Soft Targeting

[whitelion1284]

Soft Targeting

Two enemies. One is right next to Geralt, within range of his sword, and has already been hit. One more swipe of the sword and that enemy is dead and out of the fight. One might call this enemy the "obvious" target. The other is between three and four meters away and cannot be hit by an attack unless Geralt repositions himself. So why on earth does Geralt, time and time and time and time and time again... swipe in the direction of the target he cannot hit?

This game is beautiful. It's awesome. But there are so many of these stupid little.. what do you call this? It's not a "bug". It's not a glitch. An oversight? Like Geralt putting his sword away while archers are shooting at him, or not being able to jump up to that ledge so he can actually reach the enemies that just aggroed. Well, whatever we call them they regularly have me wanting to tear my hair out.

---------- Updated at 07:05 PM ----------

Apparently I'm not done bitching. Apologies.

I just don't understand what is up with the soft targeting. If there is a peasant on screen and Geralt tries to cast a sign, it's directed at the peasant, often accompanied by the message "You cannot attack this target." Getting into the hut to get that old lady's pan is a pain in the ass. Setting fire to that last pile of corpses is, likewise, a pain in the ass. Because for some reason Geralt is targeting the peasants. Yet in combat, when you'd expect to WANT to target enemies, I'm regularly watching Geralt do completely retarded crap like swing his sword nine times and miss the three enemies I'm bumping elbows with (I don't even know how that's possible). I just don't get it.

 

[Garrison72]

I'm not having near the problems you are but that's partly because I've finally got TW2's targeting mechanic out of my head when I'm playing this game. It still seems wonky. The best remedy is not to spam the attack button so the chance of Geralt running at an unintended foe is greatly reduced. It's weird, I thought this would be a pretty big deal with people but it's not. More people bitched about TW2's targeting but imo that system worked better. I'd like to hear a dev explain how it's supposed to work, or at least exactly what they intended so that I can adjust my approach. Do I use the keys to target? The keys and camera? Or is it supposed to work by only using the camera, and I have to gauge how close I am to an enemy? Chances are slim they'd say something but they surely would have designed it with specific methods in mind and not just 'let Geralt hop around till he hits something'. As to your other woes, only rarely had that issue. I just readjust Geralt and he targets whatever door, quest giver etc.

 

[BoboTheMighty]

That's the best part about it...this game would be BETTER if we just had the option to disable this clumsy autosheathing, autotargeting, automatic camera centering from the game.
For god's sake, CDPR, this would take only a few hours for any of your programmers to implement and would make the game far less frustrating for majority of players. Please add this and some extra FoV options to the next patch.

 

[whitelion1284]

That's the best part about it...this game would be BETTER if we just had the option to disable this clumsy autosheathing, autotargeting, automatic camera centering from the game.
For god's sake, CDPR, this would take only a few hours for any of your programmers to implement and would make the game far less frustrating for majority of players. Please add this and some extra FoV options to the next patch.

I can help with two of the three. No Autosheathing, No Automatic Camera Centering, and there's even a mod to disable the softlock targeting... but I find that last one to be a bit odd cos it COMPLETELY disables the soft targeting, resulting in Geralt ALWAYS attacking forward, which in some cases (Whirl) is unbelievably powerful but the rest of the time feels... off. There's no soft lock for aiming bombs or the crossbow either.

*shrug*

What I'd like is for the soft targeting to be SMARTER. Right now it's simply insane, randomly choosing targets out of a group and sending Geralt into what is essentially a very aggressive seizure. I mean in the very first example I was in the middle of a three hit combo. The first two hits were aimed at and hit the guy directly in front of me. The third turned Geralt around and sent him swinging his sword through the air at the guy that was ten feet away!

These are just the ants at the picnic. It's like the decision to make animation trump control. In TW3 Geralt's animations come first, instead of being defined by the player controlling him. If you want to know what I mean try collecting loot while swimming. And the only reason I'm upset about it is this game is freaking awesome! It just also happens to be maddeningly frustrating because some things weren't thought all the way through.

