Actually there is you an get Black Lance Inhaler from Dum Dum =)
Let me tell you a real story.
A friend of mine asked me whether to buy the game. He asked me about the plot and what happens, apparently he did not care about spoilers or he did not expect to hear what I told him. He wanted to build a strong character which he can play then the way he likes as much as he likes. I streamed a bit of the game to him via discord and I told him that at the end no matter what you do the ending for the main character is not good and he either loses his body or dies.
Then my friend told me "Oh.. in that case I will pass. There is no point of playing anything sideways then."
You see now how important that is for a game plot, especially with such strong characters built in it.
Again, real story believe it or not.
A friend of mine asked me whether to buy the game. He asked me about the plot and what happens, apparently he did not care about spoilers or he did not expect to hear what I told him. He wanted to build a strong character which he can play then the way he likes as much as he likes. I streamed a bit of the game to him via discord and I told him that at the end no matter what you do the ending for the main character is not good and he either loses his body or dies.
Then my friend told me "Oh.. in that case I will pass. There is no point of playing anything sideways then."
You see now how important that is for a game plot, especially with such strong characters built in it.
Again, real story believe it or not.
True that, the leader belongs to his people). And if Saul is alive, it will be he who will carry the burden of leadership, thus sparing little Panam for much more pleasant and healthy things, like sex)
That first line in red.... Gee thanks for killing off my character cause of lazy shoehorned in keanu reeves focused writing/gameplay/story overhaul.
Well, it's a story with no purpose. Cdpr used to be praised for their stories, but at this point, they ain't got any redeeming factors
Judging by some comments in some Steam threads, there are people who like to lose in advance.
Apparently IRL they are very successful people who achieve everything, and therefore playing as a loser is entertainment for them.
But most likely these are just schoolchildren who do not care what to play.
you think they will change it if enough people "yell loud enough"?
Changing it or not is up to them. That's irrelevant here.
The fact remains that something went wrong somewhere and we got these half-baked endings.
Regardless of whether you are happy with the endings or not, everyone that bought and played the game has the right to criticize its shortcomings.
I was trying to make sense of the current ending's logic and why the writers went that way and stumbled on Freytag's analysis. Freytag five part model described as “play and counter-play” (“Spiel und Gegenspiel”) and or rising and sinking. Basically the greater the rise, the greater the fall.
Exposition; The setting is fixed in a particular place and time…
- V’s setting is exposed by the user's lifepath choice + Story background flashbacks.
Rising Action; An exciting force or inciting event begins after the exposition.. the most important part of the story, the entire plot depends on it.
- The heist.
Climax; The turning point. In dramas, if things are going well for the protagonist, the plot will turn against them. Often requires the protagonist to draw on hidden inner strengths.
- Saburo’s murder, Jacky going byebye, Relic insertion + expiration time, Dex's betrayal.
Falling Action; Hostility of the counterparty beats upon the protagonist’s soul. The falling action may contain a moment of final suspense. The “Katastrophe” must be foreshadowed, there could be for the doomed protagonist a prospect of relief, where the final outcome is in doubt.
- Road to the 4 way ending choice path -> Heir (Arasaka), Star (Panam), Legend (Crystal), Reborn (Johnny/busRide)
Katastrophe; This is where the protagonist meets his logical destruction, Freytag warns the writer not to spare the life of the hero. It comprises the events from the end of the falling action to the actual ending scene of the drama or narrative. **Important** => Conflicts are resolved, creating normalcy for the characters and a sense of catharsis, or release of tension and anxiety for the users.
- Pretty much everything happening after choosing one of the 4 main endings (not including their small varia.)
Opinion;
Even after going through a basic dramatic structure analysis, the story doesn’t make sense.. Well “for me” it doesn’t create normalcy for the users and/or unraveling/untying the plot complexities. I mean, we’re currently left in a depressing emotional loop that provides no continuity and or even really considering the user's choices when there's a way out, at least opening up NC after the credits could make me experience that return to normality before exposing the user to the death sentence/gone with the wind/Mikoshi’s actual denouement/restoration, hopefully in a future dlc/expansion, instead of reloading to last checkpoint.
Exposition; The setting is fixed in a particular place and time…
- V’s setting is exposed by the user's lifepath choice + Story background flashbacks.
Rising Action; An exciting force or inciting event begins after the exposition.. the most important part of the story, the entire plot depends on it.
- The heist.
Climax; The turning point. In dramas, if things are going well for the protagonist, the plot will turn against them. Often requires the protagonist to draw on hidden inner strengths.
- Saburo’s murder, Jacky going byebye, Relic insertion + expiration time, Dex's betrayal.
Falling Action; Hostility of the counterparty beats upon the protagonist’s soul. The falling action may contain a moment of final suspense. The “Katastrophe” must be foreshadowed, there could be for the doomed protagonist a prospect of relief, where the final outcome is in doubt.
- Road to the 4 way ending choice path -> Heir (Arasaka), Star (Panam), Legend (Crystal), Reborn (Johnny/busRide)
Katastrophe; This is where the protagonist meets his logical destruction, Freytag warns the writer not to spare the life of the hero. It comprises the events from the end of the falling action to the actual ending scene of the drama or narrative. **Important** => Conflicts are resolved, creating normalcy for the characters and a sense of catharsis, or release of tension and anxiety for the users.
