PATCH 3.2 PATCH NOTES

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But it strengthens the idea of faction identity. And you still have Ves and Siege Support for the other cards.
yes but take a look at NR's Order cards... it's basically only prince, seltkirk and commando... sure these were the main ones anyway especially with him having boost 2, but they didn't have to be, now you don't have a choice, and you have to draw them or your zeal is useless... i was using both regis and ocvist and was happy with the results
 
yes but take a look at NR's Order cards... it's basically only prince, seltkirk and commando... sure these were the main ones anyway especially with him having boost 2, but they didn't have to be, now you don't have a choice, and you have to draw them or your zeal is useless... i was using both regis and ocvist and was happy with the results
NR has over 20 different cards which have order without already having Zeal. And even though some of them have Formation, giving them Zeal still means that you can get the Formation boost.
 
yes but take a look at NR's Order cards... it's basically only prince, seltkirk and commando... sure these were the main ones anyway especially with him having boost 2, but they didn't have to be, now you don't have a choice, and you have to draw them or your zeal is useless... i was using both regis and ocvist and was happy with the results

Hmmm, now that I think about it, you're right. It's not good, that the deckbuilding options are so shallow now, if you want to make use of "inspired zeal". I'd still say, I like it, when leader abilities don't work on neutrals, but I see your point.
 
I was hoping they would do more to Foltest honestely.

He is still unbelievabley strong, the only difference know is he can do some wrong, while before it was impossible for one to loose if not on purpose
 
NR has over 20 different cards which have order
You're still counting 1 damage bronzes which shouldn't really be the target of a 3 charge leader. Foltest isn't and shouldn't be a 6 point leader (and formation makes him into a worse Meve in that regard) and only limiting him to NR cards when he's currently the only zeal charge leader is actually a nerf to all the neutral order cards which were already only used mostly in novelty decks.
His main targets for zeal were always Seltkirk, Roche or Commandos and now instead of opening up the option of building unique decks that incorporate the already underplayed neutrals they're doubling down on Foltest's extremely stale set but bloating their provision costs. You'll still face the same Foltest decks minus Baron or Falibor.

And this idea that faction identity is only derived from the fact that a leader or card abilities are restricted to faction is completely asinine because neutrals exist. You're really just advocating for very restricted, stale and unimaginative sets and playstyles was the number 1 issue with the meta. DJ and Foltest barely used any neutral cards and they were horrible to play with or against. They shouldn't be examples of healthy faction leaders.
 
and only limiting him to NR cards when he's currently the only zeal charge leader is actually a nerf to all the neutral order cards which were already only used mostly in novelty decks
No, on the contrary it is in fact a buff to them in the long term. Currently every single one of them had to be balanced around Foltest, which meant that they were hardly useful without him. Without Foltest those cards can be buffed, similar to the neutral special cards, which were buffed after the Francesca change.


You're still counting 1 damage bronzes which shouldn't really be the target of a 3 charge leader. Foltest isn't and shouldn't be a 6 point leader
Normally they shouldn't be the target, but they can still be used as the target, if you had a bad draw. And their are still enough other great targets. If we ignore everything that deals only 1 damage or has Formation, there are still:
-Rayla: getting 1 extra turn out of it and instantly being inspired
-Sile, Ballista and Mauler: getting the 2 (extra) damage instantly instead of as an order can be worth in a lot of cases
-Anseis, Mad Kiyan and Seltkirk: all proffiting from the Zeal and extra boost
-Landsknecht, Priscilla and Bloody Baron: getting Zeal and Inspired
-Roche Merciless, Kaedweni Revenant, Blue Stripes Commando: else they are too easy to shut down

That are still 13 units that can benefit from Foltest, which is more than units that can be given charges.
 
No, on the contrary it is in fact a buff to them in the long term.
I see where you're coming from but the existence of provisions and Henselt sort of invalidate this point. I don't see any neutral order cards being too broken and at the same time if they were then they'd be costed appropriately in which case Foltest wouldn't be able to run the Draug package and instead relies on drawing this imaginary broken order neutral as the win con. If this card did exist and the major complaint last month was that card combo I would fully agree with you. At that point you could also just limit Foltest's abilities to bronze units or just make the last charge applicable to golds but that's a bit too restrictive for play order.

The rest of your list of interactions has some very odd conditional valuing because most of those would ironically actually make Foltest into less than a 6 point leader and give you only a 1-1.5 point edge as opposed to not using the charge at all.
 
