RPG & unjustified expectations?

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But they did so so. They said that there will be no wall climbing with mantis blades, like they hoped there will be. They said no multiple apartments, unfortunately. I am not sure about the modifiable cars. No nudity? I take it you didn't romance anyone or spend any time in the character creator. Or you had the toggle on to disable it....and then complain.....
But I think this is were there is a huge difference in how people understand or accept these things.

Imagine this, I make a game showing a really cool trailer with bullets flying, explosions and all the right stuff. And then in the trailer, say that this is going to be a FPS with all kinds of cool stuff. Then when you get the game, there is one mission where you play in FP and shoot stuff. Technically I didn't lie, because there is one mission in the game where you do this. And I think this is the issue people have with what CDPR said, they made it sound like the game contained all these cool features and that they were part of the game mechanics.

But to me, that doesn't fly, its sort of like them saying that you can drive tanks and dive etc. And then its one mission each, otherwise its just pointless. It becomes more of a checklist of how many things can we tell people are in the game and just do a one off so we can use it as a marketing scam. Exactly the same with the penis size, why on Earth would they show that and promote it as being an option if it have absolutely nothing to do with the game. Why not let V customize each individual toe and highlight that as a feature, showing how detailed the customization is? As the guy said in the video, you have more customization options for your private parts than you have for the general look of your body, like fat, height etc. Yet it have absolutely no impact in the game, but sure we can check that box and promote it as an illusion of how in depth the customization is and fool people into thinking that it matters.

That there are no wall climbing is fair enough, if they believe that it would ruin the game.

....I suppose you can finish the main quest in 20 hours. But what were these big promises that I must have missed?
The promises are in all the content CDPR released, you don't have to listen to any YTer or anyone else, simply watch their own content and listen to what they are saying.

....that is....honestly I think people tend to forget that 95% of the RPG games are like that. It will be great if your every choice changed the world a lot, but that will be few years (decades probably) before that happens. THey will need powerful AI for that.
But CP have even less than most game, yet they promoted it as one of the hottest feature of CP, shape your own future, no two games are alike, the dev saying that he could talk 50 minutes about how much of an impact lifepath have in the game, when it has nothing at all, there is nothing to talk about. To me, it seems that people that defend CDPR, don't care or even listen to what they themselves said about the game and how they promoted and promised these things. Again, if all these things were just what they thought would be cool, make it 100% clear, that they were simply talking about a dream, but that these things would have nothing to do with the game they were working on.

Lots of games have linear stories and still have more branching than CP have, but they don't promote their games as something that it is not. And a linear story can be fine, lots of games have huge success with it.

true - maybe. Honestly I don't care about that, so I don't know.
It makes a huge difference, this is exactly why NC is a city filled with zombies, and it makes it less believable. The moment you interact with it, the illusion crumbles. The city looks believable, but all life in it, is not. NPC are zombies, the traffic completely unbelievable, the police. Nothing in NC except how it looks are believable, because of the poor AI.

...true. But then again this is an RPG and such things are not something new.
Agree, the difference is that this is a Cyberpunk game, where we know that people can modifier their bodies, so armor could be linked to this, rather than the clothing. And make the clothing have its own system that relate to the original RPG game, where style is hugely important.

While a 'costume' bar that takes priority (so you can wear whatever you want for stats), like in many MMOs, might be interesting, you can certainly have nice stats and looking good currently. Not everyone is all about mix/maxing:)
But it is based on a RPG where stats are important. That doesn't mean that they have to completely copy/paste it, but it does make sense to at least make use of it in some meaningful way. And no one say that you have to min/max, especially in CP, because you are going to be a God regardless of what stats you have. As long as you can use a smart rifle, tech rifle or quick hacks, rest doesn't matter. My character were not min/maxed at all, had almost all skill points in crafting and still I could kill everything with ease, skull or no skull didn't matter, and I played on Very hard.

....something I find curious - you don't think you have enough options, but then complain when you have the option to not care about Smasher? Why?
Well you didn't really have the option to care about him. :)

Please elaborate how this is Johny's story and not about merc being dumb (or his buddy being and dragging them along), and dealing with the consequences of that.
Nothing in the story is about V.

