to the audience. What do you do, penis augmentations? Modifications for a "perfect", male model appearance?

 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Wait, what sense of social responsibility are you talking about? Any examples? And since when is it a requirement for a game developer to be socially responsible?

For instance, having a nuanced portrayal of people from other races or cultures and not portraying them as maniacs is social responsibility. Violence against children is generally not allowed in games for that reason. Heck, CDPR removed a carpet with a mosque on it as it was in a brothel, which really doesn't fit there.

It is not a requirement, but it will not have my respect and more often then not, socially awareness leads to better and more refined writing, as it understands the different perspectives that surrounds an issue.

And no, social responsibility does not mean no sex or nakedness, I'm fully in support of that. It does not mean no blood or violence, I'm also in support of that (though I am not a fan of making it banal and with no point). It does not mean "prudishness." It just means having nuance. A good thing.

 

[Aver]

So it's something CDPR needs to be aware of, and consider that a balanced oversexualization would fit the setting better and would be a testimony to their sense of social responsibility.

Because just like I don't want to see games where they portray race X as all criminals, animals and thieves, I don't want to see a game where only women are sexualized and / or have no depth or character. It's really a fair request, that doesn't compromise the "edgy" or the setting, quite the opposite

Well, your favorite tv series portrayed all female characters as weak, emotionally unstable and easily manipulated persons. On other hand all important persons, mob leaders and powerful characters are male and they are strong, smart etc..

 

[KnightofPhoenix]

But still it would look ridiculous and stupid if they would wear clothes that you can see on tumblr etc. I expect to see guys in unbuttoned shirts and stuff like that, but nothing more.

Well to me a woman walking with her panties is stupid. And for a lot of women, how the media portrays women, especially those who are supposed to be fighters, is stupid. Ves' outfit for instance is ridiculous.

And that's precisely the point. If CDPR wants to shock us with *real* oversexualization, nothing would be more efficient than a man walking in the streets with a thong or just underwear. Because there's nothing shocking, or new, or oversexualized, with women in skimpy outfits. The sad reality is that this became extremely common in media. So they are not being edgy by indulging in something everyone else does.

And if men get uncomfortable, well welcome to the level of objectification women have to endure on a daily basis.

 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Well, your favorite tv series portrayed all female characters as weak, emotionally unstable and easily manipulated persons. On other hand all important persons, mob leaders and powerful characters are male and they are strong, smart etc..

Which show are your referring to?

Breaking Bad? Skyler is my 3rd favorite character and she is extremity strong and smart.

 

[Aver]

And that's precisely the point. If CDPR wants to shock us with *real* oversexualization, nothing would be more efficient than a man walking in the streets with a thong or just underwear. Because there's nothing shocking, or new, or oversexualized, with women in skimpy outfits. The sad reality is that this became extremely common in media. So they are not being edgy by indulging in something everyone else does.

Man walking in thongs wouldn't be considered as symbol of sexualzation, but as something funny, stupid. Gamers would see him as joke etc. so he wouldn't fulfill his role.

Skyler is my 3rd favorite character and she is extremity strong and smart.

She has her moments, but for most of time she is dominated by White and in later seasons she is too busy crying to act smart.

 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Man walking in thongs wouldn't be considered as symbol of sexualzation, but as something funny, stupid. Gamers would see him as joke etc. so he wouldn't fulfill his role.

Women or gay men maybe wouldn't. Because they do exist as gamers and in a larger share.

So if you are going for oversexualization, make it balanced. Some men might find a thong wearing guy stupid. Some women might find the female equivalent stupid. But overall, everyone is decadent and hyper-sexual in that setting. Isn't that what they should be striving for?

 

[gregski]

It is not a requirement, but it will not have my respect and more often then not, socially awareness leads to better and more refined writing, as it understands the different perspectives that surrounds an issue.

Wait, I know one game dev that's very socially aware and inclusive. Bioware. Better and more refined writing, you say?

 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Wait, I know one game dev that's very socially aware and inclusive. Bioware. Better and more refined writing, you say?

Yea, here we go with bioware.

