(SPOILERS) Is Emhyr var Emreis a good emperor?

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In this case....
I hereby assign to you the post of official get-things-back-on-topic minister.

OOOOHHHH!!!!! Did you dare to ignore me?



Then I'll be the NEW BONHART female of course and make suffer your devoted CIRI hahahahaha

assuming that I have the courage to do



Edit: We are so off topic. :p

The heavy hand of the law, is upon us.

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I think Emhyr is a good ruler, sure they have strict rules but their economy is also flourishing. I'm not saying that when a empire or country has a good economy their king is the best. But the reason, imho, The Northern Kingdoms fear Nilfgaard is because they mostly hear of the punishments they have for failures and breaking the law. And ofcourse the kings don't want to lose their country and position as king.

So Emhyr can be an ass sometimes, but that is what's required of you when you rule a empire. And when he shows weakness his enemies will exploit it. And will the world be a better place under Nilfgaard's banner? I think so, people can actually try to live in peace. No more squirrel attacks and no fear of bandits.
 
I think Emhyr is a good ruler, sure they have strict rules but their economy is also flourishing. I'm not saying that when a empire or country has a good economy their king is the best. But the reason, imho, The Northern Kingdoms fear Nilfgaard is because they mostly hear of the punishments they have for failures and breaking the law. And ofcourse the kings don't want to lose their country and position as king.

So Emhyr can be an ass sometimes, but that is what's required of you when you rule a empire. And when he shows weakness his enemies will exploit it. And will the world be a better place under Nilfgaard's banner? I think so, people can actually try to live in peace. No more squirrel attacks and no fear of bandits.

In this case, Nilfgaards economy flourishing, is mainly the work of Emhyr. During the wars that he wages, he orders his armies to burn the crops, kill the animals, burn the factories and take everything that is worth anything. So then even if he loses the war, they enemy is forced to trade with him, because they will starve to death. Pretty nasty stuff. But quite common in war I guess. And since Milfgaard is the only nation, in the offensive, it reaps the benefits from it.
 
In this case, Nilfgaards economy flourishing, is mainly the work of Emhyr. During the wars that he wages, he orders his armies to burn the crops, kill the animals, burn the factories and take everything that is worth anything. So then even if he loses the war, they enemy is forced to trade with him, because they will starve to death. Pretty nasty stuff. But quite common in war I guess. And since Milfgaard is the only nation, in the offensive, it reaps the benefits from it.
This is a highly antiquated view on economics and foreign trade (and mostly a faulty one as well)... ;)

Actually your own economy is better off by trading if you trading partner has a flourishing industry himself. Of course people didn't know that much about economics in medieval times. But burning the crops, killing animals and destroying industry was even back then not very rational for a regular invading force. There is no sense in burning down whole regions if you want to rule the very same regions later after the war. It's one of the strategies or wishes of Nilfgaard to settle their own people in newly invaded countries and they would be better of if they could just overtake what the expelled northern popularity left behind. But most of the crops and animals were needed for the Nilfgaardian army anyway. They had to eat something.

But I agree with you that destroying the belongings of your enemy is rational IF you think you'll probably lose the war (but not because of foreign trade but to discourage the enemy to start a counter attack -> you can't perform tradititonal war in burnt down land). In that case it's more a raid than a traditional invading war with the goal to conquering country and aquiring new farmland. I personally think burning down whole regions while conducting an invading war is a signal of weakness and damaged confidence. I think some of you bestow Emhyr too much honor. He's of course clever but he doesn't seem like the best emperor ever to me. He is highly dependent on his intelligence service and his forces lost against the united north before. In fact, nothing he did so far was really a clear victory apart from saving himself the crown. He failed in the Ciri case, he failed in the first war, he failed in believing Vilgefortz, he will fail in giving birth to an heir and he will probably also fail in his second war against the north. I think he did well enough to survice at the top but not good enough to call him a very good emperor. He's imo much more tragic than successful or even good.... ;)
 
Hm but see, Emhyr was not sure that he would win the war. Even if most Nilfgaardians thought that he would. He didn't sent settlers to populate the areas he sent settles to help bring the native population under control. The Nordlings would return and rebuild, after all it was their homes.

He destroyed the factories in Aldesberg, and Aedirn never picked up again. Brugge, Sodden and Verden hell even Temeria, were forced to buy goods from Nilfgaard. Which gave power to the Nilfgaardian coin, while the Temerian one started to mean nothing. It is a very smart tactic, even if you win the war. Nilfgaardian merchants would make a killing, and then get brutally taxed by Emhyr. He failed in the first war due to sorcerers and magic. That is he failed to conquer land, but in the end he came out way stronger. He failed in the second war, because of Esterad of Kovir. The North wouldn't stand a chance without his help.
He didn't actually fail in Ciri's case. He just dropped his goal. He very much believed Vilgefortz, but was duped by the magician, but after all he found him. And he would have made him suffer, had Geralt not killed him a few moments before that. Giving birth to an heir, that he will fail to do. Well probably.

