Roping Vs Combos

[Baron_Grimswald]

A bit frustrated right now, but I assure the purpose of this post is not to just "vent", but rather to discuss the source of that frustration in pursuit of either change to game mechanic or my understanding why the current system is the ideal one.

So today I had a player purposely rope every turn in a toxic manner. After playing their card they would not pass. Just spam Emotes until the timer expired.

Then, in another game, while attempting to play a multi-step combination play with Nilfgaard, I had the timer expire and the game automatically chose the target of my final card in the sequence, costing me the game.

It is critical to have a Timer for turns in this game. But there is a big difference between doing nothing and doing something. This becomes more frustrating when some of the resolution animations can be quite slow.

I feel it would be a more ideal system, to add maybe even 1 second to the timer when the player completes an action. For example, if I use my Double Cross leader then choose opponents Oneiromancy, add a small amount to timer so that I may use that Oneiromancy to play my Roderick to play my Coup to play my Roderick, etc.

Feel free to respond, I will try to read with an open mind. But please be polite.

 

[Markus_Wirth]

Also think that specific cards should increase the timer a bit. Also think about a board with many order units.

 

[Tucoffin]

@ OP:

I understand where you're coming from, but I admit it's very hard to agree with you since you are requesting more time to make more thorough Nilfgaard plays. NG is very tricky, and in my opinion it's an honest tradeoff to play a complex strategy at the expense of the same amount of time everyone has. What I mean by this is that playing Monsters is usually easier, so less time is spent on each turn. NG, on the other hand, demands more board interaction for higher gain, but at the peril of maybe not being able to do everything you desired.

I believe that's fair, and working as intended. Sorry for little sympathy regarding your favorite faction (it's not personal).

 

[Draconifors]

I feel it would be a more ideal system, to add maybe even 1 second to the timer when the player completes an action.

The flip side to extending the timer in this way is that people who purposely rope every turn would also take advantage of it if at all possible.

A better way would be -- this has been suggested in past threads and the idea is not mine -- some kind of a "bank" for time you don't spend during turns. That way, if you play normally (don't rope for the sake of roping) you would have more time in case you need to do a lot of thinking and/or pull off a long combo play later in the match.
Ropers would not benefit, and the total max length of a match would not be affected.

 

[Tucoffin]

A better way would be -- this has been suggested in past threads and the idea is not mine -- some kind of a "bank" for time you don't spend during turns.

I disagree with this for Gwent specifically, because matches can take quite a long time already. I hope this feature never sees the light of day.

 

[Draconifors]

I disagree with this for Gwent specifically, because matches can take quite a long time already. I hope this feature never sees the light of day.

It would not affect match length, like I said. No time is gained if all time is spent.

I also didn't say I want any changes like this; I was just presenting an alternative to the OP's suggestion, an alternative that could not be abused. I only ever run out of time in Battle Rush.

 

[Baron_Grimswald]

Keep in mind, the initial time for each turn could be less.

And it's not just Nilfgaard. SK can tutor into tutors, and Scoia'Tael can also make plays like this.

Post automatically merged: Apr 17, 2021

And I always like the idea of Carryover LUL

 

[Tucoffin]

It would not affect match length, like I said. No time is gained if all time is spent.

I also didn't say I want any changes like this; I was just presenting an alternative to the OP's suggestion, an alternative that could not be abused.

I believe it actually could increase match length by a small margin, in the case the player would make some plays quickly (the ones they normally do) and bank this extra time later on. I commend the initiative to prevent abuse, though.

Keep in mind, the initial time for each turn could be less.

That could balance the time bank nicely, yes.

 

[Draconifors]

I believe it actually could increase match length by a small margin, in the case the player would make some plays quickly (the ones they normally do) and bank this extra time later on.

How?

I don't actually know what the timer is, but let's assume it's 60 seconds. You play a turn using 1 second, you bank 59 seconds. You spend 30 seconds, you bank 30 seconds. You spend 60 seconds, you bank 0 seconds.
It can't make the match longer than spending 60 seconds every single turn would (and which is what ropers do).

 

[Tucoffin]

How?

I don't actually know what the timer is, but let's assume it's 60 seconds. You play a turn using 1 second, you bank 59 seconds. You spend 30 seconds, you bank 30 seconds. You spend 60 seconds, you bank 0 seconds.
It can't make the match longer than spending 60 seconds every single turn would (and which is what ropers do).

Maybe I interpreted it wrong, but I don't think so. I'll clarify my arguments over two hypothetical examples:

A - no time bank system: a player plays a card consecutively for three turns, spending 3, 4 and 2 seconds respectively. This means he spent around 9 seconds of his time to make his plays. Every turn he has in the remainder of the match still accounts for 60 seconds.

B - with time bank system: Same situation as above, but now time bank is active. The outcome of the same three first plays would result in 57 + 56 + 58 seconds stored for later use, and this buffer could definitely be used in the future to extend the match.

In the first example, all extra time is discarded each turn, whilst this margin would be kept in reserve whether the player actually needed it.

