You're kidding, right? Have you been here the past months where every single ST deck is using this idiotic dwarf package? At the very least his order should be barricade and he and Zoltan should have 0 base armor, that way the power level will be about the same but it will not be as good in non-dwarf decks anymore and we might actually see some diverse deck building from this faction again.
There's nothing inherently wrong - or idiotic - with the dwarf package. Unless you're offended by ST having decent 12 and 13p cards. There iS definitely something wrong with the rest of ST high end golds, though, which is why Zoltan and Munro are in every damn deck, regardless of synergies. I think making both of the cards less flexible and more dwarf-dependent is the right idea, but since we all know how things work around here, I'm expecting the devs to "fix" this issue by nerfing one or both of them to hell.
1. I don’t think either Zoltan or Munro need a nerf — deal with Renfri and you deal with the Munro/Zoltan decks. Unlike most of the good ST cards, both Munro and Zoltan are interactive and both have strategic limitations — unlike Simlas, they are the type card I like to see played.
2. If we ever want decent deck variety, we need to move away from the notion that every strong cards must be played in a particular archetype. Instead we need the cards to be equalized so that no card is autoinclude just because it is universally better than every other card available. Then actual synergies will determine cards that are played, while allowing unexpected combinations across archetypes. Ideally, more ST cards are brought to a competitive level, but barring that, I prefer to see Munro and Zoltan reduced to the level of other cards to having either artificially limited to a dwarf deck.
They have been plaguing the ladder ever since they first got buffed, meaning they were an issue before Renfri arrived, and will keep being so after she is nerfed as well. When she eventually gets nerfed pretty much every single common deck on the ladder right now gets nerfed, since they are all using her as well.
I understand your reasoning in this, but I disagree with it. Supporting different archetypes is ultimately the thing that is going to create the most deck diversity, otherwise every faction will just have one deck that is a collection of the currently strongest cards, there will never be perfect balance so this is bound to happen. Plus decks feel like they have a stronger identity and more soul when the cards thematically feel like they belong together.
We already had this discussion in another thread but I will give my update and say I made it to 2630+ with elves last season, which is the highest I've ever been with any faction. If that doesn't prove it to be T1 I guess I will have to aim 2.7k next time, not this joke season though when everyone is playing a Tinboy without tribute, 7 point body and a leader ability on top of it, can only laugh at how stupid this card is as I typed that out, lol.
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Not really the same discussion,
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Ideally, every archtype should have high end autoinclude cards because of the synergies and THEN flexible high end cards that work with the list and can be inserted depending on your goals or preferences. We have a decent example of this in Symbiosis: Eithne, Simlas and FP are autoinclude, but then you have Oak, Gezras and Filavandrel who are the flexible touches. That, to me, is the "good" variety. A meta of a dozen Renfri decks - though all "different" because they are all from different factions/leaders, is not the variety I want. Same goes for 6 "different" Zoltan-Munro ST decks.
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But I think if one looks at the “dwarf package” a little deeper, one will find the problem with its prevalence stems from neither Munro nor Zoltan — it stems from Dwarven Chariot!
And it’s not that Chariot is that good (it’s essentially only 7 for 5 with nice synergies), it’s that ST has very few decent bronze cards — and many of those (Cat Witcher, Hamadryad, Hawker Smuggler) are very archetype locked.
I believe players chose Chariot because it was the best option for a bronze slot, then added a couple of the dwarves that synergized well and made Chariot into an actually good card.
Again, if there were decent balance between cards across the board (rather than the huge focus on OP supercards), the game would be in a much better state.
I think zoltan should have 0 amor, to force players use him more in dwarf decks.
He should be, deploy if your starting deck has 10 or more dwarfs gain 1 armor.
The same goes to Munro, His order needs to work only with barricade and He needs to have 0 armor and with The same zoltan deploy.
So in dwarves deck they change nothing.
In other decks they are still playable, but need some setups (not too much since that card can Give them armor easily)
He should be, deploy if your starting deck has 10 or more dwarfs gain 1 armor.
The same goes to Munro, His order needs to work only with barricade and He needs to have 0 armor and with The same zoltan deploy.
So in dwarves deck they change nothing.
In other decks they are still playable, but need some setups (not too much since that card can Give them armor easily)
I dont know about you guys, but i have better winrates against NG Assimilate Renfri and SK pirates than ST this season, i actually dread more seeing those dwarves than Renfri herself (most players dont know how to select the best curse/blessing combo for the situation), i've even been considering doing an anti deck, since they're used in every ST deck anyway.
I agree the best solution is to nerf them in non-dwarf decks and keep their current strength in dwarf decks, but that would require a finesse the dev team does not possess.
I agree the best solution is to nerf them in non-dwarf decks and keep their current strength in dwarf decks, but that would require a finesse the dev team does not possess.
I don't know about you guys, but I have not seen many dwarves at all. What I see is a sea of black... you know, that annoying black with the sun on their shields.
Closer to the end of each month NG gets a grasp of the current meta, adjusts and gets too popular. And it works pretty well indeed. Flexibility in the end beats almost everything.
So, next patch - nerf Renfri and then NG assimilate. Make it a surprise, will you? Replace Double Cross ability with something else.
Closer to the end of each month NG gets a grasp of the current meta, adjusts and gets too popular. And it works pretty well indeed. Flexibility in the end beats almost everything.
So, next patch - nerf Renfri and then NG assimilate. Make it a surprise, will you? Replace Double Cross ability with something else.
I'm in pro rank, all I see is SK and ST, NG is still too good for pubbers but Monro is toxic works very well with Renfri handbuff.
If you include armor (which you should) Chariot is 10 points for 5, plus it comes as an armor engine. Given that damage based removal is close to 80% of removal in this game, generally the armor points get fully utilized in the overwhelming majority of matchups. It's currently one of the best, if not the best, bronzes in the game. 5 for 10 plus a +1 engine every turn? Yikes.
Dwarven Chariot is definitely overturned, should cost 6 provisions or the main chariot should be nerfed down to 1 pt 1 armor.
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If you include armor (which you should) Chariot is 10 points for 5, plus it comes as an armor engine. Given that damage based removal is close to 80% of removal in this game, generally the armor points get fully utilized in the overwhelming majority of matchups. It's currently one of the best, if not the best, bronzes in the game. 5 for 10 plus a +1 engine every turn? Yikes.
Dwarven Chariot is definitely overturned, should cost 6 provisions or the main chariot should be nerfed down to 1 pt 1 armor.
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