Patchnotes 7.3

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I hope you do realise how bad a card that necessitates Heatwave is for the game. Being forced into obligatory 10-point inclusion is bad enough on its own, but also has a derivative problem of breaking devotion.

Also "few" is a severe understatement. Fangs reach 12 for 8 upon killing a 4 pt body which is in line with other 4p cards, but doing so they also probably prevents a decent amount of value...and that means everything above 4p gives them even bigger advantage, so the only contexts where they don't play for a lot of points is either control, swarm or unitless(or maybe, just maybe some kind of janky ultrahardcore hybrid pointslam) which amounts to not even 30% of all the viable decks. So... everything else either struggles or is outright unplayable. I've mentioned it before, but don't mind repeating - the only reason Ball hasn't been as successful recently is that symbiosis/SW/warriors stuff is more broken.
Yet how many ST/NR/SK players you know do not play one of those decks? None of them are barely touched this patch. Those decks are particularly popular playing pro rank. Reality right now is if you play NG, there's no real hope you can go far. And if you play ball, once on pro ranks, you barely stand a chance.

And you say the existence of ball forces many players to break devotion. But that's the point. There's no doubt SK and NR enjoy a lot greater an advantage playing devotion and right now one of the few reasons for them to not do so is ball. So now there's no stopping that. That's what many mean by saying nerfing the weakest and improving the strongest. I'm not saying ball is not powerful. But there are so many other cards way more powerful than it.

As far as I'm aware, most decks have at least one big play that involves 1-3 moves generating points way beyond the cards' provision costs. Ball is just one of those, and not even quite a successful one since it does not kill immediately (most of the time) unlike duel, does not so much generate points on own side unlike SK damage-boost combo and does not pose extreme control unlike triple nature's rebuke + symbiosis.
 
Oh noes the top tiers got punished by a couple of provisions how will they ever recover?? :cry:

Hahahahaha :LOL::ROFLMAO::LOL::ROFLMAO::LOL:
You made my day ! :coolstory:

- Okay... let's start with the obvious, the doomed status on scenarios, a long overdue answer to an issue that has been going for way too long, I welcome it ofc, good change.

- SK and NR nerfs, as others already mentioned before me, the nerfs to those two are frankly laughable.
These two factions have great synergy with almost all of their cards, especially SK.
CDPR will have to make the other factions as consistent as SK and NR (boring) or nerf SK and NR
to oblivion. :disapprove:
You can't make the game's population playing only SK and NR (top ranked tiers) or teching against em.
What we're left with is experimenting with meme decks that might work or fail horribly.

- NG,
I was a hater of this faction once upon a time not long ago, I still hate em for various reasons, cheap removals, Cahir shenanigans and some other issues but man...ffs..!
Even I wouldn't have nerfed the Ball, the doomed status was more than enough imo, a bad move and totally undeserved. :think:

- ST
I don't really play this faction, I have made some meme decks these past few months mainly to complete artifact quests. The scenario change-nerf is bad, they shouldn't have made it more expensive imo.

- SY
At last..!
That firesworn scribe was always murdered as soon as he was placed on the board, the 4 coins tribute was outrageously high.
Time to punish the infidels and why not make some coin while we're at it..! :coolstory:
"Elf..! Remove his cowl then his years"

- MO
At last..! They recognized the inferiority of Ard Gaeth and priced it accordingly.
Now I can fit in a drowner and get revenge against that Ahole Cahir when I see him again ! :ok:
As for the harpies, a welcome change, a flavorful boost for sure, not sure if it's gonna see a lot of play but who knows, I'll take what I can get that's for sure.

All n' all not bad, some good changes were made but the SK and NR threat hasn't been adequately answered imo.
 
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Yet how many ST/NR/SK players you know do not play one of those decks? None of them are barely touched this patch. Those decks are particularly popular playing pro rank. Reality right now is if you play NG, there's no real hope you can go far. And if you play ball, once on pro ranks, you barely stand a chance.

And you say the existence of ball forces many players to break devotion. But that's the point. There's no doubt SK and NR enjoy a lot greater an advantage playing devotion and right now one of the few reasons for them to not do so is ball. So now there's no stopping that. That's what many mean by saying nerfing the weakest and improving the strongest. I'm not saying ball is not powerful. But there are so many other cards way more powerful than it.