I see where you're coming from but the existence of provisions and Henselt sort of invalidate this point. I don't see any neutral order cards being too broken and at the same time if they were then they'd be costed appropriately in which case Foltest wouldn't be able to run the Draug package and instead relies on drawing this imaginary broken order neutral as the win con. If this card did exist and the major complaint last month was that card combo I would fully agree with you. At that point you could also just limit Foltest's abilities to bronze units or just make the last charge applicable to golds but that's a bit too restrictive for play order.
Foltest has for most part of Homecoming being played with Seltkirk, Ocvist, Chort and Gaunter. Crimson Curse added to that Eyck and Anseis.
The reason why those cards aren't played currently is that most of them are rather expensive and Bloody Baron, Keira, Roche Merciless (and Draug) are expensive too and even better. So, after all them getting nerved, Foltest would surely return to his old regulars.
And the problem is not that those neutral cards are too strong/op. They have been balanced for Foltest, but that does mean that they are basically useless if you don't have a Zeal available. And furthermore, every neutral order card that would be introduced in the future would probably be only useable with Foltest, which is a huge restriction on design.

The rest of your list of interactions has some very odd conditional valuing because most of those would ironically actually make Foltest into less than a 6 point leader and give you only a 1-1.5 point edge as opposed to not using the charge at all.
You forget, that if an order ability isn't used immediantly there is the risk of not being able to use it at all, because the card might get shut down, locked, seized moved or whatever. And moreover being able to deal 1/2 damage earlier can decide games, because you are able to shut down an enemy.
What Foltest should therefore offer as a leader for NR isn't value but reliability. If you choose Foltest you should be sure that you will be able to use an order ability when you need it.
 
By using the word practically he means that the card didn't receive various changes that deserved equal to it's power, he is aware of the nerfs.
I mean, why they need to butcher the card? Also let's talk about the Foltest nerf as well, and Povetta nerfs, after all the cards are connected through synergy... Merciless was unplayable long enough it does not break the game, I am sorry I have to disagree and say that this nerf is perfect, and maybe too much!
 
So, after all them getting nerved, Foltest would surely return to his old regulars.
You seem to forget that Foltest was for the most part unplayable for the better part of the year before he was given such a big buff. I disagree that those cards were somehow balanced around Foltest since they already have access to zeal through other means and are already outclassed by other cards in the same faction (Anseis -> Seltkirk, Eyck -> Geralts or any other tall removal tool). Chorts are still 10 for 6 while wasting a leader charge (some decks outright discard it for value). Hardly impressive in the current meta. This just serves to show how finicky Foltest is to properly balance, not that these cards are somehow made worse because they can be given zeal. If the devs choose to balance them that way then they're simply going about it the wrong way.

You forget, that if an order ability isn't used immediantly there is the risk of not being able to use it at all, because the card might get shut down, locked, seized moved or whatever. And moreover being able to deal 1/2 damage earlier can decide games, because you are able to shut down an enemy.
I don't mean to sound rude but that's exactly how those cards are supposed to be used, and are currently balanced towards, which is to say they're meant to offer value for not being answered or to bait out the opponent's removal, locks etc etc. They just improve the odds of your better order cards or engines to stick which is why they're usually undercosted in provisions to make up for their conditional value. This just makes them a wasteful sink for leader charges since you're overvaluing them and imo just misplaying them.

Really though my point from the beginning was that it's pointless to limit the leader ability to just faction cards because you're locking out neutrals from that flexibility which would just leads to restrictive deck building, netdecking and nothing more. Cards shouldn't be balanced around leaders since the other way around is usually easier and more intuitive.
 
I think Sigvald need to be a 6 for 8 provisions, zeal, deal 1 damage to a unit. Berserk 5: deal 2 damage to a unit, because Sigvald need a sinergy with Queensguard to use him in decks without Svalblo. The only good card to use with Queensguard is Harald and the Svalblod ability.
 
Woah, really happy to get Dana at 16 provisions, Smugglers to 6 and both Harmony and Poison application for Weeping Willow! :D

Really like the look of these patch notes.
 
What about the bug where Serpent Trap does not prevent Syndicate's special cards from giving coins? Has that been fixed?
Yea, I'm also concerned about that. Would be extremely disappointing if it wasn't fixed.

Really sad that Call of the forest was changed. It had unique ability, now it's boring and probably will be used with Skaggs most of the time.
Mahakam Marauders also had interesting ability. Current "Get Vitality for X turns" - ultimately boring. Resilience as a mechanic became even more underrepresented.

About future leader change. Would be nice to have an option to "always show default opponent's leader". If 3d model is only cosmetics, it' s really easy to show it differently to me and opponent. Similar to battlefields.

Don't see Hemdal to be more popular with new ability. He was quite good. Why change?

Except for those mentioned above, patch is nice.
 
I mean, why they need to butcher the card? Also let's talk about the Foltest nerf as well, and Povetta nerfs, after all the cards are connected through synergy... Merciless was unplayable long enough it does not break the game, I am sorry I have to disagree and say that this nerf is perfect, and maybe too much!
Yeah I think Foltest is pretty descent now in overall level
 
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