Anyway.... cheers.

 

[JohnnyWalks]

You guys sure have a point and have mentioned the main 'issues' so to speak, so I won't repeat them. As for a solution to these problems, I have only one that can work both in PC and consoles (I clarify this because console players can't use mods, I'm one of those players). It doesn't take any downloads, mods, updates or anything; only thing you have to do is change your play style. In other games a more aggressive 'slashy slashy' approach is possible, sometimes even necessary. Well, for me taking a more defensive, precatious and careful approach helped a lot. By this what I mean is that when fighting a group of enemies perhaps of every hit I landed I would dogde 3 or 4 hits thrown at me so that I could get my enemies in a straight line or make them separate from each other so that when I hit one of them I have enough time to dodge the others attacks, also I would only strick when the 'openings' were safe meaning that I would, at all times, keep my distance from the group so that dodging became easier (and I had Quen ALWAYS active, just in case). I have to admit though that it doesn't make the issues go away, but it helps with staying alive and not getting sooo frustrated. Oh and fighting this way takes ages, specially with overleveled opponents that have too much health

 

[Genoscythe]

Another problem are the moves of geralt. You basically never know what strike type he will do next or if he will jump on an enemy or just do a standing slash with slight movement. If every sword type had its own moveset you always know what the first, second and third strike will look like, but right now I dont see a system there.

 

[TacticalAce42]

I literally came to the forums to make this topic, I shit you not! Anybody that says you are "bitching" is insane! Seriously, I dont understand when people try to deny the "TRUTH".

This is singlehandedly ruining my experience for TW3... I think the people who dont complain as much, or brush it off is people playing on normal difficulty to easy... Starting at the "Blood and Broken Bones" where any mis step can lead to your demise it is IMPERATIVE that Geralt stays on target... Even if you use "Lock on target" it doesnt truly stay on that target........

*WE NEED TO TARGET NEAREST ENEMY*

If Geralt targets the closest enemy HE NEEDS TO CONTINUE to fight that enemy unless he rolls out of melee range... If he is out of Melee range he needs to switch to the closest target!!!

Time and time again Geralt swings to an the appropriate enemy, AND THEN RANDOMLY SWITCHES TO AN ENEMY NO WHERE NEAR HIM......

This needs to be patched ASAP...

Sorry for the caps but I needed to stress how serious this issue hinders this game...

---------- Updated at 03:58 AM ----------

I'm regularly watching Geralt do completely retarded crap like swing his sword nine times and miss the three enemies I'm bumping elbows with (I don't even know how that's possible). I just don't get it.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS x 10

As stated in my other post, it frustrates you more at higher difficultys... The game is a pure masterpiece and I love everything about it except this, excruciating issue...

AND No, I dont want to wait 5 years for this to be fixed in the next witcher...

 

[Garrison72]

^Should it be the nearest enemy? Or always be the enemy we are facing with the target icon above their head?

 

[TacticalAce42]

^Should it be the nearest enemy? Or always be the enemy we are facing with the target icon above their head?

Yes, but only when the current target is far out of melee range and another enemy is closer, for example when the water hag teleports away and a drowner becomes closest to you and is technically highest threat.

 

[PillarBiter]

I've never had any problem with the soft targeting and use it always.

you realise you can push the direction of the stick... right?

 

[ReptilePZ]

Geralt always attacks the enemy you're moving towards. It's based on the directional keys, think Arkham combat. I agree it's still wonky and could use some polishing, but understanding how combat actually works is important in order to have fewer frustrating moments.

 

[Charcharo]

A Cool Twist would be to have the different stances back and make them influence the soft targeting system.
Would be rad IMHO.

 

[Garrison72]

Another problem are the moves of geralt. You basically never know what strike type he will do next or if he will jump on an enemy or just do a standing slash with slight movement. If every sword type had its own moveset you always know what the first, second and third strike will look like, but right now I dont see a system there.

