Redanian Knight should be 5 Provisions instead of 4.

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My friends and I have been noticing how strong this card is ever since it was released. It automatically starts boosting by one every turn and then if you remove its armor it moves up and hits you back for 2. I don't see how this wouldn't deserve to cost 5 provisions.
 
There are many 4p engines which (effectively) get +1 each turn. Redanian Knight is no different, except that it's easier to shut down and, because of that, the opponent pays a 2 damage penalty.
 
There are many 4p engines which (effectively) get +1 each turn. Redanian Knight is no different, except that it's easier to shut down and, because of that, the opponent pays a 2 damage penalty.

Would you care to name those 4p engines that you are mentioning? I believe there are some clear differences between them and the Redanian Knight that make them not as strong on their own.
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Here are a couple comparisons and scenarios to illustrate my point and generate some discussion.

1) Dol Blathana Archer. This is a 5 Provision card, it has 4 strength and hits for 2 damage on the front row. Let's say someone puts down a Redanian and it boosts itself to 3. You then play your Archer which takes out its armor and thus it moves forward and hits back for 2. This illustrates the power of this 4 provision card as the board state is now at 3 power for your 4 provision Redanian and 2 power for your 5 provision archer. Seems fishy to me.

2) Let's compare it to Dryad Matron. Matron is a 5 provision 4 strength card that boosts one every turn if there is a card to it's right. Without either card being countered Matron is more conditional since you have to trigger it by placing cards on it's right. Matron requires 2 more points of damage to counter it's effect but it won't hit you back for two either. I don't see Matron as being a stronger card than the Redanian here.
 
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Would you care to name those 4p engines that you are mentioning?

It's difficult to make a one on one comparison in a vacuum. But, if I were to list 4p cards that gain above average value and (close to) 1 strength/damage each turn, some of those would be:

- Iron Falcon Infantry (slightly weaker because it's neutral)
- Dwarven Mercenary (not to mention using this with double Justice)
- Lyrian Arbalest (to a lesser extend, but damage is more costly)
- Garkain (easy enough to keep bleeding on)
- Sly Seductress (even more threatening when bonded)
- Magne Division
- Thrive (Nekker) and Harmony (Dryad Fledgling)

There is nothing quite like Redanian Knight, so there will always be situations where one or the other is better. However, when you look at the average value gained, the card doesn't rise (far) above the others.

PS. If you want to talk about "what-if" scenarios, instead of just a flat suggestion, then I can move the thread back to gameplay. However, note that the devs are more focused on the suggestions forum for -well- suggestions.
 
It's difficult to make a one on one comparison in a vacuum. But, if I were to list 4p cards that gain above average value and (close to) 1 strength/damage each turn, some of those would be:

- Iron Falcon Infantry (slightly weaker because it's neutral)
- Dwarven Mercenary (not to mention using this with double Justice)
- Lyrian Arbalest (to a lesser extend, but damage is more costly)
- Garkain (easy enough to keep bleeding on)
- Sly Seductress (even more threatening when bonded)
- Magne Division
- Thrive (Nekker) and Harmony (Dryad Fledgling)

There is nothing quite like Redanian Knight, so there will always be situations where one or the other is better. However, when you look at the average value gained, the card doesn't rise (far) above the others.

PS. If you want to talk about "what-if" scenarios, instead of just a flat suggestion, then I can move the thread back to gameplay. However, note that the devs are more focused on the suggestions forum for -well- suggestions.

I respect everyone's opinion on this. Just giving mine and seeing what everyone thinks. I'll respond to what I think in regards to most of the ones you listed.

-Dwarven Mercenary. One on one RK a good noticably better. Of course when it's swarmed it's extremely good to where people are asking for Justice to be removed from Echo's pool.
-Lyrian Arbalest. Easier to counter one on one and it requires building around it with orders.
-Sly Seductress. Great card and another one that might stand to be 5 provisions instead of 4. Or perhaps lowering it's power by 1.
-Magne Division. This card has a steep requirement of nothing else being on it's row. This is a really big downside compared to the RK.
-Thrive and Harmony are strong but at least require specific decks to make them strong. Nekkers are also much more susceptible to being countered.

I'm glad to have thought this over looking at other cards. My current opinion is that it could still stand to be put at 5 provisions but if it isn't it's not a huge deal.
 
Here are a couple comparisons and scenarios to illustrate my point and generate some discussion.

You ninja-edited your post, so I didn't see this before.

1) Dol Blathana Archer.

That card has a different purpose and cannot be compared. For example, with a Scorch-like effect, that card might very well swing for an extra dozen points.