V screws up in the heist and is forced into the story, you have nothing invested in Smasher which is hired to defend against criminals like V. You decided to break in at Arasaka and on the way out, decide to kill lots of people. You happen to throw the chip in your head, which forces you into a story by which you know you are already going to end up dying. Silverhand is just a terrorist that hate corporations, got caught after killing thousands of people and punished for it and for some reason blame Smasher for something he did, and now he want revenge. He is a complete lunatic. V have no reason to help Silverhand, except in some "never going to work" plan which we already know fairly quickly is not going to work. So then V want to take it out on Arasaka, despite it being V that is the criminal.

It is bold of CDPR to make you play as one, that is for sure. But V have absolutely no justification for doing what they do, you are a scumbag as V. But nicely packed in as if you are the good guy.
 
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My character were not min/maxed at all, had almost all skill points in crafting and still I could kill everything with ease, skull or no skull didn't matter, and I played on Very hard.
From level 34, no enemy has "skull" anymore, after that you are always at higher level than all enemies who you can encounter.
And "only" with crafting skill, it's not that revelant :)
Few examples :
Max armor possible easily (full mod slot).
The best iconic weapons available in game.
Cost reduction for craft/upgrading.
Best mods crit chance/crit damage available easily.
 

Guest 3847602

Guest
Silverhand is just a terrorist that hate corporations, got caught after killing thousands of people and punished for it and for some reason blame Smasher for something he did, and now he want revenge. He is a complete lunatic. V have no reason to help Silverhand, except in some "never going to work" plan which we already know fairly quickly is not going to work. So then V want to take it out on Arasaka, despite it being V that is the criminal.
Are you referring to Chippin' In (quest)? In case you are - it's a sidequest, nothing more. How does existence of one, optional questline make the entire story being about Johnny Silverhand and Adam Smasher?
You don't attack Arasaka at the end because Johnny hates corporations, but because you want to save V's life. You don't fight Smasher because he's Johnny archenemy, but because he's there to prevent you from reaching Mikoshi.
 
That there are no wall climbing is fair enough, if they believe that it would ruin the game.
The thing is they said that CDPR did promise that and they did in the beginning. But then they said they won't implement it. It is not about whether having wall climbing is deal breaker for some players. That is up to them, as you said, but another topic:D
The promises are in all the content CDPR released, you don't have to listen to any YTer or anyone else, simply watch their own content and listen to what they are saying.
Sorry, but I am not going to watch several hours of videos. If you want to answer show me the video with the time from which I can watch. If you don't want to that is fine too.
It makes a huge difference, this is exactly why NC is a city filled with zombies, and it makes it less believable. The moment you interact with it, the illusion crumbles. The city looks believable, but all life in it, is not. NPC are zombies, the traffic completely unbelievable, the police. Nothing in NC except how it looks are believable, because of the poor AI.
Not to me. Since I care about the story and not causing chaos to see what happens, NC was nice for me. There were conversations around me, people didn't act in a way to break immersion. But this is a difference of opinions really so that's that. I hope they improve the AI for people like you that find such things important:)
Agree, the difference is that this is a Cyberpunk game, where we know that people can modifier their bodies, so armor could be linked to this, rather than the clothing. And make the clothing have its own system that relate to the original RPG game, where style is hugely important.
To be honest I agree with you. I was expecting for our cyberware to be a lot more important (for stats such as armor) and not clothes. But that was not what they(the poster) were about. They said that you end up looking like a clown, if you want stats, which is not totally true. You kinda do only if you don't care about the aesthetics and don't try to make them look good.
Well you didn't really have the option to care about him. :)
In a romantic sense - no. In an 'I want to get revenge on you because of Johny' - yes.
Nothing in the story is about V.

V screws up in the heist and is forced into the story, you have nothing invested in Smasher which is hired to defend against criminals like V. You decided to break in at Arasaka and on the way out, decide to kill lots of people. You happen to throw the chip in your head, which forces you into a story by which you know you are already going to end up dying. Silverhand is just a terrorist that hate corporations, got caught after killing thousands of people and punished for it and for some reason blame Smasher for something he did, and now he want revenge. He is a complete lunatic. V have no reason to help Silverhand, except in some "never going to work" plan which we already know fairly quickly is not going to work. So then V want to take it out on Arasaka, despite it being V that is the criminal.

It is bold of CDPR to make you play as one, that is for sure. But V have absolutely no justification for doing what they do, you are a scumbag as V. But nicely packed in as if you are the good guy.

Ok - no. V doesn't decide to attack Arasaka out of the blue or because of Silverhand (although you have this option), but because they want to survive their consequences and Arasaka is the safest bet.
 
