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[Spoiler Alert] About the endings

+

Do you want more RPGs with happy endings?

  • Yes, I miss happy endings.

    Votes: 502 42.1%
  • No, I am content with the endings currently offered.

    Votes: 122 10.2%
  • I think that the option should be available for those who want it.

    Votes: 353 29.6%
  • It’s more complicated than that.

    Votes: 216 18.1%

  • Total voters
    1,193
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Kikinho

Kikinho

Senior user
#7,921
Dec 29, 2020
SaulTuk said:
Okay, some 0,0001% of people are special, lucky to born under right curcumstances, winning the gene lottery etc. But the vast majority of people are not special, do not achieve any remarkable success. Many people, especially young, fear to be regular, and easily empathizes V. I do not. And i do want to read about regular character, a peaceful workers and scientists. That's why i like old Star Trek so much, especially episodes without any armed conflict.
Click to expand...
But V is in no way and manner a nobody. He is literally a problem solver. He is highly competent and determined. He has all the attributes to be someone special. And if you wanna stay meta, he is someone by the pure fact that he is a player character.
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020

TintelFruit said:
You should really do the Zen master missions, it becomes very clear he's helping you prepare for something after the first few meetings, It's one of the reasons I went with risk your soul option.
Click to expand...
I've only met one mission with a zen master in the "park" area in the middle of the city. Is that the one you are talking about?
 
SaulTuk

SaulTuk

Senior user
#7,922
Dec 29, 2020
I_Willenbrock_I said:
Well... V actually is special.

Assaulting the Arasaka tower is nothing to sneeze at and some of Vs clients are top celebrities.

But even if we ignore that and say that V is not as special as lets say rogue, the end still is BS.

Because killing off characters for the sake of killing them off is just stupid and lame.

Especially with the wonky and badly written explanations on why the brain can not be altered by the chip anymore, despite we would sti have a long way to go to fully establish the new mind. Next thing is the wonky explanation on why it works with saburo.
Next thing is the glorious marketing stunt. I mean arasaka is literally selling immortality at that point - all you have to do is to sacrifice your own offspring? What the fuck?

It does not get any better. Inconsistent writjng at the end. This hurts so much more, because the writing before the endings was far, far better.
Click to expand...
I fully agree that writing is bad, and if you want to kill V in the end, you should justify this way better, starting from the very beginning of plot. A good example of protagonist death and good closure - Red Dead Redemption 2.
 
Last edited: Dec 29, 2020
  • RED Point
Reactions: I_Willenbrock_I
Kikinho

Kikinho

Senior user
#7,923
Dec 29, 2020
onosendai7 said:
Simply because it's a RPG and playing a zero has absolutely no interest. If your character is the average Joe or Jane, this is not a RPG, this is IRL. You play characters that are not common people, to go through a story.
There are no statistics involved except you are here to make them wrong. You're not a no-one, you're somebody. And you do not deserve pathetic endings, except if you're dumb enough and make something stupid. A good game master rewards his players. His job is not to kill them for the sake of statistics. It's too easy, and there is nothing fun in it. CDPR is a bad game master.
Click to expand...
Yeah, one of my favourite tropes is a nobody becoming somebody.
 
TintelFruit

TintelFruit

Forum regular
#7,924
Dec 29, 2020
Kikinho said:
But V is in no way and manner a nobody. He is literally a problem solver. He is highly competent and determined. He has all the attributes to be someone special. And if you wanna stay meta, he is someone by the pure fact that he is a player character.
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020


I've only met one mission with a zen master in the "park" area in the middle of the city. Is that the one you are talking about?
Click to expand...
Yes, There are 3 afterwards all strewn around night city, you end with him disappearing again but leaving a special gift behind.
 
onosendai7

onosendai7

Senior user
#7,925
Dec 29, 2020
SaulTuk said:
Indeed, i agree. Funny, that endings of CP77 do not match its very essence - RPG about someone special and lucky, but matches real life statistics and my personal sense of justice.
Click to expand...
That's why it is bad RPG.
RPG is not about statistics or upholding justice and morale, it's about having fun and telling a story.
CDPR should have read "Listen Up You Primitive Screwheads" (Cyberpunk P&P GM guide).
 
  • RED Point
Reactions: jahkin, I_Willenbrock_I, StarkHelsing and 1 other person
SaulTuk

SaulTuk

Senior user
#7,926
Dec 29, 2020
Kikinho said:
But V is in no way and manner a nobody. He is literally a problem solver. He is highly competent and determined. He has all the attributes to be someone special. And if you wanna stay meta, he is someone by the pure fact that he is a player character.
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020


I've only met one mission with a zen master in the "park" area in the middle of the city. Is that the one you are talking about?
Click to expand...
True, but even such men as V can be ruined by a bad luck. The game they play are too big and complex to be immune to bad luck. Not that videogame as jenre should kill protagonist that way.
 
