Something Ends Something Begins

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Yeah but she also admits in the empress ending that this is the only way she can actually change things and make them better which is what she wants to do. Of course it's hard.

No, Witcher ending is the "good" ending and it's also the most Sapkowski like ending, so I would consider it the most canon one.

I hated the writing. It was corny. You also totally neglect to take into account that we are not talking about 13 or 14 year old Syanna but mid 30's Syanna. It's been 20 years. You are telling me that 20 years later she still can not think for herself? She willingly climbed the ladder to command the gang she is in charge of. It's her doing. As for Dettlaff... who has he harmed before that? Regis doesn't mention one "victim" rather the opposite. He keeps to himself, he intervened when someone he considered to be a friend was threatened. How is he a monster? Btw. how is someone impressionable when they have enough malice of their own to pelt a Nilfgaardian ambasador with bladders filled with sewage?

Dude, just stop it, you obviously have no fucking clue about how mental illnesses work. She was clearly traumatized and probably had one or several personality disorders due to her fate. And yes, she was raped by the Knight, she says so literally, but nice try wiggling out of that in your earlier post.
It's obvious, that mentally she still is the abused and wronged little girl and all she wants is to get revenge for that. But if you actually take the time to talk to her, you can feel that she's opening up, the little girl is starting to develop and get out of her protective "shell" (as in her mind would have built up walls around her feelings to prevent her from having to deal with the trauma she experienced and thus prevented her from actually getting in connection with her feelings).
So, no, she's not a bad person, she's a hurt little girl that never grew up, because of the way she was treated. And the good ending is you helping her in starting to get closure by forgiving Anna and thus getting on her way to working through her issues.
 
But if you actually take the time to talk to her, you can feel that she's opening up, the little girl is starting to develop and get out of her protective "shell" (as in her mind would have built up walls around her feelings to prevent her from having to deal with the trauma she experienced and thus prevented her from actually getting in connection with her feelings).

I think Geralt is probably one of the first if not the first individual she encounters who's not a Yesman. Someone who's not taken by her aura of manipulation and actually offers his own perspective on things instead of taking hers. She meets this strong character and probably for the first time in her life sees things from another perspective and that makes a change in her.
 
I did not really like either of the endings. The good one felt wrong, the other one everyone dies, the other Gerald lands in prison. I feel the main victim of B&W was Dettalaf. Poor dude got duped, then killed and Dutches sister get a poke in the ribs and all is forgiven (with all the crap she got up to). Regis has to leave cause he killed one of his brethren.....

HOS had better endings (either one)

B&W endings left me siting staring at the screen ......much like the endings of the main game campaign lol.
 
No, Witcher ending is the "good" ending and it's also the most Sapkowski like ending, so I would consider it the most canon one.



Dude, just stop it, you obviously have no fucking clue about how mental illnesses work. She was clearly traumatized and probably had one or several personality disorders due to her fate. And yes, she was raped by the Knight, she says so literally, but nice try wiggling out of that in your earlier post.
It's obvious, that mentally she still is the abused and wronged little girl and all she wants is to get revenge for that. But if you actually take the time to talk to her, you can feel that she's opening up, the little girl is starting to develop and get out of her protective "shell" (as in her mind would have built up walls around her feelings to prevent her from having to deal with the trauma she experienced and thus prevented her from actually getting in connection with her feelings).
So, no, she's not a bad person, she's a hurt little girl that never grew up, because of the way she was treated. And the good ending is you helping her in starting to get closure by forgiving Anna and thus getting on her way to working through her issues.

I already gave you my point of view. She is not mentally ill. She has at worst some kind of trauma and at best is basically just a bitter bitch. Furthermore her trauma started 20 years ago. 20 years in which she could have gotten help, simply worked through it or gotten some perspective on it all. She didn't, she turned to crime and became a violent criminal way before she came back to Toussaint. Do we explain that with trauma as well? That she chose the life of a criminal ring leader, terrorizing people, probably killing a few or having them killed, robbing people etc. way before she ever got back to Toussaint? I wonder how someone who has been allegedly traumatized, as you claim, by being raped and forced from her home justify in any way to basically do the same to parties who are in a similar if not worse situation, since before she came back to Toussaint I strongly doubt she only chose to rob the rich.