As far as I'm aware, most decks have at least one big play that involves 1-3 moves generating points way beyond the cards' provision costs. Ball is just one of those, and not even quite a successful one since it does not kill immediately (most of the time) unlike duel, does not so much generate points on own side unlike SK damage-boost combo and does not pose extreme control unlike triple nature's rebuke + symbiosis.
All kinds of playstyles should have a place in the game. Invalidating the entire tag with one card is a hella bad point to make. Poison also doesn't really care about numbers, and has a bigger pointswing potential than rebukes (thus also contributing to rampant tall punish).

As far as deckbuilding and meta go, let me tell you something - after initial acquaintance with Gwent several months ago I made a point out of throwing underdog meme cards together and making them work together decently enough to get my 25 keys at the end of every season. Some experiments didn't pan out, some did, and right now I'm having a blast with Artis/Sukrus/berserkers of all kinds pointslamming with the best of them all the way up to 90 points R3 without ever playing stupid Blood Eagles and stuff. NG isn't my cup of tea (though assimilation looks crazy fun), but occasionally I see people utilizing those 2 leader lock charges to great effect, and this is the only case I ever consider giving NG player a GG. My rank is 2 at the moment, so that should mean at least something.

Point is, I am fairly sure there is some kind of Ball deck wherein it's every single bit as broken as it is on paper, people are just being lazy and oddly conservative with their deckbuilding. I am yet to see an NG player trying any kind of row punish, even though it could help their struggles immensely.
 
Nerf SK Echo. It should be minimum 13 or 14 PV card.

I think CDPR is afraid to nerf anything SK as it's so popular.

If they nerf SK, they're afraid that players will leave the game. That must be why SK is barely touched in patch after patch.

SK's 60+% win rate is just embarrassing for the balancing team though.
 

DRK3

Forum veteran
I think CDPR is afraid to nerf anything SK as it's so popular.

If they nerf SK, they're afraid that players will leave the game. That must be why SK is barely touched in patch after patch.

SK's 60+% win rate is just embarrassing for the balancing team though.

SK is popular NOW. A great part of the playerbase doesnt have a real faction preference, they just like to win and so like the current OP faction. Now its Skellige, before MM we had Scoia Harmony, SY Hidden Cache, NG Ball, NR Foltest Commandos, etc...

All factions have been on top at some time, and the meta eventually always changes.
 
I swear I must play a different game than yours. All I play against are deathwish MO , NR control and non devo ST which I find way more toxic to deal with than SK.
 
SK is popular NOW. A great part of the playerbase doesnt have a real faction preference, they just like to win and so like the current OP faction. Now its Skellige, before MM we had Scoia Harmony, SY Hidden Cache, NG Ball, NR Foltest Commandos, etc...

All factions have been on top at some time, and the meta eventually always changes.
100% to that. Most people switch to the winning faction and a winning leader rather than stick to their favourite faction. Who wants to lose, right?
Since it's quick to identify the best deck of the month, people just switch to it.
 
How has Schirru still not gotten the Initiative treatment? Don't they realize how strong this card has gotten because they've turned almost every single viable bronze into 4-5 strength?
And for people arguing it requires setup, this is entirely reliant on matchup. These days in many cases you barely even need to ping it. It's one of the worst cases of a rock-paper-scissors card in the entire game. If your opponent plays a deck reliant on setting up many similar strength engines you win by default.
Giving it Initiative would at least make it a bit less flexible.
But I guess this is one of those obvious changes we have to wait another 8 months for until someone at the dev office decides to do a ranked during coffee break where he gets matched up against it then maybe he'll start having doubts whether it's fair to lose by default or not.
 
How has Schirru still not gotten the Initiative treatment? Don't they realize how strong this card has gotten because they've turned almost every single viable bronze into 4-5 strength?
And for people arguing it requires setup, this is entirely reliant on matchup. These days in many cases you barely even need to ping it. It's one of the worst cases of a rock-paper-scissors card in the entire game. If your opponent plays a deck reliant on setting up many similar strength engines you win by default.
Giving it Initiative would at least make it a bit less flexible.
But I guess this is one of those obvious changes we have to wait another 8 months for until someone at the dev office decides to do a ranked during coffee break where he gets matched up against it then maybe he'll start having doubts whether it's fair to lose by default or not.
Agreed especially with the cheap handbuff introduced in master Mirror the Eithné Schirrú Decks became quite toxic reminds me of the Eithne Sihil Decks in the beginning of Homecoming and with Regis, Scorch and Gigni having initiative there is not really a good reason why Schirrú shouldn't have initative or at least his Zeal should be removed that you have a chance to counter it.
 
