[SPOILERS] End-Game And Suspicions About The First DLC

[taiwanluthiers]

I don't know if anyone has done this.

You know how when you start the game (which I am sure you have had to, as the game is fucking buggy and you have to restart the game several times to trigger quests and stuff), there is an intro screen that changes depending on the progress you are in the story? You know first it's just Cyberpunk 2077 (in prologue), then V's apartment (act 1), The landfill (act 2 before you finish any major story elements), VDB's netrunning hideout (after completing Transmission), the microwave collector array (after blowing that up), and finally where the floats are stored in the Arasaka industrial park (after kidnapping Hanako). These screens are then accompanied with a short montage as the game loads when you select "continue".

Anyways if you create a save after the point of no return, and restart the game (or quit to main menu), you will be presented with The Afterlife. When you click "continue" (this is regardless of which endings you choose by the way, I did it both on Nomad and Corpo ending path), the radio guy will say that a terrorist group went and attacked Arasaka Tower and basically did a TON of damage. Arasaka stock is tanking like crazy, and Yori has evacuated to Tokyo. The radio announcer said "my advise, sell, while you still can".

So it really sounds like the Devil ending is not canon. Because if you chose Devil ending Arasaka is stronger than ever under Saburo's engram in Yori's body. In all other ending, except suicide, Arasaka basically tanks hard.

Therefore I think if there is any post game DLC or even a sequel, either Sun or Star will be canon.

Or ALL endings are true. Regardless of what V chooses, Nomads and Afterlife merc attacks Arasaka at the same time, possibly at the behest of Militech. Not unlike Cyberpunk 2020 where Johnny, Morgan Blackhand, and a few other takes a multi pronged attack on Arasaka.

Also Hanako dies in all but Devil ending. If you take the Star ending, and listen to Stanley in the car, Stanley says Hanako was killed by the terrorists, then about how Corporations are all blood, sweat, and tears.

 

[UgzAube]

Of all the endings, The Sun and The Star are the most likely to be canon.

The problem with the Devil ending is that Arasaka is doing well, so that will involve having to do a script on purpose with them.

 

[MaxPrimal]

I think there is going to have to be at least two life options for V in DLC. One, you go about finding a cure. Or.... two, becuase of the other grim endings, you are cloned and they insert your engram into a new body to have you do a long drawn out mission as payment for bringing you back.
Whatever it is i just hope we have the option of not dealing with or only minutely dealing with Panam. She is just the epitome of everything I dislike about a person. Oh and her constant whining. That too.

 

[taiwanluthiers]

Of all the endings, The Sun and The Star are the most likely to be canon.

The problem with the Devil ending is that Arasaka is doing well, so that will involve having to do a script on purpose with them.

Not only that but devil ending is literally the evil ending. Johnny is against it, and Misty really admonishes you as soon as she realized it was Arasaka coming to pick V up. Then the actual ending sequence is you literally reaping the consequence of your evil deeds.

 

[LordSareth]

Not only that but devil ending is literally the evil ending. Johnny is against it, and Misty really admonishes you as soon as she realized it was Arasaka coming to pick V up. Then the actual ending sequence is you literally reaping the consequence of your evil deeds.

What? The only ending there where V don't get soulkilled and you claim it is bad? I don't like the idea to play as copy of V that's why i have chosen the arasaka ending. If they made canon star or sun why give us a choice in the first place? I would love to have a Post MQ DLC (I reallly like my V) but it's gonna be propably another character opening world for sequel.

 

[Guest 4412420]

Considering how a lot of corporate dystopia elements are more in the background and V's story is on a personal scale, I don't see how they couldn't work The Devil ending in as well. The differences could just be referenced on the news like they are in the endings. I doubt that post-endings expansion (assuming we'll get one) would have anything to do with Arasaka, so, long and super detailed exposition isn't needed.

