Players can play the entire game without killing an enemy if you wish -- HOLY CRAP!!!

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Agree, I don't mind a boss fight, but they sound braindead, last year and there.
What's the point of it being a 'boss" if you put a big target about where to shoot?
But we don't have to kill anyone, remember? There will be other ways to deal with her that won't be a traditional boss fight.

My only real concern from this article is whether that chip is going to be anything more than a MacGuffin.
 
Skills improving accuracy might have worked in a pen and paper where you don't physically do anything really. In a video game like this the player aims and shoots, it's logical to leave aiming abilities up to the player in this case. There's a reason why RPGs moved away from skill-dependant accuracy (ala Morrowind, Gothic or Deus Ex). IMO, there's nothing more frustrating than clearly shooting something and seeing a huge MISS above it.

Again black and white. Simple those skill could had regulating recoil and precision. You don't have to write MISS all you have to do is make feel the progression by you know progressing? More you gain a skill at shooting less the recoil will disturb you and more your aim would be steady. Is not rocket science is also how it works in RL you improve by pratice.

ANd boom a system working for both pen and paper player and action gamers.
 
Skills improving accuracy might have worked in a pen and paper where you don't physically do anything really. In a video game like this the player aims and shoots, it's logical to leave aiming abilities up to the player in this case. There's a reason why RPGs moved away from skill-dependant accuracy (ala Morrowind, Gothic or Deus Ex). IMO, there's nothing more frustrating than clearly shooting something and seeing a huge MISS above it.

Yeah. Doing the exact same thing as a low level and high level with different results, with the low level doing diddly damage, is immersionbreaking af.
 
Yeah. Doing the exact same thing as a low level and high level with different results, with the low level doing diddly damage, is immersionbreaking af.

Again damage won't change your aim would become more steady feeling less the recoil. Is not that you have to do less damage actually. The weapon could still hit and make the same damage what would change is how you will be good at shooting. No need to decrease damage or hit and miss mechanics.
 
Again black and white. Simple those skill could had regulating recoil and precision. You don't have to write MISS all you have to do is make feel the progression by you know progressing? More you gain a skill at shooting less the recoil will disturb you and more your aim would be steady. Is not rocket science is also how it works in RL you improve by pratice.
The thing is we don't know if that's a thing or not. It might very well be that reducing recoil is one of the perks you can get alongside +damage.
All I was referring to is the belief that handicapping players accuracy in a real time FPS combat is by any means a good thing.
 
The thing is we don't know if that's a thing or not. It might very well be that reducing recoil is one of the perks you can get alongside +damage.
All I was referring to is the belief that handicapping players accuracy in a real time FPS combat is by any means a good thing.

And this would give actually way more progression. In cyberpunk nobody is Rambo you are running on the edge with a constant sense of danger. You ware not supposed to be a SUPER HERO you are just a guy or a gal attempting to survive in a harsh society. Also this prof how cyberpunk 2077 for what i read and if i interpreted it well is distant from the source material. Not only in mechanics but in the spirit as well
 
There is not much point to discuss on this topic more IMO. Most successful mainstream FPS RPG that used this kind of system (+weapon damage from perks and gear) was Mass Effect trilogy and it was perfectly fine. If CP2077 keep percentages reasonable it will be fine as well.
 
And this would give actually way more progression. In cyberpunk nobody is Rambo you are running on the edge with a constant sense of danger. You ware not supposed to be a SUPER HERO you are just a guy or a gal attempting to survive in a harsh society.

My only valable counterpart with it would be that using too much damage bonus on a given gun may make it jam more often (because, yes, in cyberpunk, guns are suposed to jam too)
 
Most successful mainstream FPS RPG that used this kind of system (+weapon damage from perks and gear) was Mass Effect trilogy and it was perfectly fine. If CP2077 keep percentages reasonable it will be fine as well.
Fallout New Vegas did it too. It's all about balance, the very fact that a perk like this exists doesn't mean the entire progression system is trash.
All we need rn is more info on the matter.
 
Yes, it will be possible to get through the game without killing anybody. However, Night City is a dangerous and brutal place, so when pacifism is not an option you might still need to hurt people.

Personally I won't be a pacifist, I won't try not to kill anyone, quite the opposite, but I'm still happy about this, because of what the implications of this are for the stealth gameplay! :cool:
 
The +% damage bonus perks are basically the video game equivalent of "Reroll 1s and 2s on damage rolls" abilities/feats in PnP
 
I'd imagine it'll be pretty hard to successfully do it! One wrong choice and you'll need to kill someone.

I know they said it's the ghost of Johnny but why do I feel like they'll find a way to make him end up being alive, lol.
At least Johnny Silverhand is Keanu Reeves so the narration in your head won't annoy me. Not usually a fan of narrators in RPG games

And I was wondering how they would do the perks/life choices affecting dialogue. Guessing they tell you when it's an "unlocked" option?

Definitely looking forward to seeing how the class system will work too.
 
I'm 50/50 on this.
If the hack finishes (it's a bar at the top of the screen) we'd straight-up die, but we managed to kill her first. (More QTEs ... have the reactions of a kid or game over ...)
I don't think it's a QTE, but rather, a time limit that you need to beat the fight within. At least, that's how I understood it, as there was no mention of button presses or anything.

Also, the bit about the implant chip is neat. Apparently, that made the cut, even 7 years later. Remember when they first talked about that? I never thought it'd be in game.
 
QTE,Levels,Perks and gamey bossfight.

Is still a game made by fan of the pen and paper? Because honestly they implemented the worst heresy they could.

