[Spoilers] Very few of the quests have satisfying resolutions

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No. the point of Sinnerman is to portray certain aspects of dystopian future. Interaction gives us possibility to get more information, we have some choice, but it's really asking about some disturbing questions.

And this pretty much sums up exactly why I think it sucks - the writer was too focused on telling a particular story that they decided to sacrifice the role-playing aspect almost entirely. As it stands, there is very little plausible reason why V is even strung along for this quest; their presence feels completely out-of-place and their involvement is simply to act as a passenger while a bunch of things happen around them. In essence, the entirety of this quest's plot, and the associated moral undertones, could've been relayed through an in-world TV news broadcast or documentary rather than an entire quest.

I'm not asking for a fix-it ending to the quest where you can sweet-talk everyone into a happy ending. You can explore dark, dystopian themes without forcing a single narrative on the player - some of Deus Ex: HR's side quests did this better. If you're going to rope the player into doing something, you have to make it worth their while. Watching some guy being nailed to a cross while pondering the empty question of "is this a good thing?" is not, in my opinion, a compelling payoff to a half-hour-or-so sidequest.
 
You never said, but it still comes down to following thing. How humans, work. There's only so many situations that enable possibility for certain kind of bonding and trust. Miss that window, and it's gone. I'm not talking about the game, but this is also how it works in game.

alternative branches opening interactions with other characters

And the alternative content doesn't have to be equivalent in quality and quantity.

Access all content at once, then what about the re-playability? What about choice and consequence? People would still be complaining about linearity.

If anything, branching would make the game more replayable. It would allow to roleplay different characters without missing half the content for once.
 
I saw this yesterday, and yeah, I felt like it's very hard to swallow "I like to frustrate players with ambiguity" when so much of this game is obviously incomplete.

Wild guess, that was a very clever joke. The reason is the statement itself is a bit ambiguous.
 
HEROES: I *really* wanted there to be some kind of connection or potential effect with the Valentinos gang based on your relationship with Jackie. Instead I spent the whole game gunning them down. Relationships with the different gangs was a missed opportunity in the design. Some gangs could have been friendly to you, while their rivals or enemies hated you. Of course all the gangs were into some bad stuff so maybe you choose to befriend none of them.

I agree with everything you said so this is not a rebuttal, simply a point of clarity: After the Ofrenda quest, there is a specific Gig that Padre can give you in the City Center to steal something from a Valentino bar, and if you walk in without going guns blazing or pulling out your weapon/hacking anyone, one of the Valentinos there (who was at the Ofrenda) will actually pull you aside (if you drank with them at the Ofrenda) and you'll get a mini scenario with them that ends with the entire second level of the bar being non-hostile to you, enabling you to stealth the rest of the way to completion of the gig peacefully. It's a very small instance, but the impact of it and the mentions of Jackie, plus what came before this quest, was still touching.

Unfortunately, you can still gun down these people (and are actively encouraged to) whenever you see them after this, so the immersion and effects of that are still the same.
 
I agree with everything you said so this is not a rebuttal, simply a point of clarity: After the Ofrenda quest, there is a specific Gig that Padre can give you in the City Center to steal something from a Valentino bar, and if you walk in without going guns blazing or pulling out your weapon/hacking anyone, one of the Valentinos there (who was at the Ofrenda) will actually pull you aside (if you drank with them at the Ofrenda) and you'll get a mini scenario with them that ends with the entire second level of the bar being non-hostile to you, enabling you to stealth the rest of the way to completion of the gig peacefully. It's a very small instance, but the impact of it and the mentions of Jackie, plus what came before this quest, was still touching.

Unfortunately, you can still gun down these people (and are actively encouraged to) whenever you see them after this, so the immersion and effects of that are still the same.

Ha. and the whole getting street cred working with the cops! "wtaf"? then cops hunting you for shooting gangs they want you to shoot lol. always made me laugh.
 
I agree with everything you said so this is not a rebuttal, simply a point of clarity: After the Ofrenda quest, there is a specific Gig that Padre can give you in the City Center to steal something from a Valentino bar, and if you walk in without going guns blazing or pulling out your weapon/hacking anyone, one of the Valentinos there (who was at the Ofrenda) will actually pull you aside (if you drank with them at the Ofrenda) and you'll get a mini scenario with them that ends with the entire second level of the bar being non-hostile to you, enabling you to stealth the rest of the way to completion of the gig peacefully. It's a very small instance, but the impact of it and the mentions of Jackie, plus what came before this quest, was still touching.

Unfortunately, you can still gun down these people (and are actively encouraged to) whenever you see them after this, so the immersion and effects of that are still the same.
He actually recognized me from the ofrenda in my playthrough as well... Except there was no ofrenda in my playthrough as Jackie's body was taken by corpos. So... Don't think your choice matters here at all.
 
And this pretty much sums up exactly why I think it sucks - the writer was too focused on telling a particular story that they decided to sacrifice the role-playing aspect almost entirely. As it stands, there is very little plausible reason why V is even strung along for this quest; their presence feels completely out-of-place and their involvement is simply to act as a passenger while a bunch of things happen around them. In essence, the entirety of this quest's plot, and the associated moral undertones, could've been relayed through an in-world TV news broadcast or documentary rather than an entire quest.
Different strokes for different folks.


