You just made me realize something, I can't help but wonder if 2020 has severely messed with/skewered how we're (everyone, journalism/media included) looking at cyberpunk.
Were you around ca. 2012? Bringing up Mass Effect3 again ...
The forums were full of theories. Entire flashbacks/dreamsequences of Shepard were analyzed. And a lot of people married themselves to a theory that went that almost all prior to the ending where Shepard meets a ghostly appariton who claims to be spokesperson of the evil undefeatable Reaper-cthulu Aliens was merely an illusion. And that Bioware did all of this on purpose and the final "true" chapter of ME3 would follow later...yeah...maybe in 2 years with Mass Effect4(5) it will indeed be the case after all ..
And to this day - it would actually make sense, this indoctrination theory. Because unlike the aforementioned starchild, that theory was supported by lore and how the mechanics of "indoctrination" works (basically everyone, including Shepard having Reaper-Tech in her body, would slowly getting brainwashed without realizing by the Reapers to do their bidding)
Not the only theory. But indeed fans back then came up with tremendous ideas, and tried to find logic in what Bioware wrote, hints, and hope for more to come...
The easy explanation however was: There was no elaborate plan. Bioware had changed leadwriters, and was under pressure by EA to release the game earlier than it was finished...
Sounds ... familiar?
I love reading the posts in this thread. But at the end of the day, I doubt CD Red is clever enough that anything in thos eregards would ever find its way into a DLC.
To me, at this moment, CD Red simply wanted an Ending. Or Endings. And keep it "mature" and "philosophical", "memorable".
In a way, they succeeded. THis thread, these posts, endless discussions not only how stupid CD red is, but also about transhumanism, the nature of the soul etc. In a way, good job.
Doesn't change the fact to me that unchangeable fate of death in six months no matter what we and V do and suffer through is bullshit. Not a very philosophical or thought-provoking opinion of me. But to me, games are entertainment to feel "good"...this game, made me depressed. Also memorable...a memory one rather would have wiped though...
Oh definitely, if anything it's why I'm a little more critical of these endings. Like really, you pushed out the 'Your reward is death' rpg for now? In a time where people have been waiting for this game for so long, with all the cut content etc, we get these endings. People play games for escapism, you watch a sad film when you want to feel emotion and sadness. In a time where the whole world is sad and chances are you're a bit bummed out as well, playing a game that you've been waiting for years for and then wham DEPRESSION. It's not good. I'm even less likely to be accepting of being forced to die in-game during these times.
Ruining? Hardly, it can be easily fix with backstory. Alt never cared for Johnny for very good reasons- not when she was alive and especially not when she become AI, which she even stated, that Alt Johnny knows exists no longer, now it's just a data.
She is still there, she is still plotting to get into Mikoshi (she said that they literaly have a black ICE with her name on it). She will probably play a large part in the next chapter since she is still on board and she had a proper exposition in the main quest.
ME trilogy was always a trilogy, with definitive beginning (Vermiare) middle with revelations/plot twists (cycles and reapers) and ending (battle of Earth, Crucible).
This is PnP game like Baldur's Gate/Neverwinter Nights. One hero dies another is born, life/world goes on.
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I also stumbled upon this great article from 2015. https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-08-17-inside-the-witcher-3-launch
Highly suggest to read from start to finish. The pre release parts highly resemble Cyberpunk for one but I'd like to focus on post release/future as we are doing now
. Some interesting points I would like to bring up:
Konrad Tomaszkiewicz (VP of game development , Design Director on CP77) remembers the first review, and twiddling his thumbs as the 4pm embargo approached. A link to the GameSpot review came through from marketing. "I shouted to the guys, 'It's there! It's there! It's the first review!' I open it and it was 10/10, and in the whole studio it was so loud - we just jumped on each other and it was a really cool moment, because we knew that we had bugs but they saw something more in the game, not only the game itself. And for everyone who works in CD Projekt Red that was the most important thing: to create something unique, to create something that would mean more than the game." - seems familiar ?
"But reviews and pre-orders are only a guide: what really matters is what the gaming public makes of it. What the forums say, and what the general buzz is. In other words, what happens from midnight tonight. "For us it's a huge step," Badowski says. "This is my 13th year here and this is my magnum opus. This is it. We are launching." " - Very well said by the writer of this article!
Just to make one thing clear," Iwiński chimes in, "there's quite a long support planned for The Witcher 3 still, so we're not abandoning people. For The Witcher 1 and 2 we were supporting the game for roughly two years each, and that's the same [here]. When people shell out fifty quid for The Witcher 3, we owe them a lot, and we are there to support them. Of course it won't be the full team: at a certain point it will be much smaller."
What we have as the slogan of our studio is that 'we are rebels'," Iwiński says. "Rebels, underdogs - I think it's a state of mind. The moment we start becoming conservative [and] stop taking creative risks and business risks, and stop being true to what we're doing, that's when we should worry. And I am not worried. Our values and our care for what we are doing and - hopefully what gamers would agree with - care for gamers is what drives this company forward. Whether we are big or small, we have a multiplatform open-world game or just a PC release, the game and our deeds are what counts, not the fact that we are perceived by some as the big guys.
"It's my personal horror to become a faceless behemoth of game development or publishing or whatnot," he adds. "As long as I am here I will be fighting for this not to happen."
This combined with the recent conference call I'd say we will definitely get something that should rectify the main feedback about the game in allways including story , technical, features.
Highly suggest to read from start to finish. The pre release parts highly resemble Cyberpunk for one but I'd like to focus on post release/future as we are doing now
. Some interesting points I would like to bring up:Konrad Tomaszkiewicz (VP of game development , Design Director on CP77) remembers the first review, and twiddling his thumbs as the 4pm embargo approached. A link to the GameSpot review came through from marketing. "I shouted to the guys, 'It's there! It's there! It's the first review!' I open it and it was 10/10, and in the whole studio it was so loud - we just jumped on each other and it was a really cool moment, because we knew that we had bugs but they saw something more in the game, not only the game itself. And for everyone who works in CD Projekt Red that was the most important thing: to create something unique, to create something that would mean more than the game." - seems familiar
?"But reviews and pre-orders are only a guide: what really matters is what the gaming public makes of it. What the forums say, and what the general buzz is. In other words, what happens from midnight tonight. "For us it's a huge step," Badowski says. "This is my 13th year here and this is my magnum opus. This is it. We are launching." " - Very well said by the writer of this article!
Just to make one thing clear," Iwiński chimes in, "there's quite a long support planned for The Witcher 3 still, so we're not abandoning people. For The Witcher 1 and 2 we were supporting the game for roughly two years each, and that's the same [here]. When people shell out fifty quid for The Witcher 3, we owe them a lot, and we are there to support them. Of course it won't be the full team: at a certain point it will be much smaller."
What we have as the slogan of our studio is that 'we are rebels'," Iwiński says. "Rebels, underdogs - I think it's a state of mind. The moment we start becoming conservative [and] stop taking creative risks and business risks, and stop being true to what we're doing, that's when we should worry. And I am not worried. Our values and our care for what we are doing and - hopefully what gamers would agree with - care for gamers is what drives this company forward. Whether we are big or small, we have a multiplatform open-world game or just a PC release, the game and our deeds are what counts, not the fact that we are perceived by some as the big guys.
"It's my personal horror to become a faceless behemoth of game development or publishing or whatnot," he adds. "As long as I am here I will be fighting for this not to happen."
This combined with the recent conference call I'd say we will definitely get something that should rectify the main feedback about the game in allways including story , technical, features.
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If anything the 6 month timer essentially obscures these topics because of how front and centre it is. Those topics should be what all the forum navel gazing revolves around but instead they give you the farcical we copied you then gave your copy another terminal illness haha!!
Would be rather lazy writing if so, she does state that she's different but then has certain human reactions, but she's definitely been changed from what she was, 50+ years as an AI surviving as pure data beyond the blackwall should've changed her even if she was the best netrunner, plus, she did try to let Johnny know she was alive.
But yeah, BG/NN pretty much is the setting I get from this game, just that the focus seems to be on closing CP2020's previous story introducing V as a new Solo to night city, just that it's done rather hastily.
No gonna lie here if they ditch V cause of all of this bs I am done with CDPR in general.
I have no desire to play a character that is not V but I suppose that is a me problem.
Not to mention if this is how they did V what's to stop them from doing this to another character.
One can only hope ... In the meantime, I've finally decided on a forum signature ...I also stumbled upon this great article from 2015. https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-08-17-inside-the-witcher-3-launch
Highly suggest to read from start to finish. The pre release parts highly resemble Cyberpunk for one but I'd like to focus on post release/future as we are doing now
Konrad Tomaszkiewicz (VP of game development , Design Director on CP77) remembers the first review, and twiddling his thumbs as the 4pm embargo approached. A link to the GameSpot review came through from marketing. "I shouted to the guys, 'It's there! It's there! It's the first review!' I open it and it was 10/10, and in the whole studio it was so loud - we just jumped on each other and it was a really cool moment, because we knew that we had bugs but they saw something more in the game, not only the game itself. And for everyone who works in CD Projekt Red that was the most important thing: to create something unique, to create something that would mean more than the game." - seems familiar
"But reviews and pre-orders are only a guide: what really matters is what the gaming public makes of it. What the forums say, and what the general buzz is. In other words, what happens from midnight tonight. "For us it's a huge step," Badowski says. "This is my 13th year here and this is my magnum opus. This is it. We are launching." " - Very well said by the writer of this article!
Just to make one thing clear," Iwiński chimes in, "there's quite a long support planned for The Witcher 3 still, so we're not abandoning people. For The Witcher 1 and 2 we were supporting the game for roughly two years each, and that's the same [here]. When people shell out fifty quid for The Witcher 3, we owe them a lot, and we are there to support them. Of course it won't be the full team: at a certain point it will be much smaller."
What we have as the slogan of our studio is that 'we are rebels'," Iwiński says. "Rebels, underdogs - I think it's a state of mind. The moment we start becoming conservative [and] stop taking creative risks and business risks, and stop being true to what we're doing, that's when we should worry. And I am not worried. Our values and our care for what we are doing and - hopefully what gamers would agree with - care for gamers is what drives this company forward. Whether we are big or small, we have a multiplatform open-world game or just a PC release, the game and our deeds are what counts, not the fact that we are perceived by some as the big guys.
"It's my personal horror to become a faceless behemoth of game development or publishing or whatnot," he adds. "As long as I am here I will be fighting for this not to happen."
This combined with the recent conference call I'd say we will definitely get something that should rectify the main feedback about the game in allways including story , technical, features.
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Oh boy, gonna read that sucker up and down... or viceversa (and edit this comment more likely lol), but I'd say they rather failed a bit with Cp77's launch, I mean yeah, TW3 launched with bugs and issues but all it's elements were working fine, at least I can't recall having to wait fixes to gwent or fixes on the combat itself and while the AI wasn't the best in TW3... it wasn't as bad as the crouching tigers I mean pretty much every npc in CP77 when you shoot a gunI also stumbled upon this great article from 2015. https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-08-17-inside-the-witcher-3-launch
Highly suggest to read from start to finish. The pre release parts highly resemble Cyberpunk for one but I'd like to focus on post release/future as we are doing now
Konrad Tomaszkiewicz (VP of game development , Design Director on CP77) remembers the first review, and twiddling his thumbs as the 4pm embargo approached. A link to the GameSpot review came through from marketing. "I shouted to the guys, 'It's there! It's there! It's the first review!' I open it and it was 10/10, and in the whole studio it was so loud - we just jumped on each other and it was a really cool moment, because we knew that we had bugs but they saw something more in the game, not only the game itself. And for everyone who works in CD Projekt Red that was the most important thing: to create something unique, to create something that would mean more than the game." - seems familiar
"But reviews and pre-orders are only a guide: what really matters is what the gaming public makes of it. What the forums say, and what the general buzz is. In other words, what happens from midnight tonight. "For us it's a huge step," Badowski says. "This is my 13th year here and this is my magnum opus. This is it. We are launching." " - Very well said by the writer of this article!
Just to make one thing clear," Iwiński chimes in, "there's quite a long support planned for The Witcher 3 still, so we're not abandoning people. For The Witcher 1 and 2 we were supporting the game for roughly two years each, and that's the same [here]. When people shell out fifty quid for The Witcher 3, we owe them a lot, and we are there to support them. Of course it won't be the full team: at a certain point it will be much smaller."
What we have as the slogan of our studio is that 'we are rebels'," Iwiński says. "Rebels, underdogs - I think it's a state of mind. The moment we start becoming conservative [and] stop taking creative risks and business risks, and stop being true to what we're doing, that's when we should worry. And I am not worried. Our values and our care for what we are doing and - hopefully what gamers would agree with - care for gamers is what drives this company forward. Whether we are big or small, we have a multiplatform open-world game or just a PC release, the game and our deeds are what counts, not the fact that we are perceived by some as the big guys.
"It's my personal horror to become a faceless behemoth of game development or publishing or whatnot," he adds. "As long as I am here I will be fighting for this not to happen."
This combined with the recent conference call I'd say we will definitely get something that should rectify the main feedback about the game in allways including story , technical, features.
Agreed. V hardly got to live as is. In fact, we literally miss like six months of their life because they decided to make it a montage. After that, it's the heist, the death and the constant dirge playing in the background because we assume we're on the clock.No gonna lie here if they ditch V cause of all of this bs I am done with CDPR in general.
I have no desire to play a character that is not V but I suppose that is a me problem.
Not to mention if this is how they did V what's to stop them from doing this to another character.
In fact, it can be argued that the most selfish thing V did was probably try and get a romance during this time where their bio-clock is ticking so fast that they'll be dead in three weeks - according to Vik. Like, what the hell? I wanted to be V who wasn't in so much of a rush, I wanted to enjoy the young merc who was doing everything they could to get to the top. I wanted to have dinner with Jackie and Mama Welles. Party, have fun - go crazy.
