[Scoia'tael] "Now We Must Stick Togther"

[Mr_Mugglez]

So...how you lot getting on with our beloved ST faction? This thread is more of an open topic about the faction, without giving anything away to other factions who read this part of the forum. For the record, I do not read any other factions forum.

Bronzes - I started out with Elves, nothing too exciting there. Then had a look at Dwarves and to be honest, not much better. It still seems you can't run a pure ST deck. I do like a good boost. But that style is always vulnerable to reset and scorch.
Golds - I have tons of scraps to make cards. I can make any deck I like but I've ony bothered with ST and, will continue to do so. Oh, and some neutral cards.
I wouldn't mind playing with removal removed to be honest. Okay, you can interfere with my deck with a lock, that's it. Get rid of reset and scorch altogether. Let us all play high score games for a while eh?
It would be interesting to see which faction came out on top, if this was the case i.e. no reset or removal at all.

 

[Sailears]

I'm still working on movement, but some of those traps - eg Incinerate and Crushing trap are looking to be a lot of fun - looking forward to trying a Francesca special deck maybe with both Iorveth cards, and Filavandrel handbuff deck (have seen one or two opponents playing a nice handbuff with this which looks fun).

I know Eithne is strong right now, but not immediately interested in building a deck around her.

With the amount of neutral cards I don't think it's going to be possible to build strong faction only decks - maybe some fun/flavour decks but not competing with other strong decks.

Having said that I think ST has a lot of solid cards to build around - eg Swordmasters, and it seems there's a lot of flexibility in combining elements of different archetypes into a single deck.

 

[Gadzooky]

Been honing my Eithne deck a fair bit with varying success using Ele'yas as a finishing card (Elves and Dyads only). It works more often than not, but can fail pretty hard against NR. I haven't really played around with Iorvath and traps, but I think there may be potential there.

Once I'm happy with my Elf deck then I'll try a dwarf one, I love those wee grumpy forkers.

I'm also curious too see how Saskia plus Eyck play as a penultimate or finishing combo.

 

[Mr_Mugglez]

NG Reveal with witchers and igni. very OP

 

[Sailears]

Been testing a Shupe/Uma Francesca deck:
https://gwenty.gg/deck/zkuHY

Still working on it, difficult to decide where to spend the points, but there are some nice synergies/win conditions eg Francesca/Renew/Uma chain - depending on what Uma pulls can be used across rounds or simply double Uma.
Also of course Francesca into double Ragh Nar Roog, and then finally Shupe.

But not happy with it yet, still early days - there's just so much choice for special cards.

 

[Mr_Mugglez]

I see SK discard all over the place...

 

[Lyserus]

Having a lot of fun with trap deck atm

 

[Mr_Mugglez]

Having a lot of fun with trap deck atm

I see CDPR have AGAIN! Given bloody NG the advantage....Haven't come up against SK on ranked but my god! For god sake...NG can get down to 4 cards round 3...keeps moving my cards from the deck to boost their own...How is that fair?

So what do we have? With all the factions specific methods. ST have....movement and immune. Maybe I should just focus on immune? But immune is vulnerable to non-target removal anyway. I tell you what. Thse youtube guys are bloody clever. At putting people off playing a game. I haven't seen ANY Swim, Merchant etc etc videos. Nothing against them but they just make the problem worse because kids on the internet will copy what they are doing.

 

[4RM3D]

A few posts deleted for insults or the implications thereof. Even if you have a point, please make it without belittling other players.

 

[Restlessdingo32]

Here's a few Fila decks I've tried...

1. The Elves are Coming

Filavandrel

Ithlinne
Isengrim
Aglais
Call of the Forest
Aelrinn
Milaen
Avalac'h
Ida
Ciaran
Yaevinn

2x Tbolt
1x DB Bomber
1x Vrihedd Sapper
2x DB Archer
2x Elven Wardancer
2x Vrihedd Officer
2x Vrihedd Vanguard
2x Elven Swordmaster
1x BMC

CoF is effectively a +3 Royal Decree at -3 provision cost when used on Aelrinn for consistency, in case anyone was curious.