And no she didn't say raped. She said word for word he abused her. She did not say raped, violated, sexually abused or whatever. She said abused. Check the definition of abuse. It might as well be physical punishment or simple physical violence which, in this situation, seems far more likely to me because even in the description of the misdeeds in Syanna's letters to Dettlaff there is no mention of rape or anything coming close:

Crespi was considered dishonourable and a rogue. No indication of any wrong doing there she mentiones he beat her with a horsewhip after she tried escaping.

Du Lac was described as an idiot and being unjust, again that ties in fairly well with what she claims he did to her which is deny her food and abuse her. But she says abuse, not rape, not sexual abuse, not violate her, not fuck her, plow her or whatever. Abuse. Given that she indicated him for murder because his unjust judgements caused people to lose their lifes I personally still think it way more likely we are talking about corporal punishment and physical abuse.

De La Croix and Peyrac-Peyran basiscally were also accused of beind dishonorable and Peyrac-Peyran of being a coward. Probably because Syanna blamed them for not uttering a single word in her defense and for leaving her in the woods in a thin dress during winter.

So there is no evidence. You can watch the conversation she has with Geralt here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKX_WqROCtU from 9:45 onwards.

Furthermore mental illness? Do you know how many women are raped, sexuall molested and beaten? Do you know how few of those women, if any, become complete sociopaths and turn to crime and running a criminal syndicate? Do you know how few even defend themselves or kill their tormentor if they have the chance? It usually takes them years of constant abuse to snap. Yet you claim a girl which, up to that point, had a fairly sheltered and well provided life and was happy enough tormenting other people before all that happens is so traumatized by all that that she loses herself for 20 years and even plans killing her sister who is in no way responsible for what befall her, being an child of 12 years old at the time? That is just rubbish.

More importantly we are talking about an episode. She wasn't held in a cage for 30 years and constantly beaten and molested. She probably spend a week at most with the knights, if that, when they escorted her out of the Duchy and left her in the border lands to fend for herself. So, besides being examined by some sorcerers she basically got her ass powdered between ages 0 and 15, then got thrown out, had 1-2 horrible weeks, met some bandits who didn't molest her, took her in and became their leader, terrorized common folk with her gang for 20 odd years and then comes back to murder people, wage war on the common folk (because that is what happens when you try to overthrow a sitting government) and kill her sister? Yeah, she sure sounds like a little girl... a spoilt little brat who doesn't give a shit because all she thinks is: mine, mine, mine, mine, mine, mine, all mine, fuck everyone, all mine.

Seriously if the women in these games need to have some sort of mental illness or complex so you can find them attractive and get vested in them then by all means... enjoy her but please don't spout this nonsense. Do you know what the difference between murder and man slaughter is? It's intent. The difference between murder 1 and murder 2? It's the planning and calculation. In Germany that is called base motives and special insidiousness which negates any form of mental illness, trauma or what so ever. This is a plan she has been hatching for years. The motives are clear, she even employs people just for this, she prepares it and even worse uses the defenselessness of the victims. Peyrac-Peyran was not dressed in armor and did not have a weapon on him. Another man was sleeping, a third was probably drunk or half drunk and the fourth was basically letting his guard down to a close personal friend. Anna Henrietta did not expect anything at all. If you do not talk Syanna out of it she will even go through with killing her sister when her sister asks for forgiveness and shows remorse, she uses an embrace to kill her. That is icecold. We are not talking about a little girl here or a mental illness. We are talking about a cold, calculated revenge killing with a base motive, enriching herself and getting controll of the duchy. For no matter how she tries to bend it, the end game would be to take her rightful place, as she was planning a rebellion which she told the owner of the castle she had comandeered and expressed several times when talking about her lost birth right.