How has Schirru still not gotten the Initiative treatment? Don't they realize how strong this card has gotten because they've turned almost every single viable bronze into 4-5 strength?
And for people arguing it requires setup, this is entirely reliant on matchup. These days in many cases you barely even need to ping it. It's one of the worst cases of a rock-paper-scissors card in the entire game. If your opponent plays a deck reliant on setting up many similar strength engines you win by default.
Giving it Initiative would at least make it a bit less flexible.
But I guess this is one of those obvious changes we have to wait another 8 months for until someone at the dev office decides to do a ranked during coffee break where he gets matched up against it then maybe he'll start having doubts whether it's fair to lose by default or not.
Think about this suggestion for one minute and you’ll realize it’s impossible. Initiative always applies to cards that activate upon deploy, not orders. And Schirru, if changed to a deploy effect, becomes virtually unplayable. One has to be able to adjust the power level (within reason) to be able to hit the desired strength.

Removing the zeal keyword is a debatable suggestion (although I consider it a very poor one). Giving the initiative tag is ludicrous.
 
How has Schirru still not gotten the Initiative treatment? Don't they realize how strong this card has gotten because they've turned almost every single viable bronze into 4-5 strength?
And for people arguing it requires setup, this is entirely reliant on matchup. These days in many cases you barely even need to ping it. It's one of the worst cases of a rock-paper-scissors card in the entire game. If your opponent plays a deck reliant on setting up many similar strength engines you win by default.
Giving it Initiative would at least make it a bit less flexible.
But I guess this is one of those obvious changes we have to wait another 8 months for until someone at the dev office decides to do a ranked during coffee break where he gets matched up against it then maybe he'll start having doubts whether it's fair to lose by default or not.

There's literally never a game where you don't "have to ping it." It may seem like everything you play is 5 points, but that's most definitely not the case. Schirru is ONLY playable with Precision Strike leader charges, and half the time you have to use the leader charges to take value away from your own units, and the other half the time you're bricking your sentinels, so your leader ability basically plays for 7. Without precision strike (or with initiative tag), it plays for 5 points, if you're lucky enough to draw a tutor, AND you've just wasted your leader charges.

It's really not that hard to win R1 against a Schirru deck...
 
There's literally never a game where you don't "have to ping it." It may seem like everything you play is 5 points, but that's most definitely not the case. Schirru is ONLY playable with Precision Strike leader charges, and half the time you have to use the leader charges to take value away from your own units, and the other half the time you're bricking your sentinels, so your leader ability basically plays for 7. Without precision strike (or with initiative tag), it plays for 5 points, if you're lucky enough to draw a tutor, AND you've just wasted your leader charges.

It's really not that hard to win R1 against a Schirru deck...
Tutor it with Call of the Forest and you can kill 90% of NG bronzes zero pings needed.
 

rrc

Forum veteran
Tutor it with Call of the Forest and you can kill 90% of NG bronzes zero pings needed.
I don't know which NG bronze you are talking about? Only the SpyCharge soldier is 4 power. None of the other NG bronzes stay at 4. If you consider Fangs, they deserve to burn :coolstory:
Apart from Fangs and SpyChargeSoldier, which other NG bronze has 4 power? Dame, Magne, Tortuerer, BoostBySpy units count.. nothing stays at 4.
Summon Cards, yes. Which you will anyhow do it on R1 in which no one plays Schirru. So, I don't understand why NG should get affected by Schirru. IMO, only against SK Schirru is good as most of their freaking bloody bronzes play and gold for 6 or 5 strength which can be aligned by PS for a massive Schirru. It takes full leader commitment, awkward plays to time it for better result and all that to eventually lose to SK in the end either way.

Remove Zeal = Delete Schirru
Increase Provision = Delete Schirru
Reduce Power from 3 = Delete Schirru
Give Deploy = Strangle to near death
Give Initiative = Ridiculous as initiative belongs to deploy
Give Deploy+Initiative = Remove Zeal = Delete Schirru

BTW, I don't play Schirru decks. I am currently losing.. sorry, playing.. with elves and question my own sanity why the hell am I playing Elves.
 
As someone who loves Ciri Nova...there is no 9 provision or less cards to deal with scenarios now unless you get super lucky with a cantarella or viper witcher or something.
 
Tutor it with Call of the Forest and you can kill 90% of NG bronzes zero pings needed.
you can not tutor inititive cards, i hate shirru, but you can just delete the card if you cant pull him with council or call anymore. he needs a different solution which i can not offer.
 
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