2. Fila Engine Deck

Filavandrel

Gigni
Ithlinne
Aglais
Avalac'h
Ida
Ciaran
Eskel
Vesemir
Lambert

2x Tbolt
2x Hawker Smuggler
2x Mahakam Defender
2x Mahakam Ale
1x Vrihedd Sapper
2x DB Archer
1x Elven Wardancer
2x Vrihedd Officer
2x BMC

Deck 2 is more of an engine build.

Neither of the above work great against the stronger decks. They are a nice change of pace from Eithne though .

Here's a disgusting Eithne deck I've been experimenting with and haven't seen used yet.

3. SpellsRUS

Eithne

Scorch
Saesenthessis
Roach
Glorious Hunt
Frenzied Dao
Pitfall Trap
Eskel
Vesemir
Lambert

2x Epidemic
2x Tbolt
2x Alzur's Thunder
2x Rock Barrage
2x Incinerating Trap
1x Dshackles
2x Dbomb
2x Vrihedd Dragoon
1x BMC

I'd recommend against playing it since it isn't very fun . I did 2-0 an Eithne Artifact/Schirru deck with it though.

 

[Sailears]

Nice Filavandrel decks, been trying out some handbuff ideas but as you say it is really tough when up against some meta decks.

I think one of the difficulties in handbuff engines is Smugglers being 7 provisions - IMO this is too much, and if this gets immediately removed/locked/etc it ends up being 4+1 (from Filavandrel if in hand otherwise only 4) +1 buff to some random unit - so 6 points in total. I think Smugglers should be reduced to 6 provisions to help with this.

Given there's no direct targeting handbuff bronze units aside from Dwarven Agitators which only target Dwarves, it's fairly difficult to have any kind of consistency that isn't immediately hardcountered by certain removal decks. I've been running Triss:Butterflies and Ithlinne with Renew to focus some buffs on finishers, but aside from them and Agitators, there's only King of Beggars, Smugglers that handbuff - both with prohibitive provision costs for engines that can be removed in one turn, that make filling the remainder of a deck awkward.

I've been trying Sheldon Skaggs as R3 finisher (aka the new Swordmaster/Braenn), but given there is no way to reliably get him in hand it can be annoying if he sits in the deck all game.

Aglais looks to be a great idea though, will try this out.

Edit - taking some inspiration from your post above, I've been having fun with the following:
https://gwenty.gg/deck/vCyCa

Royal Decree - mainly to guarantee more consistent pulling of core golds, particularly Yrden. But the leader's large number of mulligans usually ensures getting at least most of the right cards by the end.
Ithlinne
Triss: Butterflies
Geralt: Yrden - this is a strange choice but nothing is more satisfying than levelling buffed rows. Especially now there are only two rows and no strengthening, so it can provide a lot of value, potentially more impactful than in beta.
Eskel: Pathfinder - a third "Mahakam Defender"
Frenzied D'ao - huge body when handbuffed even if artifact removal isn't necessary.
Nivellen - Mainly because it's the only thing that can counter Eredin/Ge'els reliably and also useful for setting up large value Yrden. But this is the main flex card, I keep swapping it for different things. Ida is solid alternative - boost can be useful to preserve engines and additional artifact removal can be useful. I've tried normal Ciri in here but sometimes she doesn't show up all game or is useless in certain situations. Also tried Avallac'h, but I felt I needed more ability to buff on the board with Ida.
Sheldon Skaggs - usually R3 finisher, if he decides to turn up in hand.

Hawker Smuggler x2
Mahakam Defender x2
Dimeritium Shackles x2
Mahakam Ale x2
Vrihedd Officer x2 - only one point less than Wardancers but has flexibility of damage or boost, useful to restart damaged Defenders.
Vrihedd Sappers x2
Blue Mountain Elite x2 - I like the instant 4 point removal, saves DShackles for bigger bodied threats.
Dwarven Agitator x2 - round openers for buffing Sheldon or Defenders
Elven Swordmaster x1 - removal bait for more important engines (but can rack up points if left unchecked).

There's so many more cards I want to fit in like Aglais, Renew, King of Beggars, Thunderbolt potions etc, but it's tricky with the provision limit.

 

[Dalinski]

Call of the Forest is an underrated card IMO. You can use it on Roach to bring out Phoenix in round one, Can use on a number of neutral Humans, on Aelirenn to search your deck for that Elf you really wanted. Roach and Aelirenn will then usually come straight back out again.