From level 34, no enemy has "skull" anymore, after that you are always at higher level than all enemies who you can encounter.
But this is possible even before. This is a video I made using system reset as lvl 33 and had used it long before that. I don't know at what level you can get it.

 
But this is possible even before. This is a video I made using system reset as lvl 33 and had used it long before that. I don't know at what level you can get it.

You have to be level 16 in INT to craft it (it's an Epic one) and have a descent Cyberdeck (level 30/40 in Street cred) to be able to upload it ;)
And enemy with "skull" have a "malus" for RAM cost, so it require even more RAM to upload it.

But the main problem for me :
-Armor. Too weak at the start and to "god" at the end. So you have to "limit" yourself. In very hard, with 2.5K it's perfect, not too weak but not a god. You can survive two or 3 bullets, not much more (even die straight if a guy have an HMG or a shotgun).
-Crit damage/Crit chance without being in stealth. It's required for stealth, because if you don't "oneshot" the enemy, you enter directly in combat. So stealth become useless (and silencer also become useless).
 
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But this is possible even before. This is a video I made using system reset as lvl 33 and had used it long before that. I don't know at what level you can get it.


It is not about the quickhack, it is about how powerful your legendary deck is. But as far as I remember this was Militech operation (and high level one at that) so yes, I think they should have counters for doing that.
 
Are you referring to Chippin' In (quest)? In case you are - it's a sidequest, nothing more. How does existence of one, optional questline make the entire story being about Johnny Silverhand and Adam Smasher?
Because one questline is there for V? You got the chip in your head and you are going to die. You committed a crime and it went wrong, so now you want to take revenge on Arasaka for you screwing up?

What story is there to tell here?

You don't attack Arasaka at the end because Johnny hates corporations, but because you want to save V's life.
But you are not going to be saved, you already know this.

You don't fight Smasher because he's Johnny archenemy, but because he's there to prevent you from reaching Mikoshi.
Yes I know, but he is added there as the big bad final boss. So obviously you should care, but the problem is that you don't. At least I didn't, he was just another NPC in the way, I knew hardly anything about him, I personally had no interest in him, V didn't either, Johnny excuse is that Rogue wants revenge, but she have already told you that its not about Smasher, so I was not invested in the fight at all. Again he was just an NPC, without any deep explained lore behind him, that I cared about. Nothing in the game, made him especially interesting, except that he looks kind of cool.
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You have to be level 16 in INT to craft it (it's an Epic one) and have a descent Cyberdeck (level 30/40 in Street cred) to be able to upload it ;)
And enemy with "skull" have a "malus" for RAM cost, so it require even more RAM to upload it.
Yes I did eventually change to focus on Int, because I got tired of having to spend 2 seconds crafting things one at the time :) But that eventually ruined the game for me, because at this point when I made the video, I kind of realized that nothing in the game would challenge me. It was purely up to me to intentionally screw up things. So the story kept me going for a while, but eventually it became to boring, didn't need any new equipment, I had the Quick hack, smart sniper rifle etc. and what is the point getting even better stuff, when everything instantly dies anyway.
 

Guest 3847602

Guest
Because one questline is there for V? You got the chip in your head and you are going to die. You committed a crime and it went wrong, so now you want to take revenge on Arasaka for you screwing up?

What story is there to tell here?
So, pick suicide option. V gets what you think he/she deserves for being dumb, nobody else dies.
But you are not going to be saved, you already know this.
Not before the end. Even then V gets to survive in some form.
Yes I know, but he is added there as the big bad final boss. So obviously you should care, but the problem is that you don't. At least I didn't, he was just another NPC in the way, I knew hardly anything about him, I personally had no interest in him, V didn't either, Johnny excuse is that Rogue wants revenge, but she have already told you that its not about Smasher, so I was not invested in the fight at all. Again he was just an NPC, without any deep explained lore behind him, that I cared about. Nothing in the game, made him especially interesting, except that he looks kind of cool.
And? He's the final boss, but the story is not about him. He's just Arasaka's supersoldier guarding the access to Mikoshi. That's why you should be interested in killing him.
 