TintelFruit

TintelFruit

Forum regular
#7,927
Dec 29, 2020
SaulTuk said:
True, but even such men as V can be ruined by a bad luck. The game they play are too big and complex to be immune to bad luck. Not that videogame as jenre should kill protagonist that way.
Click to expand...
>Men
>V
:ohstopit:
 
SaulTuk

SaulTuk

Senior user
#7,928
Dec 29, 2020
onosendai7 said:
That's why it is bad RPG.
RPG is not about statistics or upholding justice and morale, it's about having fun and telling a story.
CDPR should have read "Listen Up You Primitive Screwheads" (Cyberpunk P&P GM guide).
Click to expand...
Bad RPG but not half-bad visual novel in criminal drama genre, where plot is set and protagonist is pre-written and should not immerse players into his skin.
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020

TintelFruit said:
>Men
>V
:ohstopit:
Click to expand...
Or women, no difference)
 
CongoJack35

CongoJack35

Senior user
#7,929
Dec 29, 2020
I'm tired of these edgelord endings in games, they suck and makes me wonder why I've played the damn game where I could do anything I want but have the ending I've worked so many hours toward.
 
  • RED Point
Reactions: tRYSIS3, jahkin, JuanEvil and 1 other person
onosendai7

onosendai7

Senior user
#7,930
Dec 29, 2020
SaulTuk said:
Bad RPG but not half-bad visual novel in criminal drama genre, where plot is set and protagonist is pre-written and should not immerse players into his skin.
Click to expand...
That's the problem. I bought a RPG, not a novel. I have no influence on a novel plot or characters. I expect to have some in a RPG.
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020

CongoJack35 said:
I'm tired of these edgelord endings in games, they suck and makes me wonder why I've played the damn game where I could do anything I want but have the ending I've worked so many hours toward.
Click to expand...
This.
And the fact you don't want to start another game...
 
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SaulTuk

SaulTuk

Senior user
#7,931
Dec 29, 2020
onosendai7 said:
That's the problem. I bought a RPG, not a novel. I have no influence on a novel plot or characters. I expect to have some in a RPG.
Click to expand...
Yes, we have been deceived and got every right to be angry.
 
  • RED Point
Reactions: I_Willenbrock_I, i-Czer and JuanEvil
Kikinho

Kikinho

Senior user
#7,932
Dec 29, 2020
TintelFruit said:
Yes, There are 3 afterwards all strewn around night city, you end with him disappearing again but leaving a special gift behind.
Click to expand...
Thanks! will make sure to look out for it.
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020

SaulTuk said:
True, but even such men as V can be ruined by a bad luck. The game they play are too big and complex to be immune to bad luck. Not that videogame as jenre should kill protagonist that way.
Click to expand...
I personally think bad luck only should be used as a mid story twist. Finishing off a character because of bad luck is just bad writing. The beauty of writing is that you can easily stear away from reality.
I get the impression that people who defend the endings because it's "outside the box" are just people who saw game of thrones break rules and now every story that doesn't follow basic rules is revolutionary.
 
I_Willenbrock_I

I_Willenbrock_I

Senior user
#7,933
Dec 29, 2020
SaulTuk said:
I fully agree that writing is bad, and if you want to kill V in the end, you should justify this way better, starting from the very begininng of plot. A good example of protagonist death and good closure - Red Dead Redemption 2.
Click to expand...
Both red dead titles do this quite good. Dragon age origins does it very good as well.

I actually end up sacrificing my character most of the time, because it's the only way to make sure the darkspawn are gone.

Just to point out that a main Charakters death can be very valid option - as long as it is not forced.
Vs BS-cancer however is as forced as it gets and its not even done well.

Hell. Giving johnny the body so that at least he can feel the sunlight again or because V is fed up at that point, is a better option than lol-cancer.
 
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SaulTuk

SaulTuk

Senior user
#7,934
Dec 29, 2020
Kikinho said:
Thanks! will make sure to look out for it.
Click to expand...
And this gift will adorn your apartment, which conclude its usefullness and impact on the plot). Taro cards quests also grant you with sweet useless amulet, but at least Misty hints the endings).
I guess, that both these quests should affect the endings via increasing/decreasing V's Empathy meter or/and johny-meter...but then content cuts came(
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020

Kikinho said:
Thanks! will make sure to look out for it.
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020


I personally think bad luck only should be used as a mid story twist. Finishing off a character because of bad luck is just bad writing. The beauty of writing is that you can easily stear away from reality.
I get the impression that people who defend the endings because it's "outside the box" are just people who saw game of thrones break rules and now every story that doesn't follow basic rules is revolutionary.
Click to expand...
I doubt there are a lot of people who actually content with endings as they are. I, for myself, are just not hit by them, due to my personal views. But i would be glad to see a completely re-written endings, as most people here
 
TintelFruit

TintelFruit

Forum regular
#7,935
Dec 29, 2020
SaulTuk said:
And this gift will adorn your apartment, which conclude its usefullness and impact on the plot). Taro cards quests also grant you with sweet useless amulet, but at least Misty hints the endings).
I guess, that both these quests should affect the endings via increasing/decreasing V's Empathy meter or/and johny-meter...but then content cuts came(
Click to expand...
Not everything needs to be some kind of spectacle, just knowing V had help in spiritual "oneness" can help boost confidence.
 