Depending on the deck you can sometimes use it on a Human spy to go searching for another Human (Triss) or a nasty rot tosser if you have a beast in your deck.

 

[Sailears]

I put Ida back in after having useless Nivellen in some matchups, but then I ran into Eredin/Ge'els just now... I tried a different strategy of tempo R1 and push long R2 to pull out as many cards but they saved that combo for R3 so it was just gg no way to counter.

I feel it's a bit stupid putting Nivellen in only for that - if that's the case then cdpr should get around to changing the interaction anyway.

Tried Call of the Forest a bit in this deck but realised Hawker Smugglers are Human and in general there are too many different primary category units in the current handbuff deck I'm playing that I wasn't getting the best use out of it. In something like a full elf deck like Restlessdingo32's deck it makes more sense. Also for me facing removal makes it difficult to use if not having a target to swap with on the board.

Funnily enough I've been having some decent results vs Eithne of all things - mainly because while they have a ton of removal they don't seem to get many points out on the board. So far the few successes have been not pushing R1 - number of turns depends how many trash bronzes to get rid of, coinflip situation and how many artifacts/removal to bait out of them but preserving artifact removal for R2/R3, using Fila round 2 and sacrificing units in the order that feels right and preserving finishers like huge boosted units, Yrden, Sheldon, plus a couple of decent engines for R3. Of course I haven't faced enough players to make a judgement - especially if they're smart and save scorch etc for late round 3.

Post automatically merged: Nov 1, 2018

I wish Yrden had Human primary tag so Call of the Forest could pull it. As a Witcher tag it just further incentivises running the three stooges (Vesemir et al) which I'd rather not waste provision points on.

Been struggling to think of ways to consistently get Yrden but sometimes neither it nor royal decree will show. Or worse it gets pulled out of the deck by Tibor or some similar nonsense.

Anyway those annoyances aside, I've tweaked a few things for consistency and feeling a bit more comfortable with it:
https://gwenty.gg/deck/gXTpK

Royal Decree
Yrden
Ithlinne
Eskel Pathfinder
Frenzied D'ao
Ida
King of Beggars
Sheldon Skaggs
Ciaran

Smugglers x2
Defenders x2
DShackles x2
Mahakam Ale x2
Vrihedd Officers x2
Sappers x2
BME x2
Agitators x2

I dropped Triss to fit KoB for a "third Smuggler" both for consistency and control bait.
Ciaran has been swapped for Necromancy although it's a toss up which is better - sometimes the res is nice to use engines across rounds, sometimes having 3 locks in deck is better for consistency.

 

[DarkTl]

So how do you play spells ST now? I don't get it. HC removed most of the ways to play a spell ST deck, such as sages reusing them or farseers getting proper bonuses.

 

[Sailears]

So how do you play spells ST now? I don't get it. HC removed most of the ways to play a spell ST deck, such as sages reusing them or farseers getting proper bonuses.

Farseers suffer the same nonsense rng gameplay as reveal NG which is sad (and they reveal from your deck giving the opponent information - I really don't like that), there are no decent gold counterparts to Sages, and there doesn't seem to be any clear archetype win condition - which I suppose is good in a way because I doubt anyone wants to see a return of buffing units in deck by playing spells and then pulling out huge R3 finishers.

Handbuff has things like King of Beggars, Ithlinne, Triss:Butt, and synergies onto Sheldon Skaggs, Aglais plus at least a few bronze units that benefit such that there's multiple synergies. Spell doesn't really have anything like that - and given how prevalent removal is right now, Sages are just going to die/get locked even if using Operator/Necromancy/Renew.

So it seems better to mix and match things with different leaders. Francesca is of course a good ability, but I think both Sages and Farseers are weak, especially if you compare with things like Mahakam Defenders or most other bronzes.

 

[DarkTl]

I see, so basically cards focused on using spells, including Francesca, now exist only for the sake of variety, and in fact are mostly useless, because spells archetype doesn't exist anymore due to lack of proper synergy. Too bad. I don't want to play artifacts but like control and ST.