He is indeed more "tragic" than he is "good", but he is very very successful. I'd say even more than he is tragic.

If successful is not the right word, due to his eventual fate, then I'd say intelligent. Very very intelligent. Definitely a lot more than the Northern Monarchs. Esterad not included.
 
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Emhyr mixed in good balance by his intelligence the why he did all those steps an the how. Reasons: a bitterness revenge against humanity he got while his teenager age, and the way is expeditiously without compassion or margin of error.

Judging him by being a good Emperor... it's not easy. He is a very special case, those of you can hate him as the same time you admire him. Foltest only lived a normal life if you compare both of them
 
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Hm but see, Emhyr was not sure that he would win the war. Even if most Nilfgaardians thought that he would. He didn't sent settlers to populate the areas he sent settles to help bring the native population under control. The Nordlings would return and rebuild, after all it was their homes.
A leader who is not sure whether he will win or not is a bad leader. He conducted a war with the goal to lose it? Buring down the regions you just invaded is just stupid if you want to occupy these regions. This whole war tactics seem more like a raid to me. Plundering the northern kingdoms and making sure that they can't fight back in the near future....this is not a war, it's barbarism.

He destroyed the factories in Aldesberg, and Aedirn never picked up again. Brugge, Sodden and Verden hell even Temeria, were forced to buy goods from Nilfgaard.
Well, that's just not realistic. With which money should Brugge, Sodden and Vergen be able to buy Nilfgaardian goods? Foreign trade is based on the well being of two nations while you benefit from the wealth of your trading partner. A partner who has nothing is a worthless partner.

Which gave power to the Nilfgaardian coin, while the Temerian one started to mean nothing. It is a very smart tactic, even if you win the war. Nilfgaardian merchants would make a killing, and then get brutally taxed by Emhyr.
That's a very short-sided strategy in which you punish almost everyone just to make some cash for the treasury.


He failed in the first war due to sorcerers and magic. That is he failed to conquer land, but in the end he came out way stronger.
Ahem, no. Actually there was no magic involved in the battle at Brenna. He lost the war because his generals make crucial tactical mistakes and because the northern kingdoms were better united than they all thought in the south.

He failed in the second war, because of Esterad of Kovir. The North wouldn't stand a chance without his help.
How do you know? IIRC there is no source whether he won or lost the second war (which takes place during Witcher 3).

He didn't actually fail in Ciri's case. He just dropped his goal.
Nice try, nice word game. But the result is the same. He failed in what he wanted to achieve here. That's just a fact. ;)

He very much believed Vilgefortz, but was duped by the magician, but after all he found him. And he would have made him suffer, had Geralt not killed him a few moments before that. Giving birth to an heir, that he will fail to do. Well probably.
Well, Pavetta is already dead. He failed in saving her. And tbh we have no idea if Emhyr would have been able to kill Vilgefortz. I personally highly doubt it.

He is indeed more "tragic" than he is "good", but he is very very successful. I'd say even more than he is tragic.
Well, then let's agree to disagree. If you ask me the biggest success he has is that he still sits on the throne... :p

If successful is not the right word, due to his eventual fate, then I'd say intelligent. Very very intelligent. Definitely a lot more than the Northern Monarchs. Esterad not included.
He wasn't more intelligent than Foltest who was in fact a very clever and ruthless bastard. And Esterad? Well, he was in the nice position to be just too far away from Nilfgaard. It's easy to maintain neutrality if you have a nice saved spot to live. But yeah, at least Esterad knows something about how to make money and how to trade... ;)

Emhyr is a character who deserves perhaps both hate and respect but no pity.
 
Oh man this is going to take a while. :p
Bear with me please.
A leader who is not sure whether he will win or not is a bad leader. He conducted a war with the goal to lose it? Buring down the regions you just invaded is just stupid if you want to occupy these regions. This whole war tactics seem more like a raid to me. Plundering the northern kingdoms and making sure that they can't fight back in the near future....this is not a war, it's barbarism.

It definitely is barbarism. It is raiding. And it is done, for the reason you just came up with. To make sure the enemy can't fight in the future. He had faith in his generals that he would win the war, by faith I mean, he told them to win it, or the war would be the least of their concerns. But he did not know for sure. Nobody can predict the outcome of a war, with 100% certainty. Let's phrase that differently, he was confident that he would win, but he was not sure.

Well, that's just not realistic. With which money should Brugge, Sodden and Vergen be able to buy Nilfgaardian goods? Foreign trade is based on the well being of two nations while you benefit from the wealth of your trading partner. A partner who has nothing is a worthless partner.

That is very true. Though it is not described in the books, I would give you an example from our world. When Greece "needed" money, but did not have any, "we" asked some wealthier nations to lend us some. If Esterad could lend money to Redania, I don't see why he wouldn't lend on Brugge and Sodden. Money which, eventually end up in Nilfgaard. Even Nilfgaard could lend money, and still not lose from it, since it all comes back and gets retaxed.

That's a very short-sided strategy in which you punish almost everyone just to make some cash for the treasury.