So what do you want more? 20 years of planning, dozens of people involved, manipulation of a close friend, absolute cold precision when going for the kills and the endgame being to take Anna Henrietta's place. That is murder 1 no matter where you go in this world. That get's you life in prison with no parole or the death sentence. You can not claim mental illness in any court if it is shown without reasonable doubt that the accused had her faculties in order so much that she was able to plan and orchestrate a detailed plan to kill someone for personal gain. It's even worse when you can show that the person had the intelligence and mental faculties to actually form a criminal syndicate and lead it and obviously achieve her goals.

No matter how you twist it, in no country in the world would she go free or be declared insane, even temporarily.
 
I have only played through once and gotten the good ending. Gonna start a second playthrough now and probably going to have Syanna killed by Dettlaff and let him get away with her. I won't let that little shit ruin the Duchy because she is oh so sad someone threw her out 20 years ago. I hate that little shit and after I had to kill Dettlaff and Regis got basically chased out of Toussaint I really wonder what the devs were thinking having this shitty ending as sort of the best one you can get? The best one would be: Syanna dead, Dettlaff leaving, Regis staying, you still get the order of merit or whatever and go with the thanks of the Duchess.

How is it that Anna Henrietta is happy to hand out death sentences for imagined slights or unfaithful lovers yet she is perfectly happy to forgive her sister who had 4 knights killed, planned to kill her, caused Detlaff and his vampires to run roughshot over Beauclair and probably kill hundreds, steal the ducal wine and incite rebellion in her subjects? This is such a bunch of bullshit. If she really did that the Duchy would be up in fucking arms.

I agree with you. I was not happy with Syanna. She did not deserve the reconciliation ending she got with Anna in my game. Dettlaff got played and she conspired to get everyone killed, how is it that she can walk away from the whole thing. Anna pissed me off towards the later half too. Like screw her Dukedom, my sister gets a pass because it's my blood, yet I can still kill someone for saying something bad about me. It was honestly annoyed AF.

If I didn't have a nice Vineyard to kick it with Yen and Regis alive (favorite character of the expansion) I probably wouldn't care for this story.

---------- Updated at 04:45 PM ----------

That's why I'm redoing my playthrough becouse I don't care about Syanna. The person I care most is Regis and I want him to stay ( on the end he will go and try to find Dettraff and help him but he can always come back ) not have to flee becouse he have to kill his friend who was used in very cruel way. He will not kill if it wasn't for her. Geralt is in jail but Jaskier save him and I think only then Jaskier knows about Regis returned. We still have Corvo Bianco and Yennefer on the end. What more can I ask. This is the bad ending? For me it is the best!:pride2:

That sounds like a much better ending. I am going to try that in my NG+. Regis was my favorite character.
 
Stop moaning about "poor Dettlaff". Guy was rogue and unstable, it was Regis' "project" to "ciivilize him", before he becomes a problem for the whole of vampire kind. The project failed, he had to be put down. End of story.

The only downside is that Regis bears the blame, while he only did what was necessary. It was not an easy decision for him, but it just had to be done. This also shows the whole condition of vampire folk - generally they are dangerous and cannot be trusted and Regis is the noble exception, one of his kind.

I was actually getting the chills when Regis brought Dettlaff to meet Anna Henrietta. I thought it was poor judgement. Regis obviously was taken too much by his "pet project" to realize that. It becomes even more dreadful when you learn later that the duchess was supposed to be his fifth victim.
 
I got the "bad ending". After catching up on the other possible endings, I'm quite content with the one I got. I was doing everything in my power to choose dialogue options that will lead to the death of Syanna, preferably by Geralt's sword. She wastes the virtual air she breathes in the game, acts like an irrational, manipulative revenge-driven bitch because of ridiculous reasons. I didn't find any redeeming qualities in her.
 
I already gave you my point of view. She is not mentally ill. She has at worst some kind of trauma and at best is basically just a bitter bitch. Furthermore her trauma started 20 years ago. 20 years in which she could have gotten help, simply worked through it or gotten some perspective on it all.