 

[exxxed]

What? The only ending there where V don't get soulkilled and you claim it is bad? I don't like the idea to play as copy of V that's why i have chosen the arasaka ending. If they made canon star or sun why give us a choice in the first place? I would love to have a Post MQ DLC (I reallly like my V) but it's gonna be propably another character opening world for sequel.

That's heavy and I'm going to ruin it for you right now (apologies!) but V is in Mikoshi at the end of The Devil, one can assume that they used Soulkiller on them in that ending as well...

As for the Copy of V, it's a philosophical concept, they're only a copy if another V exists at the same time which is not the case as far as I'm aware.

The brain, the memories, the experiences, the body it's still the same V afterwards regardless of the ending .

 

[LordSareth]

That's heavy and I'm going to ruin it for you right now (apologies!) but V is in Mikoshi at the end of The Devil, one can assume that they used Soulkiller on them in that ending as well...

As for the Copy of V, it's a philosophical concept, they're only a copy if another V exists at the same time which is not the case as far as I'm aware.

The brain, the memories, the experiences, the body it's still the same V afterwards regardless of the ending .

You know perfecly well that here is where we disagree ;]. Engram is a copy. Period. It doesn't matter if oryginal exist at that point in time because he existed before and just died, like silverhand the same situation. And saburo shows exacly what engram is : a copy coz he has engram as well as his real life. And assumption is not a fact, but just a assumption. It could be a hallucination as well. With arasaka we know that there was operation, what's more if they would have used a soulkiller there is no need to offer stay in secure your soul program. They would do it like in other endings, go back to body or stay in cyberspace. Sorry that i ruined it too for you

 

[exxxed]

You know perfecly well that here is where we disagree ;]. Engram is a copy. Period. It doesn't matter if oryginal exist at that point in time because he existed before and just died, like silverhand the same situation. And saburo shows exacly what engram is : a copy coz he has engram as well as his real life. And assumption is not a fact, but just a assumption. It could be a hallucination as well. With arasaka we know that there was operation, what's more if they would have used a soulkiller there is no need to offer stay in secure your soul program. They would do it like in other endings, go back to body or stay in cyberspace. Sorry that i ruined it too for you

I know we disagree on this aspect and that's why it's fun.

There was a discussion on the ''Endings'' thread about what an engram actually is and does and it rose some interesting implications, since the brain is the one that ultimately produces the experience of consciousness and the engram is the one that facilitates the data to enable said consciousness then the engram has the ''soul'' of the body it inhabits.

Hence why, even if the Engram of V is a different V, once inserted into the body it would be the same V, having V's soul so to speak .

 

[OG_VELI]

You know perfecly well that here is where we disagree ;]. Engram is a copy. Period. It doesn't matter if oryginal exist at that point in time because he existed before and just died, like silverhand the same situation.

No, it's not the same situation. Johnny doesn't have his original body. That's why he is only but an engram and nothing else. Whereas V still has their body fully intact, with their original consciousness inside waiting to be awakened by the Relic's repair process when Alt slots the engram she created back into it.

Let's look at it this way: your brain gets shut off for a couple of minutes, then your memories and personality get extracted and put into an engram, which is then put back into the Relic, so it can repair your brain and bring back everything that has been extracted. Will you see or call yourself a copy? Because if you think about it - nothing changed. You're still the same you, with your original perception of reality (consciousness) and all the memories and personality present.

 

[poldengonyboy]

Considering how a lot of corporate dystopia elements are more in the background and V's story is on a personal scale, I don't see how they couldn't work The Devil ending in as well. The differences could just be referenced on the news like they are in the endings. I doubt that post-endings expansion (assuming we'll get one) would have anything to do with Arasaka, so, long and super detailed exposition isn't needed.

This, I never got the argument so many people try to make about how the outcome of the endings are too different when a lot of what is happening in the world is happening behind the scenes as the story focuses more on V adn the characters around them.