Yes I did eventually change to focus on Int, because I got tired of having to spend 2 seconds crafting things one at the time :) But that eventually ruined the game for me, because at this point when I made the video, I kind of realized that nothing in the game would challenge me. It was purely up to me to intentionally screw up things. So the story kept me going for a while, but eventually it became to boring, didn't need any new equipment, I had the Quick hack, smart sniper rifle etc. and what is the point getting even better stuff, when everything instantly dies anyway.
blame D&D really...it was from there that the the mages start weak, but end up demigods:)
 
And? He's the final boss, but the story is not about him. He's just Arasaka's supersoldier guarding the access to Mikoshi. That's why you should be interested in killing him.
I agree...
V want to enter in Mikoshi, Smasher doesn't want to see V in Mikoshi.
You need to fight to know who is right :D

Besides, if you're there, it happened a few times before :)
-Maybe Royce guarding the door to get out of AllFoods.
-Maybe the big Bot guarding the elevator for leave the Konpeki.
-Maybe Sasquatch guarding the door to see the Netwatch guy.
-Maybe Placide guarding the door to exit the Chapel.
-Maybe Oda guarding Hanako.
 
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blame D&D really...it was from there that the the mages start weak, but end up demigods:)
Well again, using a smart sniper rifle was pretty much the same.

This is also a video I made, a lot of it is about some weird issue with how the mods work and doesn't really seem to add the damage correctly I think. But if you scroll to the end you can see, that im already making 15k headshots as lvl 23. To me, the combat in this game is slightly unbalance, the NPC doesn't really have much of a chance.


And also, you can find videos of people with lots of different builds that are just killing everything with ease. Obviously don't know what difficulty they are playing, but I honestly don't think it makes a huge difference, once you reach a certain point in the game.
 
that im already making 15k headshots as lvl 23
Crit chance and crit damage, that the point :)
In addition to head shot x4.10, yes it's a lot and seem "normal" for an Hashura.
Whitout crit damage, you already deal about 4K with your Hashura ((637+441)x4.10).

With my clothes mod (100% crit chance and 250% crit damage), perks, I deal 20-30K damage (always crit) on headshot with a "simple" legendary lexington (the weaker gun...) in stealth with silencer.
In open combat, it's "only" 3-4K damage (always crit damage).

But like always, if it seem "too" powerful for you, don't use it... as simple as that :)
(nobody forces you to use it, it seems to me)

In fact, we come back to this kind of subject already well debated :)
> Can we please Nerf Sniper Rifles?
 
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But like always, if it seem "too" powerful for you, don't use it... as simple as that :)
(nobody forces you to use it, it seems to me)
I don't get that argumentation, because couldn't you say that about everything, eventually ending up using just your fists without any gorilla arms etc?

You think that you get to fast around NC? Don't use cars.
To much healing you say? Don't use them
Skill points to OP? You are not forced to spend them.
Armor soak to much damage? Don't wear cloth

To me, if I should sum it up, its poor balancing. The stuff in a game should be there because it improves the gameplay and enhanced the experience, it shouldn't be there for the player to decide not to use it, because its to OP.
 
I don't get that argumentation, because couldn't you say that about everything, eventually ending up using just your fists without any gorilla arms etc?

You think that you get to fast around NC? Don't use cars.
To much healing you say? Don't use them
Skill points to OP? You are not forced to spend them.
Armor soak to much damage? Don't wear cloth

To me, if I should sum it up, its poor balancing. The stuff in a game should be there because it improves the gameplay and enhanced the experience, it shouldn't be there for the player to decide not to use it, because its to OP.

I also would like a more challenging mode, or possibly some balance, but the reality is that a very large part of the audience are playing it as an rpg, and a fantasy, and want to be able to either get through most encounters without much trouble so they can do the story/explore, or put extra time and effort to become overpowered gods.

the amount of people who want a challenging rpg is not as great as the rest.

I hope they add a hardcore mode or more difficult one in future iterations, but I get the feeling they won't.
 
the amount of people who want a challenging rpg is not as great as the rest.

I hope they add a hardcore mode or more difficult one in future iterations, but I get the feeling they won't.
That the "essential" point :)
Make the game "worse" for many players to please few players, that's sound not a good way to do it.
Yes, add a new "difficulty+++++" for those who want it, in my opinion, it's the only good solution to please every one.
You think that you get to fast around NC? Don't use cars.
To much healing you say? Don't use them
Skill points to OP? You are not forced to spend them.
Armor soak to much damage? Don't wear cloth
So for me like I said for armor, in very hard, at level 50, I'm "only" at 2.5K :)
(those who want more, they can. Those who want less for more challenge, they can. No problem at all)
I don't like TP point, I have never used them once... But I don't ask for remove them...
I'm level 20 in INT, System Reboot is too OP for me, I don't use it... But I don't ask for remove it...
 
