Problem with round phases progressing oddly

[DankTemplar]

Hi totally recreatable bug here, can be recreated with extreme ease.

If the opponent passes and you have 1 Rot Tosser in hand, then play the Rot Tosser, leaving you with 0 cards in hand, the Cow Carcass that Rot Tosser does not trigger.

Expected result: Game should pass automatically for the opponent (which happens) which triggers the Cow Carcass before the round ends.

I assume this is because the way round ending works is really, really weird and unituitive. Instead of ending a turn on last card, the round just ends which imo constitutes a broken gane state as the game is literally breaking the progression of turns.

 

[Vaishar]

Here oddly it's not a bug.

The opponent passes. So for him the game ended. You have only one card "Rot Tosser".

When you play it you pass and the game does not go to the opponent round for the rot tosser to take effect the game ends.

Game should pass automatically for the opponent

The only time this happens is when the turn can return to you. But since you passed it does not.

Two consecutive passes end the round with only round end effects taking place not start of the round effects.

 

[DankTemplar]

Here oddly it's not a bug.

The opponent passes. So for him the game ended. You have only one card "Rot Tosser".

When you play it you pass and the game does not go to the opponent round for the rot tosser to take effect the game ends.


The only time this happens is when the turn can return to you. But since you passed it does not.

Two consecutive passes end the round with only round end effects taking place not start of the round effects.

Which doesn't make any sense as this senario requires you to have 1 card in hand (any card wirh an end turn phase effect will work for the example).

You play your card, then as per usual, you are forced to pass which esentially triggers this really weird condition as the opponent cannot play additional cards.

The game literally breaks its own game state through this condition.

It should either be 3 passes that trigger or 2 passes with the game state progressing logically (goes to end turn, then round end).

At best, this is an unintuitive, lazily implemented mechanic. At worst, no one even considerer end turn effects and consistency of game state progression.

Consistency of game states is extremely important for a card game, especially for new players.

For example, how does it look when someone new to Gwent encounters this scenario?

They're likely not going to be happy and might stop playing because the inconsistency in game state progression feels unfair, partially because it is never, ever explained in the tutorial or an official guide and partly because it really feels unfair when a play which would work in any other card game with a similar turn structure won't work here.

 

[Vaishar]

Because in this game the one that has the last say has a big advantage this thing is needed.

I agree that there needs to be a better tutorial for this kind of things.

 

[DankTemplar]

Because in this game the one that has the last say has a big advantage this thing is needed.

I agree that there needs to be a better tutorial for this kind of things.

I drfinitely agree that finishera do not need to be more powerful, lol. My concern is that the amount of cards this situation applies to is so small that it might be worth making the mechanics consistent and logical while balancing cards like Rot Tosser around a fixed damage number (or a mix of damage over time+fixed number) than going through the hassle of trying to explain to new players how the game state progresses.

I can easily live with it either way, it's as simple as playing cards that have effects on your opponent's turn as your 2nd last card. I'm more concerned about how this looks to a new player...because it looks bad, lol.

 

[Restlessdingo32]

It's not a bug and it's consistent with other cards.

Rot Tosser: Deploy: Ranged, Spawn and play a Cow Carcass

Cow Carcass: Spying, Doomed. After 1 turn, on turn end, destroy this unit and the unit on it's left.

The spying tag explains the behavior. It's a spying card and gets placed on the opponent board. Thus, turn end in this case is referencing the turn end of the player where Cow Carcass is placed. Now that we got that cleared up.....

If you're going last in a round and play Rot Tosser as your final card the other player has already passed when it is played. Once you place Rot Tosser you also pass. From here the game goes to the round end. The other player does not get anymore turn starts or turn ends because the round is over. If played in R3 the game is over as well. As illustrated above the Cow Carcass triggers on the turn end of the other player. If they do not get a turn end it will not trigger. So Cow Carcass will not trigger.

The above is consistent with every other card in the game. It's only confusing because the card behavior changes depending on whether you're going first or second in a round. If you're going first you can play Rot Tosser as your final card. If you're going second you must play it at some point before your last card. The only exception is when the other player has one or more cards left (they have card advantage). The simple way to think of this is the opponent must have at least one card left when you play Rot Tosser for it to trigger.

I could see having an issue with this behavior. If only because the card behavior doesn't always feel the same. It's the same problem with cards like Dragon's Dream. I'm not entirely sure how to change this without altering the cards.

All of that said.... This card is completely broken if you play it after an opponent pass. It's effectively a 5 provision Gigni on a single card without the damage threshold condition. So forgive me if I do not feel any sympathy for it .