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Kikinho

Kikinho

Senior user
#7,936
Dec 29, 2020
I_Willenbrock_I said:
Both red dead titles do this quite good. Dragon age origins does it very good as well.

I actually end up sacrificing my character most of the time, because it's the only way to make sure the darkspawn are gone.

Just to point out that a main Charakters death can be very valid option - as long as it is not forced.
Vs BS-cancer however is as forced as it gets and its not even done well.

Hell. Giving johnny the body so that at least he can feel the sunlight again or because V is fed up at that point, is a better option than lol-cancer.
Click to expand...
You know. If I was Jhonny who was gifted with V's body, i would be a psychological mess. The guilt I would feel after just looking at "my" hand would just eat me up. But then again, I don't have Jhonny's ego so he probably has no issues with the fact.
 
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I_Willenbrock_I

I_Willenbrock_I

Senior user
#7,937
Dec 29, 2020
Kikinho said:
You know. If I was Jhonny who was gifted with V's body, i would be a psychological mess. The guilt I would feel after just looking at "my" hand would just eat me up. But then again, I don't have Jhonny's ego so he probably has no issues with the fact.
Click to expand...
So it boils down to: "who has to keep the wreck?" and "who is allowed to live a peaceful live in cyberspace?"

In addition I think Johnny would freak out if V is female. He even said that her body is not his style. Some things are too small and others are too big.
 
rippercityransom

rippercityransom

Forum regular
#7,938
Dec 29, 2020
CongoJack35 said:
I'm tired of these edgelord endings in games, they suck and makes me wonder why I've played the damn game where I could do anything I want but have the ending I've worked so many hours toward.
Click to expand...
It’s become a “get out of writing a meaningful ending free” card. Why spend time crafting an ending, confronting the morality of sacrificing humanity’s safety to an AI or a Corp for your own survival or wondering if you’re even still human anymore or literally anything that makes a person actually think when you can go psuedo-intellectual and just say “what if... nothing matters, we’re all insignificant, and we’re all going to die?” Amazing, truly a unique take.
 
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StarkHelsing

StarkHelsing

Forum regular
#7,939
Dec 29, 2020
Kikinho said:
You know. If I was Jhonny who was gifted with V's body, i would be a psychological mess. The guilt I would feel after just looking at "my" hand would just eat me up. But then again, I don't have Jhonny's ego so he probably has no issues with the fact.
Click to expand...
Johnny looks pretty darn depressed to me. I mean, rogue chews him a new one if he takes over the body and tells him to never to return to NC. He's already guilty enough as is when he looks in the mirror. I don't expect him to survive long, or be able to sit long with what went down. Doesn't help that Johnny is now entirely alone.
 
SaulTuk

SaulTuk

Senior user
#7,940
Dec 29, 2020
TintelFruit said:
Not everything needs to be some kind of spectacle, just knowing V had help in spiritual "oneness" can help boost confidence.
Click to expand...
I_Willenbrock_I said:
Both red dead titles do this quite good. Dragon age origins does it very good as well.

I actually end up sacrificing my character most of the time, because it's the only way to make sure the darkspawn are gone.

Just to point out that a main Charakters death can be very valid option - as long as it is not forced.
Vs BS-cancer however is as forced as it gets and its not even done well.

Hell. Giving johnny the body so that at least he can feel the sunlight again or because V is fed up at that point, is a better option than lol-cancer.
Click to expand...
My wishfull thinking about the endings:

forums.cdprojektred.com

[Spoiler Alert] About the endings

The problem behind the idea is that only a perfect clone would be suitable in the way the biochip Modus operandi is explained. Yorinobus body should suffer from the restructuring as well. Especially with that wonky DNA explanation. That part makes a fair amount of sense. Yorinobu is the son of...
forums.cdprojektred.com forums.cdprojektred.com
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020

TintelFruit said:
Not everything needs to be some kind of spectacle, just knowing V had help in spiritual "oneness" can help boost confidence.
Click to expand...
That, and a little bonus to V's Empathy would be nice. Here is my dreams about endings, to explain why i talk about Empathy:

forums.cdprojektred.com

[Spoiler Alert] About the endings

The problem behind the idea is that only a perfect clone would be suitable in the way the biochip Modus operandi is explained. Yorinobus body should suffer from the restructuring as well. Especially with that wonky DNA explanation. That part makes a fair amount of sense. Yorinobu is the son of...
forums.cdprojektred.com forums.cdprojektred.com
Post automatically merged: Dec 29, 2020

StarkHelsing said:
Johnny looks pretty darn depressed to me. I mean, rogue chews him a new one if he takes over the body and tells him to never to return to NC. He's already guilty enough as is when he looks in the mirror. I don't expect him to survive long, or be able to sit long with what went down. Doesn't help that Johnny is now entirely alone.
Click to expand...
I wonder, why can't V and Johny both join cyberspace?
 
Last edited: Dec 29, 2020
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