quakers have, for 400 years, claimed to niether be the only christians, and they have also renounced violence.they were instrumental in getting slavery abolished.
But they are not a nation. Aren't some people confusing these two ideas ? nations and religions ? nations often use religions and vice versa for their particular goals and agendas. OK at certain points in history, and in certain places geographically these coincide, but those are the exceptions
But I thought Roxy was saying that certain religions had contributed to peace, and Simon was saying that they hadn't. So Kelticpete mentioned the Quakers, which I was about to do, too, and which I know Simon is well aware of.In general, though, I think that Simon's point stands -- religion has fostered at least as much evil as it has good. Judeo-Christian religions, with a few rare exceptions, have fostered a view of power as power-over and deliberately squelched the idea of power from within. They set up a powerful god who demands obedience, which conditions the populace to think of such set-ups as normal and natural, even sanctioned by God. Seeing the environment as something that humans can, should, and do have ultimate power over has brought our planet to a sorry state. Seeing women as something that men can, should, and do have ultimate power over, seeing citizens as something that governments can, should, and do have ultimate power over, seeing children as someone that adults can, should, and do have ultimate power over -- all of these things make our society the unloving, brutal place that it is.
Nope. We can infer from my statement that Judeo-Christian societies are the only ones I know much about, and I'm reluctant to make generalizations about societies and religions that I know little about. I've read some about other world religions, but I don't think I know enough about how they're lived in practice to comment on them. Simon probably does, though, and will no doubt enlighten us.MPetros said:
All these things are true. I was for a number of years clerk of a Quaker meeting. However, it's my opinion that the society is now largely dead - we traded too long on the reputation of our grandfathers. Quakers did almost literally nothing about the Bosnian war. There was one Quaker woman active in trying to rescue women from the rape camps, but the society as a whole refused to support her or even believe her.I'm no longer a Quaker, partly because I'm no longer a christian, and partly because I don't think real Quakerism exists and more - at least, not in Britain. And that's sad, because it has been, as you say, an honourable - and exceptional - tradition.The Mennonites may be the last remaining religious group in the world with some claim to actually being good.kelticpete said:
OK, so that's 'none' then.If 'nun', write 'none'...gamewidow said:
