[Spoiler Alert] About the endings

[Barsenthor]

Tarots cards are essential to the ending and so to the whole story.
Game/story is fixed on them - you get a long hunting quest to find them. Meeting with Hanako has achievement named after Tarot Cards that fits the character. How many achievements are named after Tarot cards, fitting perfectly those descriptions? Answer - all of story related.
They made Misty practically for this purpose only (if name Misty wasn't enough). They made a unique animation with this cards, whole scen with them. Out of 20 cards they chose 3 that fits the mood of the endings.
Read description of the Devil card and recall what Johnny said about Mikoshi - that they reprogram people/engrams there. Now card is showing you how "evil" (tho it's not evil per se) is corrupting people.
Above all - despite that trying to cheat death was the main objective and we "failed" in doing so, since "all endings are the same and V has at best 6 months to live" we didn't get a Death card.

 

[tRYSIS3]

I just wanna add, they're not only in the ending sequence. If you did the quest to find the 20 tarot cards it foreshadows the future (compare where the cards are located with the meaning of the card). E.g. next time you play look at the Tarot card outside of the hotel where you meet Hanako or on Mistys balcony. Also early on Misty used the tarot card to warn Jackie about 'reds' which wound up being true.

There are more examples.

IF that's true then it makes it worse, imagine telling someone to go watch a movie again and look for "clues" that "might" change an outcome. At the end of the day, you are still not 100% sure about the outcome, so your deduction didn't result in anything.

The story started with V trying to find a cure, and it ended with V not finding a cure. There is nothing in the game that conclusively says otherwise

 

[cyths]

You guys keep saying this over and over while ignoring all the counter arguments.

Don't get me wrong, i want to believe. But when i look at the state of the game today, it's kinda hard to have faith in cdpr.

/e
So, if they proove me wrong, i'll be gladly taking it.

 

[DRaptor-1]

Don't get me wrong, i want to believe. But when i look at the state of the game today, it's kinda hard to have faith in cdpr.

Bro is already to early to say that. Game released 2 weeks ago, give them time. Now is Christmas and also they have a family, holidays etc (anyways, marry Christmas everyone XD), we had covid alot of BS. Is not an excuse I'm giving them, but wait a bit. Probably in the next week we will know something.

 

[Dubois_Jon]

A

There is nothing in the game that conclusively says otherwise

Oh the irony... that's a double edge sword, goes both ways as you have no proof of the opposite.

 

[stndn]

What is the reduced ambiguity you have? "DLC will fix it" or do you think that V lives even if DLC doesn't exist?

Because I do not accept to pay extra for a "fix", and if you believe that it's a "fact" that V lives I would like to know how you came to that conclusion?

Off the top of my head since i'm going to bed.
- Mr Blue Eyes and the Crystal Palace
- Tarot Cards (which have been proven to be reliable countless times despite the denial in this thread)
- Small tidbits e.g. "The Iliad" Datashard - more of a foreshadowing but most of us agree it's been intentionally/strategically placed by devs in a key scene so it's worthy of consideration.
- Aldecaldos relationship with Metacorp who are friendly with Biotechnica.
- AZ contacts.

IF that's true then it makes it worse, imagine telling someone to go watch a movie again and look for "clues" that "might" change an outcome. At the end of the day, you are still not 100% sure about the outcome, so your deduction didn't result in anything.

Ambiguity (open-ended plot) and suspense is a narrative technique used to keep people wondering about what happens next. This is more of a Netflix series than a movie with how CDPR has handled it. Not the first game to use this and it won't be the last!

I don't think it's a good technique but I don't think it's a bad technique either.

 

[lokozar]

If there is a copy of a person with the same memories and experiences as them are they the same? Let's assume they are both alive and could even look each other in the eye.
Is it not still a copy?

Excellent question. Let's quickly give these persons a name, to make it easier. Let's say V is copied. Same exakt person, same memories, body, quirks, whatever. Both persons would simply think they are V, until they meet each other and suddenly realize something is wrong. At this point neither of the both persons could tell who is the copy and who is the original. Or in other words, who could decide which person's experiences AFTER the cloning is more valid, more important to decide who is the "real" V? So, they are both V and are both not V at the same time. Schrödinger anyone ...? This all circles back to Misty's, "change is not to be feared, but it's important what we change into".

Also, think about the one street fighter that is one person, but has two bodies at the same time. It's kind of similar. Who is the original? Does it even matter at this point?

