Should I start the game again? Please advise.

[Mizzen01]

A Mcguffin is something that makes the plot advance, but actually is not important for the story. Could be a treasure that everybody wants, a character that the main character are looking for but is not actually a main character, a menace for other characters. For example, the White Frost is a Mcguffins in the game TW3, and is OK. But the whole story of one of the main characters that fills half of the books, or more, can't be a Mcguffin.

 

[Rawls]

... huh ... I just realized this whole conversation we are now having has nothing to do with the thread topic.

 

[ph3s]

Read my theory. This will make you game play more pleasant with no doubts about books

http://forums.cdprojektred.com/threads/57315-I-know-what-really-happened

 

[Mizzen01]

All of the things you mention, are important in the books. They serve the story when needed. And I really don't know what really bothers you regarding e.g. the races of elves or the experements? Everything is explained.
The story is about the journey, not a certain "thing" that has to happen in the end.

It bothers me because the author don´t do a thing with all of that at the end of the story. If you remove all of that from the books, the story is mostly the same, but shorter.

---------- Updated at 01:06 PM ----------

.. huh ... I just realized this whole conversation we are now having has nothing to do with the thread topic.

You are totally right. We have distorted the topic. I´m sorry.

 

[Charcharo]

Confusing the main argument with McGuffin is a narrative technique in Eastern Europe? That's absurd. And I´m not talking about real life. I´m talking about a narrative. And narrative has to observe rules. And one rule is "you don´t write thousand of pages about a prophecy, the destiny of the main character, races of elves, a great genealogical experiment, etc. if, at the end, nothing of that matters for the conclusion of the story". If the story is about Geralt, Yennefer, Triss and Ciri, I´m OK with that. Actually, is the part of the story I like. But then, why to write four or five books about things that are not important? I'll tell you: because if the author only writes three books and remove all the filling in the story, he would miss the money by the other five.

About the ending, I would expected that the main characters don't die during a random riot killed by a random character. And, if they are dead, are deat, the thing of Ciri and Avalon is just stupid. They are not "rex quondam, rexque futurus".

Seems like you did not actually get what I wrote. Notice, how I did not actually argue whether it is a McGufffin or not.

Writing a good story is not something that has an exact ruleset. There is no single way to make a good story.

There are certain proven guidelines that, if followed, would generally make for a good story. That is it. That is all there is to it. Those are not mathematical formulas, where deviation may mean that you failed... those are guidelines.

Notice how many of the classics of the given genres are NOT completely formulaic. Many for example depend on their characters to make the "scenes" and the characters. Others dont ACTUALLY depend on characters as much, rather concepts or even the environment. Some of them fill the entire world with a metric f*ck ton of detail (Tolkien... ) or try to keep it as short and to the point as humanly possible. Both are VERY valid approaches. Sapkowski is one that tries to keep some balance really.

Basically... literature is not as formulaic as you seem to think it is And it NEVER has been.

As for the actual examples you are using, pretty much everything Sapko wrote has its reason to be there. Some of it is *FLUFF * (this is NOT bad, contrary to what some people may think), some of it is used to NAIL down world states and suggest possible future but outside the scope of the story, events. Some, still, is used to build up characters and the themes associated to those characters. Eredin and the Wild Hunt for example.

BTW, removing "filling" is also not a rule set in stone. If you want to remove filling, ALL of it, you will end up with ... what was it, 6 basic tales that humanity is CONSTANTLY reusing over and over again, except with different dressing.

In real life, people often die due to seemingly random things. A random villager too is a his own story, his own idea and his own hero in his own little world. It is random for a "central" figure to die from one that is not... maybe... but THIS is something that happens in real life very often. And this now is part of what I was talking about (as something Eastern Europe seems to like to dabble in... at times). The mortality, randomness... like a twisted fairy tale parody

 

[Mizzen01]

Charcharo, you can say "I like the burgers burned until they are black", but you can´t say that burning the burgers till they are black is the proper way to cook burgers. That's the same. Do you like all the filling the author puts in The Witcher serie? It´s OK for me. But you can't say that writing a story with at least three or four books of filling is the proper way to narrate a story. And yes, literature, even the one is not art but entertaining, as Sapkowski's one, needs rules and proper narrative techniques. Again: this is not real life, is literature. It's all I´m going to say in this thread topic.We have distorted it too much .

 

[Charcharo]

Charcharo, you can say "I like the burgers burned until they are black", but you can´t say that burning the burgers till they are black is the proper way to cook burgers. That's the same. Do you like all the filling the author puts in The Witcher serie? It´s OK for me. But you can't say that writing a story with at least three or four books of filling is the proper way to narrate a story. And yes, literature, even the one is not art but entertaining, as Sapkowski's one, needs rules and proper narrative techniques. Again: this is not real life, is literature. It's all I´m going to say in this thread topic.We have distorted it too much .

These analogies would work... if we were designing a machine. Not here though.

You see 2-3 books of filling. I see almost none. That, I guess, is the problem. By definition a subjective one... but I'd rather not have any attempts to make it an objective one

 

[Erif_Nogard]

Warning. Reading the books could ruin your complete experience with the games. In the books all the characters are pretty fucked up. Specially Ciri. It´s difficult to feel simpathy for her after reading some of the things she does in the books. Also, some of the books are really bad. The author loses in the story. It seems that some of the books (the whole serie are 8, I think) are just for lengthening the story and selling more books. The ending of the story in books is very crappy too. It seems the author didn't think how the story was going to end when she started to write the first two or three books.

Oddly enough, I've heard this said about the books elsewhere too. In any case I finished my first playthrough of the game, got my copy of the "Last Wish" yesterday and have begun reading it. So I shall be making up my own mind whether this is true about the series or not

 

[Mizzen01]

Oddly enough, I've heard this said about the books elsewhere too. In any case I finished my first playthrough of the game, got my copy of the "Last Wish" yesterday and have begun reading it. So I shall be making up my own mind whether this is true about the series or not

I think "The last wish" is a pretty good collection of short stories about Geralt. Also the second book, "Sword of Destiny". The third one, "The blood of elves" is OK too. It has some really good moments. My problem is with the others. There are some good scenes in all of them, but in my opinion, the author loses the story.

 

[Vigilance.492]

There's a loose connection between this thread's topic the current discussion, but it's very weak and this thread had gone ~2 weeks without a reply and now we're into a pretty off-topic situation.

Mizzen01 started his/her own thread that has a title and discussion that more closely pertains to this general discussion, so let's just keep all further talk like this (Ciri, other characters and the books in general, over there) http://forums.cdprojektred.com/thre...o-you-feel-sympathy-for-the-character-of-Ciri

And to the OP, if you were saving the thread to come back to and continue a discussion, then I'm sorry it's now closed, but feel free to start another (You can even link to the initial posts and go a-new).