Access all content at once, then what about the re-playability? What about choice and consequence? People would still be complaining about linearity.
If anything, branching would make the game more replayable. It would allow to roleplay different characters without missing half the content for once.
Yep, ME forums again. But good luck with whatever.
 
He actually recognized me from the ofrenda in my playthrough as well... Except there was no ofrenda in my playthrough as Jackie's body was taken by corpos. So... Don't think your choice matters here at all.

That sounds like an incredible bug, got a good laugh out of me! I figure in your instance you were meant to just have that bar still be hostile to you and the game didn't register that earlier choice since the devs figure most people would try to get Jackie to his mom or leave him in the car. A shame.
 
He actually recognized me from the ofrenda in my playthrough as well... Except there was no ofrenda in my playthrough as Jackie's body was taken by corpos. So... Don't think your choice matters here at all.

Only the 4 companions/love interests+ silverhand and their quests matter in the whole game everything else is fluff pointless padding. Now the shills and snowflakes will shout oh but Jack it makes the world alive,. No it doesn't if it doesn't matter.
 
Some more context on that last tweet. I don’t blame this dude at all for having his own spin on the quests he mentions, they’re both brilliant. He supposedly did ‘The Pickup’ too. One of the best quests in the game for me.
But it seems a lil bit tone deaf when so many other parts of the game are seemingly unfinished and CDPR aren’t giving us much of anything for what they’re planning for the game plot-wise.
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That sounds like an incredible bug, got a good laugh out of me! I figure in your instance you were meant to just have that bar still be hostile to you and the game didn't register that earlier choice since the devs figure most people would try to get Jackie to his mom or leave him in the car. A shame.
Possibly, wouldn't be the first not the last time the game pulled that stuff on me:beer:
 
Yep, ME forums again. But good luck with whatever.

:think:
Sorry but where in the world "Playing different branches containing different content with different characters" = "Accessing all content at once"?
 
And the alternative content doesn't have to be equivalent in quality and quantity.

If anything, branching would make the game more replayable. It would allow to roleplay different characters without missing half the content for once.

AAA seem to want such a broad audience who don't replay or sometimes even finish so devs seem to be getting more scared about including branching content to make it more replayable for those who do.
 
Ha. and the whole getting street cred working with the cops! "wtaf"? then cops hunting you for shooting gangs they want you to shoot lol. always made me laugh.

This is the one thing that didn't feel very "punk" at all in Cyberpunk. No option to defy or punish the cops for whatever your reasons because the AI is not programmed to be apart of the sandbox NOR any option to align with them if you do all the quests adjacent to them, your neighbor, the police gigs, or River. On top of that, they just instant kill you after a certain point if you don't have good equipment to handle them. Street Cred is a good example of a narrative system that has no satisfying resolutions with any story.
 
AAA seem to want such a broad audience who don't replay or sometimes even finish so devs seem to be getting more scared about including branching content to make it more replayable for those who do.

I and i presume we all paid for what was promised and showed, we got 1% of that and that 1% seems to be backdrop scenery lol. Gaming as gone down hill like a Mizutani in reverse. A slow slide into the gutter with NCPD in hot pursuit.
 
This is the one thing that didn't feel very "punk" at all in Cyberpunk. No option to defy or punish the cops for whatever your reasons because the AI is not programmed to be apart of the sandbox NOR any option to align with them if you do all the quests adjacent to them, your neighbor, the police gigs, or River. On top of that, they just instant kill you after a certain point if you don't have good equipment to handle them. Street Cred is a good example of a narrative system that has no satisfying resolutions with any story.

yup, there are two games here, both are not very good. One is the V story and the other is the NPC's :) who seem to be alot better dressed and equipt than V.
 
Agreed, every quest apart from the basic gigs are up in the air in the game. Maybe your goal as a writer shouldn't be to frustrate players but to make them satisfied?

It's incredibly telling that there is more satisfaction in random throwaway quests than the main plot and side stories.

Maybe the only quest that has a net positive outcome is river's sisequest as you save a bunch of kids.
 
I'm glad you mentioned this because Judy's attitude after the Clouds failed uprising is the only reason why I didn't finish her romance. She avoided thinking/talking about the consequences of her actions and didn't seem to learn anything from it outside of "NC is toxic", while there were multiple reasons for the plan failing (no one defending Clouds, no support from other gangs, she removed the fighting program from the dolls leaving them vulnerable, etc).
V's line when romancing her is to "let it go" :confused:

Ehh, the reality is Judy never accepted it was going to be rough. She had a feeling about the legend of Lizzie but glossed over the fact that lizzie Died, and probably a lot of other mox died taking control. And after that maintaining it. She quit on them after one set back. This is just a part of her character. She quit on clouds, quit on V, quit on NC. Not saying she didn't have reasons, but nothin V could do would make her not a runner. I kinda felt they gave her these character flaws to comment on idealists, which is a bit unfair to idealists, she didnt fail because of her ideals, she failed due to lack of commitment and poor planning.

BTW she removed the program? I never saw that, thats crazy. I guess she had to or they'd unconsciously kill clients... but you need security...
 
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