It is indeed, but Emhyr cared about when he would be ready to wage the next war. So fast cash for the treasury is all that he needed. Traitors and Usurpers he would deal with later. He was quite infamous for it.


Ahem, no. Actually there was no magic involved in the battle at Brenna. He lost the war because his generals make crucial tactical mistakes and because the northern kingdoms were better united than they all thought in the south.

There have already been two wars with Nilfgaard described in the books. The first war, ended with the Battle of Sodden Hill, in which battle, mages who did not usually take part in such battles, had a crucial part in favor of the North. Led by Vilgefortz of Roggeveen the mages of the North managed to burn a huge chunk of Nilfgaards army, thus winning the war for the North. It is were Triss got her scar, and it is where Yennefer lost her eyes.


How do you know? IIRC there is no source whether he won or lost the second war (which takes place during Witcher 3).

The second war with Nilfgaard ended with the Battle of Brenna, in which the Condotieri that were released from Kovir's prisons, and then got paid with Kovir money, lent to Redania, by King Esterad, had a very crucial part. What also played a crucial role in the fight was the Kaedweni cavalry brigade, the Dun Banner, along with some Redanians who arrived in battle unexpected, because a Nilfgaardian scout was scared to do his job.


Nice try, nice word game. But the result is the same. He failed in what he wanted to achieve here. That's just a fact. ;)

I did not intend to make a word play, I truly think that Emhyr abandoned his goal, so that Ciri would be happy. She was his daughter after all. One might have never loved his wife, but kids are another matter entirely. But that is Emhyr's decision nonetheless.


Well, Pavetta is already dead. He failed in saving her. And tbh we have no idea if Emhyr would have been able to kill Vilgefortz. I personally highly doubt it.

Pavetta died due to an accident, cause by her magic nature, in a attack of hysteria she fell off the ship that was being teleported by Vilgefortz in castle Stygga. And thus she died. Emhyr did not love her, but he regretted her death. He had failed getting Ciri with him on that boat though, that I will say. Queen Calanthe, ruined his plans at the last minute. But Queen Calanthe was freaking awesome. Smarter than any King, or Emperor.

Now if Emhyr could actually capture Vilgefortz, that I do not know. But I would expect he would not go to castle Stygga completely unprepared.



Well, then let's agree to disagree. If you ask me the biggest success he has is that he still sits on the throne... :p

I'll wait to pass judgement on that, until you read this post. :)
We might still disagree though, you never know. :p


He wasn't more intelligent than Foltest who was in fact a very clever and ruthless bastard. And Esterad? Well, he was in the nice position to be just too far away from Nilfgaard. It's easy to maintain neutrality if you have a nice saved spot to live. But yeah, at least Esterad knows something about how to make money and how to trade... ;)

Foltest was a smart man, but he was also an idiot in many ways. For example with Baroness La Valette. If he hadn't listened to what the little friend in his pants told him to do, he would have truly created a very solid Kingdom, with many vassals, one that which even Nilfgaard, would have trouble to overthrow.[/QUOTE]

And Esterad, has proven in the books how intelligent of a King he is. Maybe he is even more insightful than Emhyr. He pretty much won the war for the North, without Kovir being officially implicated. The passage from the books, where he is having that discussion with Dijkstra, is quite interesting, and worthy of a second reading.

Emhyr is a character who deserves perhaps both hate and respect but no pity.

That might be so, but it is a matter that each of us will have to decide on his own. It is a matter of opinion I mean.

If any of you managed to read this far, then HI. It is a beautiful day! :D
 
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He's a badass emperor. As a human being though? Well, he wanted to
pork the fruit of his loins
, so you decide.
 
Not gonna happen in my playthrough though.
Nor mine, friend, nor mine. ^_^

Indeed, I suggest to put [SPOILER from books] even in the topic title, just to be sure.

I second that, and can see it's been done, but I would also like more use of spoiler tags in thread. I've caught the attention of moderators for posting minor spoilers, not even comparable to the spoilers discussed here. Oh well, I am now warned. I really long for the day I've read all books and can fully join in these kind of discussions.
 
I second that, and can see it's been done, but I would also like more use of spoiler tags in thread. I've caught the attention of moderators for posting minor spoilers, not even comparable to the spoilers discussed here. Oh well, I am now warned. I really long for the day I've read all books and can fully join in these kind of discussions.
Politics are minor spoilers and can't be fully understood if you have not read the books. But anyway, I see your problem, don't worry, I'll put politics under spoiler tag too. :)
 
Nor mine, friend, nor mine. ^_^



I second that, and can see it's been done, but I would also like more use of spoiler tags in thread. I've caught the attention of moderators for posting minor spoilers, not even comparable to the spoilers discussed here. Oh well, I am now warned. I really long for the day I've read all books and can fully join in these kind of discussions.

Yeah, pretty sorry about that, my previous post was quite spoilery, but it was too long so I didn't think many people would read it. And it felt wrong putting spoiler tags on that whole thing. :p
 
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