----------
Back to the topic, though. I think, yes, the writers could make something out of every ending, so that V still lives in a DLC. However, in that case it would lead to rather weak and cramped writing, just because of the way these endings are set up. They almost always would have to pull something out of their asses, meaning, make use of a Deus Ex Machina plot vessel ( e.g "I know a guy ..." ... uhu ...) to dig themselves out of their own hole.

I mean, I would take it and be happy with V still being alive, but ... man, I can already see and taste the massive backlash.

 

[tRYSIS3]

I would rather see developers follow their hearts and create the content they want to create rather than be forced to cater to the lowest common denominator in an effort to increase sales figures.

If following their hearts means making a game that is unplayable on consoles (specifically PS4/XBOX ONE) then by all means they can keep on doing so. I'm sure it will stay working out as great as it is right now for them, and I also hope they can keep on finding loyal fans such as yourself to support those dreams

Post automatically merged: Dec 25, 2020

Off the top of my head since i'm going to bed.
- Mr Blue Eyes and the Crystal Palace
- Tarot Cards (which have been proven to be reliable countless times despite the denial in this thread)
- Small tidbits e.g. "The Iliad" Datashard - more of a foreshadowing but most of us agree it's been intentionally/strategically placed by devs in a key scene so it's worthy of consideration.
- Aldecaldos relationship with Metacorp who are friendly with Biotechnica.
- AZ contacts.

Are you now 100% sure that V finds a cure?

Ambiguity (open-ended plot) and suspense is a narrative technique used to keep people wondering about what happens next. This is more of a Netflix series than a movie with how CDPR has handled it. Not the first game to use this and it won't be the last!

I don't think it's a good technique but I don't think it's a bad technique either.

Maybe that's why I dislike Netflix. I'm excited to see your reaction once you realize that the story is over, but I can already tell how it's going to be

Post automatically merged: Dec 25, 2020

Oh the irony... that's a double edge sword, goes both ways as you have no proof of the opposite.

The game tells me that V is still sick and will die, so without any outside information or extra content, it is a fact that V dies

Besides that alive or not, V haven't found a cure (fact) so the entire story is pointless

 

[cyths]

Bro is already to early to say that. Game released 2 weeks ago, give them time. Now is Christmas and also they have a family, holidays etc (anyways, marry Christmas everyone XD), we had covid alot of BS. Is not an excuse I'm giving them, but wait a bit. Probably in the next week we will know something.

Well, i have to. In fact, i'm willing to give them any time in the world for fixes or adding all the stuff that did't make it in the released version. Including more proper endings in terms of replaying etc. If they just said a damn word.

For the time, i'm hoping for the best, but expecting the worst (just to quote Alphaville )

 

[Queen_Skadi]

In principle I agree. But having a set of circumstances where the arbitrary 6 Months, that are thrown at the player within the last few minutes of the game, wouldn't be a factor would have not have made any less logical sense. While simultaneously fixing the big problem with the endings.

Sorry you will have to remind me what the big problem with the ending is?

But, like I said before, we said something, CDPR will probably not listen or even care. It's another hard learned lesson and people will be able to decide how they want to handle the situation once all the DLCs are out. Ultimately none of this will make much difference in the long run. For me it went from breathtaking to heartbreaking in my 70 hrs played, but that doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. I can't come back to night city with how I feel. My personal fear is that they will aim too much to be like GTA and none of the games or characters will have a lasting effect, but instead are one and gone with each iteration of future games. But all of that is also not their problem.

Personally I believe a good game and a good story should be able to stand on it's own without the need for sequels that continue the story, nothing against a game series that does tell it's story in multiple parts with the same character like what the Witcher did but I don't think that this should be the only method of continuing a game series.

A good setting with a good foundation should have many different stories to tell and sometimes it can be nice to see the world from a different perspective and a different set of eyes.

 

[lokozar]

A good setting with a good foundation should have many different stories to tell and sometimes it can be nice to see the world from a different perspective and a different set of eyes.

That's why spin-offs were created. There is no need for just the one or just the other. You can always have both.

 

[Queen_Skadi]

If following their hearts means making a game that is unplayable on consoles (specifically PS4/XBOX ONE) then by all means they can keep on doing so. I'm sure it will stay working out as great as it is right now for them, and I also hope they can keep on finding loyal fans such as yourself to support those dreams

We are talking about the endings mun, if you have an issue with the state of the game on consoles then I am sure there a lot of valid criticisms you could make but I don't see how any of them have anything to do with the endings?

 

[DRaptor-1]

Sorry you will have to remind me what the big problem with the ending is?



Personally I believe a good game and a good story should be able to stand on it's own without the need for sequels that continue the story, nothing against a game series that does tell it's story in multiple parts with the same character like what the Witcher did but I don't think that this should be the only method of continuing a game series.