No offence given my personal opinion.
By a Cyberpunk 2020 pen and paper fan.
The "problem" is the usual one.

RPG fans are a niche market. For mass appeal you need "QTE,Levels,Perks and gamey bossfight." While I fully understand that CDPR is a for profit business my "problem" is that it wouldn't be that hard (not easy mind you, but not hard) to design a game that appeals to both groups.

So far no one has made a reasonable attempt to do so. They may add elements of one genre to another or replace some elements with others but these hybrid games are never as good as a game that focuses on either.

YES! It requires a dual system game to do what I want, but that's not rocket science.

I don't think it's a QTE, but rather, a time limit that you need to beat the fight within. At least, that's how I understood it, as there was no mention of button presses or anything.
Not a button press perhaps but still "do X in Y time", essentially a QTE.

Just like timed dialog responses. In most of the ones in W3 I barely had time to read the possible responses much less select one.
 
Not a button press perhaps but still "do X in Y time", essentially a QTE.
It seems OK to me. I don't think time limits = QTE.

Lots, and lots, and lots of games have time limits. Yes, even classic CRPGs that we all know and love. And yes, even timed combat encounters.

She hacked you, and is trying to upload a virus. Detach yourself from the gamey viewpoint and think about it believably. The virus takes time to upload (not terribly unrealistic, IMO, depending on its "file size"). If you don't kill her before she finishes, she kills you with it.

Again, seems OK to me. Doesn't require much suspension of disbelief. Now, whether or not you think there should be a meter on screen informing you of the time limit is another matter; and I wouldn't disagree if you said it shouldn't be so obvious. But a mere visual aid does not a QTE make.
 
THis is a discussion already have dozen of times. A good game don't need QTE,Gamey boss fight a Perk system Cyberpunk 2020 had already a good system in place that while not ported 1:1 could had be done insanely better thant what i am reading here.
World is not Black or WHite there are grey areas that could be use to make a system that works for both parties instead here was chosen the route of the "Cheap shot" annhiliating all that was said on the pasted years and also killing a good part of what made Cyberpunk 2020 unique from other rpgs.

If people still think that to have a good rpg you need a level system coloured tiered loot QTE and bossfight. Sigh.

Remeber how people absolutely loved qte in witcher2? i do

I find boss fights fun when they're done well, so I don't have an issue with them. They also don't make a game any less of an RPG.

Also, what's the alternative? Boss characters without mechanics to worry about, that are bullet-sponges? Yawn. Or important enemies that are no more dangerous than the umpteen mobs you killed on the way to the encounter? Hard pass on both.
 
Can you elaborate a bit on this? Do you mean that we'll have to hurt people via non-lethal takedowns and things like stun guns... The former is basically similar to some of the Deus Ex games. Technically I could make it through the entire game non-lethally by utilizing brutal take downs and shooting people with tranq darts, but it is a bit of a thin difference from just doing the same things in a lethal manner.

I have always wondered what the real difference is too, apart from imagination/role-play. You shoot someone with a taser or you shoot them in the head with a silenced pistol. Either way, they're on the floor and need to be put in a conveniently placed cupboard or shoved behind a big box in the shadows :)

Yeah, I'm getting the impression from the CDPR comment that non-lethal does not mean non-violent. There's sometimes a difference between stealthing a level and ghosting it.

There's a grid of hex codes that you pick out the right ones for. Completing the basic level will give you access but you can get more optional benefits for doing even better. (A QTE no doubt ... so no matter how skilled my character is it doesn't matter)

Well, it seems it'll require some kind of inputs to be entered in a time limit. So half puzzle, half QTE. However, skill of the character might play an important part. In Bioshock, having better hacking skill gave you a lot more time and also simplified the puzzle itself. That might make it more enjoyable/authentic for you, perhaps?

Shotgun melee??? WTF - so you need both "sniper rifle" and "assassination" for one shot kills?)

I'm guessing he missed a comma between shotgun and melee. I also think assassination is either crit chance/crit damage bonuses or some kind of stealth attack.

I'd imagine headshots will do a lot more damage and that sniper rifles are high damage weapons so will often be one shot kills...although since there are levels we might end up with enemies many levels higher than us actually shrugging them off and needing 3-4 :rolleyes:
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Also, what's the alternative? Boss characters without mechanics to worry about, that are bullet-sponges? Yawn. Or important enemies that are no more dangerous than the umpteen mobs you killed on the way to the encounter? Hard pass on both.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. It's a tough one. If you're gonna have unique, spectacular, intimidating enemies then I'd rather have bosses with weak points that require knowing movement patterns to exploit than the usual alternatives. Maybe the ability to seem them only with the correct upgrades would make it feel more natural. If you don't have the upgrade, you have to find it yourself.

Otherwise, like you said, we'll have a push-over enemy, a bullet sponge (bleeurgh) or an enemy that requires an even greater amount of twitch skill to defeat (in order to make it more challenging), something that wouldn't go down well with many here. I don't think many people want Souls/Sekiro style bosses, that's for sure.
 
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They are literally making my dream cyberpunk game and putting out all the stops! man 6 years of brainstorm on the old forums and the game being as expansive and detailed. Both graphically, game play and mechanics wise is really amazing.

I mean the fact that they haven't even talked about nearly 5 percent of the totally experience. To be drool worthy.
 
Wow indeed, they have changed their style from Witcher 3 for sure., I thought they would be happy with 93 metracritic game. But yeah I think its going to be fun to replay the game with this, I love sneaking games, so I see 2 playthrough here.
 
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