2) Let's compare it to Dryad Matron.

The problem with that comparison is that it lacks a baseline. Is Redanian Knight too strong or Dryad Matron too weak? To make matters more complicated, sometimes factions need to pay extra to get the same kind of effect because such an effect is more powerful in said faction. Also, it might (indirectly) enrich certain combos not found in other factions, which is why you do not want to compare cards cross faction in a vacuum.
 

Gyg

Forum regular
Redanian Knight can be moved to stop gaining strength and can be reseted by Yrden or similar cards. He is also vurnable to tall removal. In comparison to all other engines he has lower strength by two.
 
That card has a different purpose and cannot be compared. For example, with a Scorch-like effect, that card might very well swing for an extra dozen points.

Of course it's utility is different and their usefulness cannot be compared. I thought it was worth noting that while the archer should be a direct counter to knight by doing two damage to take away it's ability the knight actually comes out on top. That is weird to me.

The problem with that comparison is that it lacks a baseline. Is Redanian Knight too strong or Dryad Matron too weak? To make matters more complicated, sometimes factions need to pay extra to get the same kind of effect because such an effect is more powerful in said faction. Also, it might (indirectly) enrich certain combos not found in other factions, which is why you do not want to compare cards cross faction in a vacuum.

Dryad Matron has been buffed before but you are right that perhaps it needs more, I'm not sure. I get the vacuum point which is why I am open to looking at this from all angles. Knight appears to me to be better than Matron know matter how I look at it.
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Redanian Knight can be moved to stop gaining strength and can be reseted by Yrden or similar cards. He is also vurnable to tall removal. In comparison to all other engines he has lower strength by two.

The all engines comment needs more context because there are a lot of engines in the game. RK could still be better than it's provision cost.

I never said anything about these cards not having any counters. Yrden and tall removal are a given.
 

Gyg

Forum regular
All other 4p engines that buff themselves are 4 points and damage ones are 3 points. RK compared to them needs two more turns to be points equal.
 
Both Redanians are very vulnerable to seize, partially because they are so "strong". Their strengh being that they work without any further support on their own; they are in a way standalone engines because their condition (having armor) doesnt require any set up/or support.
Having an armor as condition might be a bit too good, but i don't mind it; standaloneness seems to be a general theme in NR.

Dire Mutated Hound is simmilar in this respect and is a bigger concern to me (but at least it costs more provisions) but mainly because the faction seem to get every strengh from every other faction.
 
Redanian knight can be Sweers'd, can be seized otherwise, makes your resets better, can be sandstorm'd from a portal, can be shut down with 1 point of damage or completely taken out with 4 damage on the first turn (4 for 4 in any NG matchup) and it's one of the better NR poison targets for ST. It's also complete trash in a short round so you only need to worry about it r1 or r2 if you don't have tempo but bleeding NR in those rounds is mandatory wincon anyway. It's far from broken.

And to put things into perspective you shouldn't compare it to generic 5/4p or even 6/4p but look at dryads or seductresses which can almost guarantee double their provisions in points if not more while also playing for 8 hard points on their first turn. They're somewhere between those and scorpions.
 

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I think it's fine that it's in the 4p range. Nilfgaard, Skellige, Syndicate generally run special cards that cost 4p that will remove it in one or two turns and I don't like it when the person doing the removal trades up.

I think 5p should be reserved for cards that do (targeted) damage on a turnly basis because those get rather oppressive. I don't mind proactive engines that start small much at all.
 
I agree with stryker, redenian knight is way too powerful for 4 provisions. A 4 provision engine that gives you 1 point each turn and doesnt really have any conditions except from ranged is definitely too strong for 4 provisions. you can only move it or kill it, if you cant the card can potentially give you 11 points in a full round. and all you do is just drop it. you can also take a way that 1 armor i know but that costs you 3 points. first that 1 armor and then he charges and hits you for 2 points. Obviously needs a nerf. and saying it doesnt and comparing it to cards like iron falcon infantry isnt a good argument because again, you just drop the redanian knight and thats it. the iron falcon engine needs you to play another card to give it armor
Nobody can deny that 11 points for 4 provisions without any conditions is overpowered
 
There are so many other 4 provision engines with basically joke conditions, will they be reworked too?

also portal triggers sly seductress QQ D: ...
 
There are so many other 4 provision engines with basically joke conditions, will they be reworked too?

also portal triggers sly seductress QQ D: ...

Please name them and they can be discussed.

Seductresses are arguably overpowered with portal similar to how Dwarven mercenaries are overpowered when used with Justice.
 
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