I'll give them credit where credit is due. Yes the inclusion of 2 gay characters in ME3 was excellent. They have people of color, though not really great/ Yes some of their female characters are good (though some have ridiculous outfits like Miranda, with the camera focusing on her ass to the point where I lol).
But no, overall they do not have writing I consider good.

And it is not because of being socially aware and inclusive. It has more to do with idiocy.

 

[Aver]

Women or gay men maybe wouldn't. Because they do exist as gamers and in a larger share.

So if you are going for oversexualization, make it balanced. Some men might find a thong wearing guy stupid. Some women might find the female equivalent stupid. But overall, everyone is decadent and hyper-sexual in that setting. Isn't that what they should be striving for?

Maybe they would find guys in thongs on the street sexy, but I bet that at the same time they would consider it as something funny or stupid.

Same thing happened with Hitman. Guys consider sexy killer nuns in Hitman as sexy, but at the same time they consider them as something extremely stupid.

 

[racan]

Well to me a woman walking with her panties is stupid. And for a lot of women, how the media portrays women, especially those who are supposed to be fighters, is stupid. Ves' outfit for instance is ridiculous.

And that's precisely the point. If CDPR wants to shock us with *real* oversexualization, nothing would be more efficient than a man walking in the streets with a thong or just underwear. Because there's nothing shocking, or new, or oversexualized, with women in skimpy outfits. The sad reality is that this became extremely common in media. So they are not being edgy by indulging in something everyone else does.

And if men get uncomfortable, well welcome to the level of objectification women have to endure on a daily basis.

A woman walking with her panties is stupid, but hey, that's the rule of chainmail bikinis. The less physical coverage, the more protection it provides.

At the same time, if sexuality is used as a weapon, it can make women feel powerful - those that have sex appeal, at least.

You don't really sexualise men by putting them in a bikini (designed to emphasise the female figure). You might push an ideal of well-trained abs and an enhanced package.

Superhero comics oversexualise men, in a way. At least for those who are attracted to muscular figures. The readers just don't tend to realise that batman comics could be sexualised.

 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Maybe they would find guys in thongs on the street sexy, but I bet that at the same time they would consider it as something funny or stupid.

Same thing happened with Hitman. Guys consider sexy killer nuns in Hitman as sexy, but at the same time they considered it as something extremely stupid.

Stupidity and oversexualization are not mutual opposites, in fact they kinda go hand in hand.

I'm a straight guy and most of the time I find that over-sexualized women look stupid. The important thing for a game, that it's done in context. So no half naked police or fighting women. Just like no half naked fighting guy.

It's fine if people think it's stupid, as long as the ambiance for over-sexualization is there, and it would be much mroe strongly felt if men are as over-sexualized as women.

 

[KnightofPhoenix]

You don't really sexualise men by putting them in a bikini (designed to emphasise the female figure). You might push an ideal of well-trained abs and an enhanced package.

Says who? I know a lot of women who like seeing male butts I assure you. And thighs.
The enhanced abs is more a male power trip we have going on. You don't see batman posing in a sexually suggestive way, like say wonder woman even though nothing in her character even remotely suggests she'd do such a thing. Yes fan of the hawkeye initiative.

 

[Garrison72]

Yea, here we go with bioware.

And it is not because of being socially aware and inclusive. It has more to do with idiocy.

That and they try too hard, so their efforts are painfully transparent. I don't feel CDPR has a social responsibility, which is where you and I will never meet on the issue despite agreeing on 90% of it.

edit-actually, it's not that they try too hard, I see their efforts at being inclusive and socially responsible as superficial.

 

[Aver]

Stupidity and oversexualization are not mutual opposites, in fact they kinda go hand in hand.

I'm a straight guy and most of the time I find that over-sexualized women look stupid. The important thing for a game, that it's done in context. So no half naked police or fighting women. Just like no half naked fighting guy.

It's fine if people think it's stupid, as long as the ambiance for over-sexualization is there, and it would be much mroe strongly felt if men are as over-sexualized as women.

I don't wanna see guys in thongs on the streets unless it would be an isolated case. Otherwise it will have this vibe of ridiculous comedy anime and whole atmosphere of dark corrupted world will go to hell.