- Pretty much everything happening after choosing one of the 4 main endings (not including their small varia.)
Opinion;
Even after going through a basic dramatic structure analysis, the story doesn’t make sense.. Well “for me” it doesn’t create normalcy for the users and/or unraveling/untying the plot complexities. I mean, we’re currently left in a depressing emotional loop that provides no continuity and or even really considering the user's choices when there's a way out, at least opening up NC after the credits could make me experience that return to normality before exposing the user to the death sentence/gone with the wind/Mikoshi’s actual denouement/restoration, hopefully in a future dlc/expansion, instead of reloading to last checkpoint.
Excellent found and good deduction.
The problem is that some very important parts are missing. Namely, the resolved conflicts.
Nothing is really resolved and the remaining characters are crushed or still in the same, deep shit as they were before.
I guess that the "Katastrophe" is compete when V bites the dust after 6 months but I hardly think that's what freytag means with sparing the character.
"some fates are worse than death". This is very nicely seen when Geralt of Riva becomes a drunk, who dies in a lousy barfight. "Warns not to spare" inam not a native English speaker but this looks like a double negative to me. Can a native speaker please elaborate?
In any case, the conflict of the characters and especially the main character are not resolved. Normality is not really achieved. Either the characters leave NC or are left alone, crushed by loss.
The hunt for survival is not resolved. While there are possible moments of doubt, V does not go out with a bang, the tension is not released and we are left with headcanon to make the story bearable.
In addition, the structure failed, because the theme of survival does not really fit to the 4th and 5th step of the structure.
It would be OK if we were on a hunt for revenge or to safe another character but the idea falls flat if WE are the person that needs help.
I personally think that freytag should not be used for a game with high immersion, because all the shit piling up, is not only piled up on the MC but also the player.
As we see in our case, easily overburdening the player.
After so many shit piled up, we are denied the shower and that stinks.
Yeah, great, sure.
That may be very useful when you want to write a novel.
That's plain bullshit when you want to write a RPG scenario.
Someone mentioned the Call of Chtulluh somewhere, in which the investigators either die or are turned insane by the madness they uncover. Well, that's the point in that gothic horror game : coping with Lovecraft's creation.
In Cyberpunk 2077, the writing is just lame.
You're given a goal. The Act 1 is useless (or badly set). You're supposed to get a best pal ever (and I was sure he was to die or somewhat disappear after 5 minutes of gameplay), your lifepath serves nothing but to introduce the world. It has no influence on the remainder of the game. The real thing starts in act 2.
Some mention a feeling of emergency. I did not feel that emergency (despite the narration heavy insistence). There is no countdown, so, why hurry ?
Then there is all the story we know up to its endings.
In a novel, as a writer, you're god almighty and do what you want with your characters.
As a game master of a RPG, your scope is not to follow some template to build your story but to entertain your players and have some good time with them. And CDPR fails miserably at that in their endings which does not reward the player / character and which are simply hammered on the player / character because "fuck you, that's my story, so behave".
CP 2077 may be some nice novel, but it is a very bad RPG (or game) scenario.
Freytag's Pyramid is great for heroic tales like Beowulf, or if you want to set up the rise and fall of a character like Lord of War (movie with Nicolas Cage). CP 2077 does not that. You don't rise, and you crash pretty fast.
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the endings for me felt sad. empty and unsatisfied. just like ME3 good all the way up until the end.
There was some sense in the ME3 ending. I mean, we saved the galaxy. But yes, we ourselves most likely died, this is sad. But at least it was not in vain.
In Cyberpunk, the ending isn't just sad, it's clinically stupid. Throughout the game, we tried to save the character, this was the goal, so that in the end, according to the script, they dumped the fact that it simply cannot be saved, and that's it.
The second time playing through the game will be as interesting as pushing the door with the inscription "towards yourself".
For my part, the ending killed any urge to replay the game.
That's make one of the most expensive game I've ever bought in terms of money/time spent on the game.
I'm waiting for a save editor...
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yeah the story felt kind of rushed. cdpr need to fix that...badly
Oh yeah I totally agree with you there, the most important part was rushed out and its painful. Kinda reminds me of how the original Evangelion ended, a shame really lol. I simply found it funny that everything could've been placed in Freytag's pyramid but failed at giving a good RPG scenario. As if the writers were to follow the Japanese Kishōtenketsu interpretation without the "ketsu" or actual wrapping up xD
They can leave in as it is and can go with spin-offs,fine it’s their game their artistic integrity but it’s also my money and my time.
In this situation game wouldn’t meet my expectations and wasn’t fixed. I wouldn’t buy anything for this game, and their futur games i would buy after few weeks/months if ever.
I’m sure I wouldn’t be alone.
So this will be the second shitstorm against the game:
-we had the bugs
-we had the console problems
NOW the endings problems and a halfmade main story.
What a time to be alive, BRACE YOURSELVES SAMURAI
-we had the bugs
-we had the console problems
NOW the endings problems and a halfmade main story.
What a time to be alive, BRACE YOURSELVES SAMURAI
Well, guess what? it's not the players' fault that the game has bugs, console problems, a trash story, or all of the other shit. If a company is gonna release a flawed product then they better be ready to get called out