Yes, I'm sure there are many therapists or psychiatrists in a medieval fantasy setting like The Witcher's... *rolls eyes*

She didn't, she turned to crime and became a violent criminal way before she came back to Toussaint. Do we explain that with trauma as well? That she chose the life of a criminal ring leader, terrorizing people, probably killing a few or having them killed, robbing people etc. way before she ever got back to Toussaint? I wonder how someone who has been allegedly traumatized, as you claim, by being raped and forced from her home justify in any way to basically do the same to parties who are in a similar if not worse situation, since before she came back to Toussaint I strongly doubt she only chose to rob the rich.

But she wasn't just abused that one week, she was basically psychologically abused since her birth, because she was treated like a monster because of the alleged curse. Read the nanny's diary, it gives us some insight into how her childhood must have been, always being blamed, always being the black sheep, being told she is a monster. That is actually a much worse kind of abuse than "just" being raped once, it's the kind of child abuse, that forges strong personality disorders.
And then she met a bunch of mercenary bandits, of whom she expected the worst and who actually were the first group of people who treated her like a human being (I say group, because I'm excluding the nanny from the abuse, because she clearly wasn't happy with the way her parents treated her). So in their midst she finally feels welcome and as a person of worth and that's probably why she joins them.

And no she didn't say raped. She said word for word he abused her. She did not say raped, violated, sexually abused or whatever. She said abused. Check the definition of abuse. It might as well be physical punishment or simple physical violence which, in this situation, seems far more likely to me because even in the description of the misdeeds in Syanna's letters to Dettlaff there is no mention of rape or anything coming close:

So there is no evidence. You can watch the conversation she has with Geralt here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKX_WqROCtU from 9:45 onwards.

Yes, that was indeed an error on my part, she said "raped" later when she talks about how she expected the bandits to rape her. I mistook the two dialogues (though I still believe, that's an indicator she might have been raped before, because otherwise, why would a 12-year-old know to expect something like that? Also, IIRC she did say they left her naked, so that would make sense, after tearing her clothes off to rape her. But yes, we cannot be entirely sure, these are just indications, no proof. But as I said above, she was abused much worse psychologically by her parents).

Furthermore mental illness? Do you know how many women are raped, sexuall molested and beaten? Do you know how few of those women, if any, become complete sociopaths and turn to crime and running a criminal syndicate? Do you know how few even defend themselves or kill their tormentor if they have the chance? It usually takes them years of constant abuse to snap. Yet you claim a girl which, up to that point, had a fairly sheltered and well provided life and was happy enough tormenting other people before all that happens is so traumatized by all that that she loses herself for 20 years and even plans killing her sister who is in no way responsible for what befall her, being an child of 12 years old at the time? That is just rubbish.

Again, she was abused almost her whole life up to that point. Not physically, but mentally/psychologically. And yes, that is abuse too.
That being said, it does make a difference to mental health consequences, whether you're being raped as a child or as an adult. As a child it's very likely this will have a negative effect on your mental development ("growing up") and can lead to strong personality disorders (to take a real life example, studies suggest that most cases of Borderline Personality Disorder are a result of child abuse in one way or another).

More importantly we are talking about an episode. She wasn't held in a cage for 30 years and constantly beaten and molested. She probably spend a week at most with the knights, if that, when they escorted her out of the Duchy and left her in the border lands to fend for herself. So, besides being examined by some sorcerers she basically got her ass powdered between ages 0 and 15, then got thrown out, had 1-2 horrible weeks, met some bandits who didn't molest her, took her in and became their leader, terrorized common folk with her gang for 20 odd years and then comes back to murder people, wage war on the common folk (because that is what happens when you try to overthrow a sitting government) and kill her sister? Yeah, she sure sounds like a little girl... a spoilt little brat who doesn't give a shit because all she thinks is: mine, mine, mine, mine, mine, mine, all mine, fuck everyone, all mine.

Again, you're only taking into account that one week, not the 12 years before.
How was she spoilt, when in fact she was blamed for everything her sister did and the alleged "curse"? They kept telling her, she was a cursed monster, so long that maybe she also started to believe it. Kinda like Renfri in the books.
 
No one who read the books will never admit that the empress ending is good ending.

As for B&W endings - it's choosing a lesser evil.
 
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