Why does realism in video games always translates to misery?
I understand the point you're trying to make. Just remember life is also usually very monotonous, boring, and doesn't change that much at all from time to time. Specially if you're trying to get better at something or achieve a goal. Sounds like a terrible videogame in my mind.
Sounds like a lot of time I spent playing Cyberpunk 2077 going from one blue marker to the next on the map
Come on nowSounds like a lot of time I spent playing Cyberpunk 2077 going from one blue marker to the next on the map
Has nothing to do with "Realism". How many people die in the game especially by the player's hands or those who they helped? Would you classify their lives as ending Happily? Just from a perspective of the game it rarely has a happy ending, even the setting makes this well-known from the prologue. (Suggesting it is more common ending in NC to have a bad ending than it is in our current world.)
The problem is in cyberpunk "you dont save the world. you save yourself" as Mike Pondsmith HIMSELF said. But in this game you can't even do that one thing that is so centered in the universe that Cyberpunk Creator describe it himself.
Meanwhile in the game you save a lot of ordinary strangers like somekind of superhero cyber-spiderman and cant even save yourself at the end of the day.
Not much cyberpunky imho.
Well thank you
Well as i've written in the other thread, i simply the game is trying to touch too many subjects to stay clear.
Dex questioning you how to life? Going Icarus or not? Then getting "ill", while concentrating on Vic&Misty going that there might be chances? - Being able to change from Icarus towards Family with the Alvecados - definately looks like your Survival / letting go of dreams - story.
You just living with Jackie, following his dreams (with not nessecarily sharing it) - getting struck by "plot cancer" - Vic telling you, you're going to die, Misty telling you, you'll need to accept it, while taking their "maybe there's something out there"- as your usual adressing a terminally ill and trying to give false hope - definately looking like a story about coming to terms and questioning existance.
Now then you got the whole Arasaka (and Corpos) is evil with Saburo, Yorinobu is evil for killing his evil father and trying kill Goro and you (or something). Johnny tells you they're the big evil. But this plays into the above, without choosing either way it maybe that much changing anything (for V; not for the world).
And then... there's always Alt and Soulkiller attached to everything - killing Souls/or not. Which makes, depending upon what you think - the ends flip and flop around like fish out of water in what they mean for Vs survival.
And because of all these overlaping and contradicting readings it's imo quite a muddled mess.
Btw. The price for cyberpunk has dived according to open world games.
The problem is in cyberpunk "you dont save the world. you save yourself" as Mike Pondsmith HIMSELF said. But in this game you can't even do that one thing that is so centered in the universe that Cyberpunk Creator describe it himself.
Meanwhile in the game you save a lot of ordinary strangers like somekind of superhero cyber-spiderman and cant even save yourself at the end of the day.
Not much cyberpunky imho.
Cyberpunk feeling doesn't change the fact it is a "Dystopia" Universe where beyond just noting it is Dystopia, they specifically note how most people go out in a flash from burning the candle at both ends. You do/can save yourself, Just not solely on your terms. The methods that you end up saving yourself is very Dystopian; (and yes not happy or ideal).
The problem is that with a dystopian readin you can't save yourself.
As Soulkiller will kill V and the Pyramid in the Arasaka is also Soulkiller being used on V...
Panam seemed really happy in the Nomad ending and so did Johnny when taking over V's body, does that "Dystopia" thing only work on the player's character?
I dont think you can save yourself but thats open to interpretation. In my opinion - its not saving.
Story doesnt make sense on many levels(superpowered gangs, arasaka not going after V, V dying in the game like 3 times etc.) and this is just one of them.
The "dystopia" is ruined by these blue markers(feeling like a good guy policeman), lack of depth in the open world(every npc in this "dystopia" seem pretty happy or "ok" at worst) and plotholes I mentioned before.
Dystopia is best described here:
Much better ending for me would be:
V getting the chip out
Maybe getting a little cancer but manageable
V becoming a wanted man because of what he/she did - he/she has to run away from NC
But that's just me
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You save yourself but only get 6 months left to live
You save yourself by a barrel to the head (as Johnny Suggests at the start)
You save yourself by hoping Engram and Arasaka can be trusted (or that you have no other options)
You save yourself by becoming a legend similar to Johnny's name in the city. (In a few different ways possibly)
It's relative to your mindset, but you ultimately die. Which way is "save" yourself is the question that you would choose out of those offered?
Suicide ending is the best ending in this situation xD
Definition of dystopia.
"Definition of Dystopia. Dystopia is a world in which everything is imperfect, and everything goes terribly wrong. Dystopian literature shows us a nightmarish image about what might happen to the world in the near future."
A dystopia describes a setting in a piece of fiction. It does say nothing about what or what not has happen to the character, only about the world the character lives in.
"Definition of Dystopia. Dystopia is a world in which everything is imperfect, and everything goes terribly wrong. Dystopian literature shows us a nightmarish image about what might happen to the world in the near future."
A dystopia describes a setting in a piece of fiction. It does say nothing about what or what not has happen to the character, only about the world the character lives in.
I dont think you can save yourself but thats open to interpretation. In my opinion - its not saving.
Story doesnt make sense on many levels(superpowered gangs, arasaka not going after V, V dying in the game like 3 times etc.) and this is just one of them.
The "dystopia" is ruined by these blue markers(feeling like a good guy policeman), lack of depth in the open world(every npc in this "dystopia" seem pretty happy or "ok" at worst) and plotholes I mentioned before.
Dystopia is best described here:
Much better ending for me would be:
V getting the chip out
Maybe getting a little cancer but manageable
V becoming a wanted man because of what he did - he/she has to run away from NC
But that's just me
I agree about the Story's flaws in many areas, but the endings are far more correct with the type of setting. I completely understand the desire/want for a it ends as it started ending. It's always a safe move to give the easy ending that doesn't lead to hard questions that most of us prefer to avoid.
I strongly disagree with your reasoning here. If this would be the way to define a proper MC ending the gaming industry would be devoid of a positive ending for main characters almost entirely. The injustices of the worlds presented do not necessarily predict the final outcome of the stories told. This is because in most stories you'll get to see injustice, MC might kill a few characters or a ton of inconsequential NPC's, etc.
Also, welcome to the thread, dissenting opinions aside.
1. Interesting definition of saving oneself there.
2. Why even choose any of those options, then? Again the writer needs to take player motivation into account when designing options. Meaning if that's the clear choice there - i as player wouldn't choose either of those; possibly suicide. But even then, just sitting there looking at the city is nice. Curling up (lying sideways) in bed while spending the last eddies - sounds better than anything really...
3. Again it's gun or 5 seconds later through Soulkiller; no 6 months - if you apply this "dystopia" lense.