You don't get to enjoy Night City without the ticking timebomb, and I mean all of Night City, not the part you're locked into for some reason ??????
Same, for a bit of both reasons. Even if I played I would never be as invested which is the strongest thing the game has to offer. It's not a grudge against them, just an incompatibility.No gonna lie here if they ditch V cause of all of this bs I am done with CDPR in general.
I have no desire to play a character that is not V but I suppose that is a me problem.
Not to mention if this is how they did V what's to stop them from doing this to another character.
My hope is that this game is an introduction to V, my fear is that it's an introduction to Night City.
Something that would've made the Arasaka Earth ending easier to digest "for me" before dropping huge DLCs is to at least re-use already made available content...
Unlock that office space in the tower back for V ( As seen during the corpo. lifepath prologue ) and from that office, I would've received jobs ( go destroy that random gang meetup, simple stuff la) + a small message from Arasaka's exec. saying that they're working on finding a way to cure the 6 months thing ( a stand still for that imminent death sentence + cushion for future content/plot/twists whatever) + some basic closure stuff like looping in romances and open world exploring/"sandbox".
Needless to say that simple stand stills like that could've only been made available for endings that does not involve V either immediately "dying" and/or running away from NC. Dunno, I just hate that it is the void atm.
Unlock that office space in the tower back for V ( As seen during the corpo. lifepath prologue ) and from that office, I would've received jobs ( go destroy that random gang meetup, simple stuff la) + a small message from Arasaka's exec. saying that they're working on finding a way to cure the 6 months thing ( a stand still for that imminent death sentence + cushion for future content/plot/twists whatever) + some basic closure stuff like looping in romances and open world exploring/"sandbox".
Needless to say that simple stand stills like that could've only been made available for endings that does not involve V either immediately "dying" and/or running away from NC. Dunno, I just hate that it is the void atm.
Mass Effect was a self-contained story. Whole world and lore was created with one and only one purpose - Reapers and the Cycle. Mass Effect without Reapers was nothing, less then nothing. This is why Andromeda sucked so much, even fixing glitches/animationes didn't save this game from the fact that this was a hollow world without a purpose.
If this was not enought thare was also this problem of "Artistic integrity" and Casy Hudson. He was way over his head with everything - remember that it was his idea to ditch the "last boss fight" since it was too gamy. Isn't that coincident that guy left BioWare shortly after ME3, came back few years ago was co-responsibal for "hits" like Anthem and Andromeda and left (!) BioWare few days before Game's Award teaser where BW retcon whole ending and made a red a canon one?
CP77 on the other hand is a game based on PnP game it's like Witcher series, this is a first entry of the whole cycle. Today games are being made with monetization in mind. There is no (!) big triple A game without expansions that push whole story forward. It's easier to made, cheaper since you have most assets, all you need to make is add new quests / skills/armor/weapons.
People will buy this like candy, since they like the game it's world. It's a "game development 101".
This whole game is screaming in every corner with futur DLC/Expensions.
yooooOne can only hope ... In the meantime, I've finally decided on a forum signature ...
If this is the introduction to Night City I think I'll have to pass on the rest of it
Also from writing perspective, story and its endings dont really make sense.
Lets say V main goal is to become top dog/legend in the city. Then heist happens and now main goal is to find a way to heal yourself. Even game is pushing you towards it.
But then you reach the end and goal changes again.
Fuck the cure, i am a legend now.
Fuck the cure, i will leave NC with my lover.
The story changes charactersn goals like socks.
I recently watched Elysium movie again. The premise is the same basically, dark world, MC dying from a deadly radiation. So he pushes forward to find a way to heal himself but by the middle his goal changes because his childhood friends daughter is dying. So his goal now is to save her, not himself. By the end he sacrifices for her. He dies, but achieves his goal, story ends. It is a sad ending but not depressing and it had meaning.
Lets say V main goal is to become top dog/legend in the city. Then heist happens and now main goal is to find a way to heal yourself. Even game is pushing you towards it.
But then you reach the end and goal changes again.
Fuck the cure, i am a legend now.
Fuck the cure, i will leave NC with my lover.
The story changes charactersn goals like socks.
I recently watched Elysium movie again. The premise is the same basically, dark world, MC dying from a deadly radiation. So he pushes forward to find a way to heal himself but by the middle his goal changes because his childhood friends daughter is dying. So his goal now is to save her, not himself. By the end he sacrifices for her. He dies, but achieves his goal, story ends. It is a sad ending but not depressing and it had meaning.
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