Post automatically merged: Feb 14, 2021

No, it's not the same situation. Johnny doesn't have his original body. That's why he is only but an engram and nothing else. Whereas V still has their body fully intact, with their original consciousness inside waiting to be awakened by the Relic's repair process when Alt slots the engram she created back into it.

Let's look at it this way: your brain gets shut off for a couple of minutes, then your memories and personality get extracted and put into an engram, which is then put back into the Relic, so it can repair your brain and bring back everything that has been extracted. Will you see or call yourself a copy? Because if you think about it - nothing changed. You're still the same you, with your original perception of reality (consciousness) and all the memories and personality present.

Also this, it doesn't make a difference at all that V is a copy if he is literally identically the same as he was before.

 

[seracy]

Alt and Hellman know Soulkiller the best and they both tell you the same thing - it is only making a copy, not transferring a soul.
It doesn't matter as far as gameplay because we still control V. But Soulkilled V is an engram copy put back in the body which Alt calls a "blank partition". It is a separate being with V's memories and personality and the consciousness or soul of the original V is gone.
They could easily tie together all the survive endings with their own prologues if there is any post-game DLC. The game makes sure you know you have made a deal with the devil in the Arasaka ending, but it is the only one where the original V survives, which is important to some.

 

[Motsie]

but V is in Mikoshi at the end of The Devil

I'm surprised how many people miss this during the surgery segments. Like, you're in Mikoshi talking to Silverhand in his final moments - how do people think V got there? Soulkiller.

It's also the one ending where V wakes up and questions whether they are still the same person. It's rather sinister in its ambiguity.

 

[seracy]

I'm surprised how many people miss this during the surgery segments. Like, you're in Mikoshi talking to Silverhand in his final moments - how do people think V got there? Soulkiller.

I don't think you are Soulkilled in this ending. The chip is surgically extracted after it has already displaced a good portion of your neural network. You aren't wiped clean like you are in the Sun/Star, so the portions that Johnny replaced are still there.

Why would Arasaka Soulkill you, put you back in your body, then offer Soulkiller again but take your body away as an option if they already made an engram copy?

 

[Guest 4412420]

I'm surprised how many people miss this during the surgery segments. Like, you're in Mikoshi talking to Silverhand in his final moments - how do people think V got there? Soulkiller.

Hmm. Now I can't help but wonder if they lied about shredding Johnny's engram and imprisoned him in Mikoshi again.

 

[Restlessdingo32]

Why would Arasaka Soulkill you, put you back in your body, then offer Soulkiller again but take your body away as an option if they already made an engram copy?

Are you asking why Arasaka would take steps to convince you they didn't have your engram?

 

[seracy]

Are you asking why Arasaka would take steps to convince you they didn't have your engram?

I don't doubt that they would, but why do... both? Lie about Soulkilling and then put V back in their body and offer to Soulkill them again? And then they actually do send V to get the procedure... again? Also, the V that wakes up in the orbital station is experiencing something very different than the V in the Sun/Star. Wouldn't all 3 feel similar if all 3 were Soulkilled? Arasaka V is experiencing post-brain surgery recovery + no Johnny wipe unlike what we get in the Sun/Star. They are stuck with the bits of Johnny that already worked their way in.

 

[stndn]

I don't know if anyone has done this.

You know how when you start the game (which I am sure you have had to, as the game is fucking buggy and you have to restart the game several times to trigger quests and stuff), there is an intro screen that changes depending on the progress you are in the story? You know first it's just Cyberpunk 2077 (in prologue), then V's apartment (act 1), The landfill (act 2 before you finish any major story elements), VDB's netrunning hideout (after completing Transmission), the microwave collector array (after blowing that up), and finally where the floats are stored in the Arasaka industrial park (after kidnapping Hanako). These screens are then accompanied with a short montage as the game loads when you select "continue".