I'm not addressing potential ropers, as there's very little to say about people who like to purposefully waste their own time while annoying their peers. But for actual matches I see how this feature can in fact increase how long a match lasts based on what I wrote above. Please correct me if I made an interpretation mistake.

 

[Draconifors]

and this buffer could definitely be used in the future to extend the match.

The whole point would be to have a buffer. It would not extend the max length of the match compared to spending 60 seconds every turn, which is what I've been saying.

 

[Sensimilius]

Well... I don't know. But I am much more frustrated when I don't have enough time to do an action I want (cause sometimes there's just so much math to do lol, and many units with orders, many different effects to take into consideration, large amounts of points) and I lose points cause I drop a card and don't have nough time to pick a target!
I am much more frustrated with not having enough time to do my stuff then when the opponent is roping. if he's roping that usually means he's losing so I just Alt+Tab into YouTube while he's doing his roping shit or I go to the forums to complain about Viy or Yirden in that time or I do something completely different like listening to music or reading the news.
Some people play decks with more complicated tactics and require much more planning and setup then other more simple decks where you can just throw down a card in 3 seconds and be done with your turn. :]

 

[Tucoffin]

The whole point would be to have a buffer. It would not extend the max length of the match compared to spending 60 seconds every turn, which is what I've been saying.

Well, I still disagree, but for the sake of others I won't keep posting, as this banter will become repetitive.

 

[Kessman]

Yes. That's how it works in MTG Arena, while you do your wombo-combo the timer increases its length.
I saw Mr. Slama playing HS, I guess looking for some ideas. So I would suggest he play MTG as well.

 

[EduFerraz]

The whole point would be to have a buffer. It would not extend the max length of the match compared to spending 60 seconds every turn, which is what I've been saying.

I think you dont understand what He said.

Lets assume The same example, 60seconds every turn. So, assuming each player Will use 16 cards, thats 32 minutes a total match.

With The Bank, almost all The matches Will have that time, since If a player plays Quick some cards, He can lately took a lot of time to play a card.

But it The currection sistem, a match can still be 32 minutes, but normaly we play a lot of cards quicker than 60 seconds, so, almost all The matches took something like 10-15 minutes.

So, in fact, The total time in a match Will not change (32 minutes taking The 60 seconds for play as example), but The avarage time of a match Will increase a lot.


Of course He is saying that If The time each card its The same. But, If, for example, The time reduces by half (30seconds in each play) and you have The Bank for a long play, it can works

Ps: sorry for english, its not so Good and Also i am writing in a cell Phone with auto correct in portuguese

 

[Draconifors]

I think you dont understand what He said.

I certainly did. You seem to be missing my point though.

 

[Sensimilius]

I think a total bank of time would actually increase their ability to rope.
Cause they don't decide to rope since the very beginning, first they play normally and only later when they see they won't win they decide to rope...

 

[Six-Sided-Prism]

I think you dont understand what He said.

Lets assume The same example, 60seconds every turn. So, assuming each player Will use 16 cards, thats 32 minutes a total match.

With The Bank, almost all The matches Will have that time, since If a player plays Quick some cards, He can lately took a lot of time to play a card.

But it The currection sistem, a match can still be 32 minutes, but normaly we play a lot of cards quicker than 60 seconds, so, almost all The matches took something like 10-15 minutes.

So, in fact, The total time in a match Will not change (32 minutes taking The 60 seconds for play as example), but The avarage time of a match Will increase a lot.


Of course He is saying that If The time each card its The same. But, If, for example, The time reduces by half (30seconds in each play) and you have The Bank for a long play, it can works

Ps: sorry for english, its not so Good and Also i am writing in a cell Phone with auto correct in portuguese

That would only be true if they kept the current timer length, which we're assuming is 60 seconds per turn. If I was devising the system, I would probably allocate like 10 seconds per turn with each player having a bank of something between 5 and 10 minutes per match. If you went with the minimum (i.e. a 5-minute bank), that would be a maximum match length of about 15 minutes, which is way shorter than what is currently in place. It would even be possible to have separate banks per round (e.g. a 2- or 3-minute bank per round for each player) if too many players were finding themselves spending most of their time in the 1st round.

 

[Woelfin92]

I think, the timer is just right. I really don't want to wait forever that my oppenent did his math and came to a conclusion, so I don't like the idea of getting extra time after doing something.. Gwent is no chess. Imho managing your time is part of being a good gwent player. You should know your deck and the options of your cards enough, so that you don't get in trouble with the time. It's like separating the wheat from the chaff: Just blindly copying some decks on the internet shouldn't make you a good gwent player. You should at least internalize the technics und possibilities of your chosen cards.

 

[quintivarium]

A great help for combos would be an interface that worked better. There are certain decks I quit playing because lagging interface meant I had to click cards three or four times to make certain decisions — and if I forgot to double check what was actually chosen, it would often choose a card I had looked at before I “chose” the one I wanted. Then it also often tells me to choose a card without reminding me of what I’m choosing it for.