This is irrelevant because the distance covered and frames for each of the two attack types are consistent. The actual animations are window dressing. This is why you see the more elaborate moves sped up to match the simpler ones.

 

[whitelion1284]

Why do people insist on showing up in a thread to state they don't have the issue? Actually, I don't want to know. I don't care. My point is that it is an annoying and pointless habit that succeeds only at irritating people.

I've never had any problem with the soft targeting and use it always.

you realise you can push the direction of the stick... right?

Not when you play with a mouse and keyboard, and please, please, PLEASE spare me the suggestions to switch to a controller. But this does highlight the issue. Playing with a mouse and keyboard results in the mouse becoming the means to target, and pressing toward an enemy becomes problematic because of the rapid changes in camera angle in relation to the WASD keys. I'll try to be more mindful about using directional attacks but A) it doesn't always work and B) the soft targeting still needs work. It could be A LOT smarter.

 

[Charcharo]

I play on mouse and keyboard and generally had no problems with the combat... my only issue is being unable to loot and jump when in combat stance.

*Biggest PC elitist on the forum... probably is me

 

[cloolvl]

most of the time i ignore that and just keep fighting

if i really want to hit a specific enemy, i make sure to aim at him as if i had a shooter crosshair in the middle of my screen and i make sure to do that before clicking attack

seems to work so far

Another problem are the moves of geralt. You basically never know what strike type he will do next or if he will jump on an enemy or just do a standing slash with slight movement. If every sword type had its own moveset you always know what the first, second and third strike will look like, but right now I dont see a system there.

in my experience hes been pretty consistent depending on the distance to the enemy

i just need to get a better feel for the exact distance the attack changes and im set

 

[erxv]

Playing with a mouse and keyboard results in the mouse becoming the means to target, and pressing toward an enemy becomes problematic because of the rapid changes in camera angle in relation to the WASD keys.

you are the one moving the camera, so you should know exactly when and in which direction the camera is going to move so you can adjust your WASD pressing accordingly.

if you are having trouble moving the camera and using the WASD keys at the same time i recommend you practice with lower level enemies.

 

[Lieste]

One of the main issues is that the damage model is "all or nothing". It favours killing one target before scratching any others, because this reduces incoming attacks fastest.

It is more likely that a wounded opponent will be (even if eventually, rather than immediately) slowed and disabled by his wounds. In this case, hitting *every* opponent while not being hit in return will reduce the ability to attack more than doing the same damage to kill one opponent.
Equally being in an injured state should hurt Geralt's performance, rather than just being a limited pool, with no other consequences.

 

[whitelion1284]

you are the one moving the camera, so you should know exactly when and in which direction the camera is going to move so you can adjust your WASD pressing accordingly.

if you are having trouble moving the camera and using the WASD keys at the same time i recommend you practice with lower level enemies.

I don't even know what to say to this. My first reaction involved profanity.

The ENTIRE point of this thread is that if it were CONSISTENT I'd be fine. The problem is that when I'm in a group the soft targeting mechanism is RETARDED! In the example I gave in the first post I was LOOKING AT one enemy. I was attacking that enemy and that enemy was the closest and most logical target yet the game decided for me to change the target to the enemy three and half meters away that Geralt couldn't hit, immediately presenting his back to the one that would have died if Geralt had actually attacked him, which then got me killed.

If you want to be a fanboy and leap to the defense of the game when someone brings legitimate concerns to the forum instead of contributing something helpful then by all means go be useless somewhere else.

Thanks much.

 

[JasonShepard]

Another problem are the moves of geralt. You basically never know what strike type he will do next or if he will jump on an enemy or just do a standing slash with slight movement. If every sword type had its own moveset you always know what the first, second and third strike will look like, but right now I dont see a system there.

Geralt has a set moveset. You do know what he's going to do next, nothing is random.
People had the same issue with The Witcher 2 even though Geralt also had a set moveset in that game.