Anyways if you create a save after the point of no return, and restart the game (or quit to main menu), you will be presented with The Afterlife. When you click "continue" (this is regardless of which endings you choose by the way, I did it both on Nomad and Corpo ending path), the radio guy will say that a terrorist group went and attacked Arasaka Tower and basically did a TON of damage. Arasaka stock is tanking like crazy, and Yori has evacuated to Tokyo. The radio announcer said "my advise, sell, while you still can".

So it really sounds like the Devil ending is not canon. Because if you chose Devil ending Arasaka is stronger than ever under Saburo's engram in Yori's body. In all other ending, except suicide, Arasaka basically tanks hard.

Therefore I think if there is any post game DLC or even a sequel, either Sun or Star will be canon.

Or ALL endings are true. Regardless of what V chooses, Nomads and Afterlife merc attacks Arasaka at the same time, possibly at the behest of Militech. Not unlike Cyberpunk 2020 where Johnny, Morgan Blackhand, and a few other takes a multi pronged attack on Arasaka.

Also Hanako dies in all but Devil ending. If you take the Star ending, and listen to Stanley in the car, Stanley says Hanako was killed by the terrorists, then about how Corporations are all blood, sweat, and tears.

+ 1

I'm starting to think the expansion might only build upon The Sun and The Star.

• Both endings are virtually identical in terms of outcome:
  • Arasaka is weak and V is strong both financially and reputation wise.
  • This is obvious in The Sun but this also applies to The Star. The Aldecaldos stole a lot of valuable tech (mentioned by Mitch) and the Iliad hints at V having a strong renown in Night City (based on my interpretation).
• It's very easy to weave both of these endings into the same branch (Space Casino).
• Both endings are incredibly popular based on achievement data.
  • The Star takes the #1 spot closely followed by The Sun.
• Both endings preserve your love interests across all four companions allowing for an 'easy' continuation.
  • The Star: Panam/Judy
  • The Sun: River/Kerry
• Cherry on top? Misty's tarot readings for both of these endings are very optimistic. See my previous post.

I'm not saying Arasaka (Earth) can't work. But to me it's at odds with (1) the state of Arasaka in literally every other ending and (2) the theme behind Misty's tarots.

 

[taiwanluthiers]

+ 1

I'm starting to think the expansion might only build upon The Sun and The Star.

• Both endings are virtually identical in terms of outcome:
  • Arasaka is weak and V is strong both financially and reputation wise.
  • This is obvious in The Sun but this also applies to The Star. The Aldecaldos stole a lot of valuable tech (mentioned by Mitch) and the Iliad hints at V having a strong renown in Night City (based on my interpretation).
• It's very easy to weave both of these endings into the same branch (Space Casino).
• Both endings are incredibly popular based on achievement data.
  • The Star takes the #1 spot closely followed by The Sun.
• Both endings preserve your love interests across all four companions allowing for an 'easy' continuation.
  • The Star: Panam/Judy
  • The Sun: River/Kerry
• Cherry on top? Misty's tarot readings for both of these endings are very optimistic. See my previous post.

I'm not saying Arasaka (Earth) can't work. But to me it's at odds with (1) the state of Arasaka in literally every other ending and (2) the theme behind Misty's tarots.

Yea I really started playing the Devil ending to see if I get a different loading montage... and I don't. I expected to see a different montage, perhaps at Arasaka's office or something and a propaganda speech from Saburo saying that Arasaka is the future and all that... but no.

So seriously, I think those intro/loading montage pretty much establishes canon. And Devil ending is the only one that disagrees with it. So I don't think Devil is ever canon, or at least the Arasaka being strong and prosperous part. Because V could have taken the Devil ending and Arasaka could still have gotten attacked, and when V puts himself into Mikoshi Alt gets him back and puts him back into his body or something.

 

[exxxed]

Yea I really started playing the Devil ending to see if I get a different loading montage... and I don't. I expected to see a different montage, perhaps at Arasaka's office or something and a propaganda speech from Saburo saying that Arasaka is the future and all that... but no.

Saburo is on the telly doing exactly that all throughout The Devil ending .