A good setting with a good foundation should have many different stories to tell and sometimes it can be nice to see the world from a different perspective and a different set of eyes.

I understand what you say, and I agree that a good game should have a COMLETE story that stand on his own, then can add more stuff with dlcs. Sadly is not the case, but I really think we only saw a half of the story, because they intentionally left the ending open, to continue the story lately, otherwise endings wouldn't make any sense.
I know Is hard, is hard also for me, but I think we shouldn't see the "endings" like real endings, because how I said, i think we still need to see the whole story.
I don't like this too, but is what we got now

 

[Queen_Skadi]

That's why spin-offs were created. There is no need for just the one or just the other. You can always have both.

Depends, sure you can technically have both but somebody has to develop them and if the developers would rather work on a fresh story with new characters rather than a continuation of the previous story then I see no problem with that.

 

[Simuxas]

Depends, sure you can technically have both but somebody has to develop them and if the developers would rather work on a fresh story with new characters rather than a continuation of the previous story then I see no problem with that.

Working on such developed characters, hiring so many great voice actors, building the story over almost a decade just to completely drop all of it and start over?
That doesnt make sense anyway you look at it.

 

[Dubois_Jon]

If following their hearts means making a game that is unplayable on consoles (specifically PS4/XBOX ONE) then by all means they can keep on doing so. I'm sure it will stay working out as great as it is right now for them, and I also hope they can keep on finding loyal fans such as yourself to support those dreams

Post automatically merged: Dec 25, 2020

Are you now 100% sure that V finds a cure?

Maybe that's why I dislike Netflix. I'm excited to see your reaction once you realize that the story is over, but I can already tell how it's going to be

Post automatically merged: Dec 25, 2020

The game tells me that V is still sick and will die, so without any outside information or extra content, it is a fact that V dies

Besides that alive or not, V haven't found a cure (fact) so the entire story is pointless

Fact: Arasaka and Alt tell you you only have six months to live both showed alternative motivations.

Fact: If you are a engram you not dead. Jonny proved this.. as Alt said Vs body was " his" if Jonny was just a soulless construct why would a body matter. Misty also referred to both Jonny and V as two souls construct or not.

You can try to spin any information to your own view point doesnt mean they are " facts". Its all opinion. Unless CDPR says nope V is dead or will be all you have is a bunch of conjecture.

 

[DRaptor-1]

Agree, doesn't make any sense start a new story with whole new characters. This is a waste of resourcess and time

 

[Queen_Skadi]

I understand what you say, and I agree that a good game should have a COMLETE story that stand on his own, than can add more stuff with dlcs. Sadly is not the case, but I really think we only saw a half of the story, because they intentionally left the ending open, to continue the story lately, otherwise endings wouldn't make any sense.
I know Is hard, is hard also for me, but I think we shouldn't see the "endings" like real endings, because how I said, i think we still need to see the whole story.
I don't like this too, but is what we got now

Feels like I am the only one who actually liked the endings, I agree it feels like we only saw half the story but to me it feels like the middle part of the story was lacking rather than the ending, I felt the endings would have been a satisfying conclusion had the middle been given more polish and focus.

In regard to DLCs though I would prefer they be separate stand alone content rather than the missing chunks of the core game.

 

[lokozar]

Depends, sure you can technically have both but somebody has to develop them and if the developers would rather work on a fresh story with new characters rather than a continuation of the previous story then I see no problem with that.

I, as a customer, do see a problem with that. Don't kid yourself. Money is a big factor here. If they purely would do something to follow their hearts, they would do it for free. But they don't. So, they have to take into consideration what customers want. That's not to tell you, that what I want matters - but it matters what the broad audience wants.

 

[DRaptor-1]

Feels like I am the only one who actually liked the endings, I agree it feels like we only saw half the story but to me it feels like the middle part of the story was lacking rather than the ending, I felt the endings would have been a satisfying conclusion had the middle been given more polish and focus.

In regard to DLCs though I would prefer they be separate stand alone content rather than the missing chunks of the core game.

Well, the endings are not completely shits, but are just senseless for my point of view, they leave you thinking what the end can be by your self. This sense of emptiness and hope they leave us, can't be a random thing, must mean something. I mean, my personal opinion is that I would really like to see how the story continue because like that, the story is meh, and how you was saying not only the ending, I mean the whole story we saw till now feel a bit empty.

For dlcs, what I can say and think, is that I think they will not be a stand alone story sadly. We still miss many things to be explained and added in the main story and I think they will add it on dlcs. Or maybe they will add these things in patches or free upgrades instead of DLCs, who knows