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I also would like a more challenging mode, or possibly some balance, but the reality is that a very large part of the audience are playing it as an rpg, and a fantasy, and want to be able to either get through most encounters without much trouble so they can do the story/explore, or put extra time and effort to become overpowered gods.
But this is why they add easy difficulty. It shouldn't relate to the game mechanics as such. Very hard, is really easy except for the very start, when you are low on all. But it really doesn't take long before you reach a point where its fairly balanced and then you reach the end where its not even remotely a challenge anymore.

I never tried the game on anything but very hard, but I do think I heard that the enemy AI is even worse on lower difficulties, which is a decent way of doing it I think, rather than simply reducing their damage and health. And the very hard difficulty would probably be ok, if the smart, tech and quick hacking were a bit more balanced. I haven't done a lot of melee myself, so don't really know how that is on very hard? Because with the range stuff, one of the reasons its so easy, is obviously because you take them out from range, shooting through wall with auto aim. In general I think its really difficult to balance any game with such abilities.
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I don't like TP point, I have never used them once... But I don't ask for remove them...
I'm level 20 in INT, System Reboot is too OP for me, I don't use it... But I don't ask for remove it...
They shouldn't remove them, but they have to balance them. Either make it so it only stun them for a while, you need line of sight or whatever can be done.

The problem is with that legendary thing I got. Which I assume is one of the best in the game. And I think you can buy it, so its not hard to get. But it allows you to hack when you scan, and since you can do that through cameras as well. It just becomes silly. I usually did stealth most of the missions, because it fun, but it is also by far the slowest, compared to just going all out killing everything.
 
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But this is why they add easy difficulty. It shouldn't relate to the game mechanics as such. Very hard, is really easy except for the very start, when you are low on all. But it really doesn't take long before you reach a point where its fairly balanced and then you reach the end where its not even remotely a challenge anymore.

I never tried the game on anything but very hard, but I do think I heard that the enemy AI is even worse on lower difficulties, which is a decent way of doing it I think, rather than simply reducing their damage and health. And the very hard difficulty would probably be ok, if the smart, tech and quick hacking were a bit more balanced. I haven't done a lot of melee myself, so don't really know how that is on very hard? Because with the range stuff, one of the reasons its so easy, is obviously because you take them out from range, shooting through wall with auto aim. In general I think its really difficult to balance any game with such abilities.
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They shouldn't remove them, but they have to balance them. Either make it so it only stun them for a while, you need line of sight or whatever can be done.

The problem is with that legendary thing I got. Which I assume is one of the best in the game. And I think you can buy it, so its not hard to get. But it allows you to hack when you scan, and since you can do that through cameras as well. It just becomes silly. I usually did stealth most of the missions, because it fun, but it is also by far the slowest, compared to just going all out killing everything.


melee is a lot harder, especially hand to hand, but you still reach a point eventually, if you build smart, where very little is a threat to you. Its just the fact that the game is not designed for balance at high levels, its designed for RP. The top teir design of netrunning isnt that at the end its challenging, its that at the end you can dominate everyone around you with your hacking ability.

A top teir sniper build isn't supposed to be challenging, its supposed to be deadly and OP.

and a lot of people like that. I mean if you can't one to two shot someone, is it a sniper playstyle? If dudes instantly know where you are when you snipe, is that the sniper fantasy?

essentially they were designing playstyles, not really trying to create balance. The bad part about this is, it really ends up being up to the player to be true to whatever they envision, even when other options are easier. Like stealth play late game is way more involved than Guns blazing, or shooting through walls.

but balancing shooting through walls, or smart bullets, or sniping basically means removing them, because there is no balance for that type of thing.
 
And I think you can buy it, so its not hard to get.
-You can't buy it.
-You can earn it on access point with an "extrem luck".
-Or aquire it in a Side Quest (by hacking a "shard") but you have to know that before.
So it's not that easy and only useful if you have good CyberDeck :)

For me, also only stealth, like now (I reach the level 50) and I'm doing all the GIGs for have all the loot in Legendary (I never did one before).
But with "my challenge" to not been detected at all, enemies also not be alerted and don't use any weapon. In short, I do everything by hand.
I only use legendary "Optic Reboot" and legendary "Ping". And it still pretty efficient, not "cheaty" and fun ;)

If other players want decimate all the enemies through the walls with Contagion, that's their choice :)
 
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