 

[Dalinski]

Well you could try some-thing with Sarah and Johnny for spell buff. But I am finding it very hard to keep even 4 point engine's alive let alone 3 point ones.

 

[Sailears]

I dropped Ithlinne in my handbuff deck in favour of Aguara for additional lock/unlock, also due to the hand size limit where sometimes playing Ithlinne feels like a waste of a turn, so now with the following:
https://gwenty.gg/deck/zs9sp

Royal Decree
Yrden
Eskel Pathfinder
Aguara
Frenzied D'ao
Ida
King of Beggars
Sheldon Skaggs
Ciaran
Milva

Smugglers x2
Defenders x2
DShackles x2
Mahakam Ale x2
Sappers x2
Vrihedd Officer x1
BME x2
Agitators x2

Have tried variations with normal Ciri, CotF and more witchers in there, to help with card advantage - because a lot of losses with this deck are down to not having last say. But I couldn't justify the provision cost.
Also tried Necromancy, but the problem there is the only good targets are Hawker Smugglers - because Defenders have to be buffed to activate which is a two turn process with Necromancy. So I put Milva in as a cheap pseudo-Defender/Eskel to help with points if dropped early in the round - it usually gets at least 7 value equal to the provision cost so I'm happy with that.

Aguara is just a fantastic and flexible card which in some matchups I felt like not having enough locks (eg vs NR decks) if having bad draws, so this additional card helps with consistency as well as a third unlock option together with Mahakam Ales.

Altogether I feel so far this is the most consistent for draws, helped by Filavandrel's higher mulligan count - 3 potential unlocks, 4 locks, 4 artifact removals, 3 handbuff engines, 4 board buff engines and a few removals plus a couple of finishers. Would like to have a neutral or ST Peter Saar Gwynleve to double up on Yrden's ability which is the only problem if not drawing that as a finisher (but usually it's there if preserving some mulligans for R3), because I'd rather have a unit/body for handbuff than a special card like artefact compression or mandrake.

Once the patch comes and artifacts are balanced, I'll probably drop one or two artifact removals in favour of other cards, but right now having four of them with reasonable bodies that are usually handbuffed a bit higher is too useful when facing those kind of decks.

So far this and the previous variations have got me from 24 to 14, still on positive winning streak so will see how high it can go.

 

[Gadzooky]

I've been playing around with a Trap pack and a Move pack with some success (maybe about 50%).

Decks: It's a Trap & Dick Move

I really enjoy the Trap Deck, but Serpent Trap so far has been pretty useless I've found, and finishing with Ele'yas can be so hit and miss. I use Filavandrel's Leader ability so everyone is buffed in round 3 and try and engineer both Crushing Traps proc late in the round to have as many of the opponents cards damaged for a big point swing. Like I say, it can be a bit hit and miss, but I feel there is potential there.

The Move Deck is fun, but relies heavily on Dol Blathanna Sentry. Hands down though, there is nothing more fun than using the Strays, Rock Barrage and Malena to push all your opponents to the Ranged Row, then using Nivellen to move the entire row and having both Sentry's proc on every move. It's a tough one to manage, though. I finish with the Brouver/Agläis + Count Caldwell. Again, needs fine tuning and it's a bit of an all or nothing deck, but I enjoy it.

I've only been using these a couple of days so they are not quite where I envisioned the finished article. I need to work in a Thunderbolt in each and I welcome any other suggestions.

 

[Restlessdingo32]

Xavier Moran works pretty well in buff decks (pairs well with Wyvern shields, has a higher cap off Tbolts compared to Eithne due to a bigger body, might survive getting placed before the bolts if you can push him to 5 off Fila and/or use other hand-buff like Smugglers). Just tossing it out there. The biggest weakness is to locks (Ales can solve that) and removals.

I used a Fran deck with both Aglais and Moran with Garrison (40 pt Aglais gogogo) and, believe it or not, Froth/Zoltan . It also runs shields, Black Blood as a pseudo Scorch (put down shield, put down Black Blood and buff opponent unit with shield), and Bekker's as another counter to big buffed opponent units (surprisingly good way to neutralize TA too...). It's more for casual though.

Question about the trap deck... I'm assuming Iorveth can return triggered traps. Is that correct? Double Pitfall sounds epic.