Sui Generis

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freakie in what other forums are you performing your missionary work, out of curiosity?

I don't frequent many forums. I've been a long time member of this forum (since 2007) and I lurked here even before signing up. I spend most of my time currently on the SG forums simply because the devs are active and I am busy giving feedback/bug reports/suggestions. The only other forum I've mentioned the game on is a car forum which I frequent occasionally.

However, I do discuss the game with real life friends/acquaintances and many have shown interest. Especially since I can show those people the actual alpha/beta builds running on my PC which goes a long way towards convincing people that what I'm saying is actually possible; I can better demonstrate all the new mechanics which allow gameplay possibilities that are hard to explain using words alone. After demonstrating all the crazy things which are possible most people have their mind blown :p.

After showing the game to my real life best friend (Aaron) he said I've spoiled all other games for him. Now he can't help but compare everything else to Sui Generis and he says nothing else stacks up.
 
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Twenty years ago I played Ultima 7 and the Underworlds and saw the pinnacle of roleplaying and games in general, and what did the industry do to consolidate on that?

I was going to mention this previously but I totally spaced it... the devs are also big fans of the Ultima series :).
 
Lot of devs are I think, you can see Sven's reverence for the series in all of the Divinities. Lot of modern folk just don't know 'em though, which is a damn shame, or even worse condemn 'em for not being pretty enough. Ironic thing is each new Ultima game back in the day necessitated a big upgrade or a new comp, they were at the cutting edge of innovation and now you wonder how they fit such huge games on a few hundred MB's of data.
 
Inc Gamers did an interview with Madoc Evans about Sui Generis and Exanima which can be found here: LINK.

And some interesting quotes from the article which give a good idea about what they're creating in Sui Generis:

While trying to reinvent the RPG for the modern computer the biggest challenge is the story telling. We see an RPG not as being put in a role but being put in a world where we can play and develop any role we choose. By this I don’t mean choosing to be a fisherman rather than an adventurer but that when faced with a situation you can do anything you can think of rather than being limited to specific choices.

We don’t want to be given a series of specific tasks, be told who the bad guys and good guys are, or make major irreversible plot decisions by clicking on one option rather than another. We want to make our own judgements and decisions and the world to be influenced by all our actions and their implications.

Some people are initially taken aback by it, they expect to absent-mindedly press buttons and run around while things just fall into place and you somehow win and accomplish what you were supposed to. The physics aren’t just for show, you need to really embrace them and use them; information isn’t fed to you, you need to find it and piece it together; you’re not given objectives, you have to set your own. The game is ruthless, it does not want you to win.

The world is indifferent to you, AIs will do their absolute best to beat you. The aim is not to win and be rewarded, it’s to be challenged, to become immersed and have fun, even if you failed to do something. It is most certainly not a casual game, but it’s not complicated either. It has a lot of depth and freedom that are not immediately apparent. If you take the time to figure out what it’s about and how it works you might be captivated like never before.
 
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Good Interview, non-stock questions & full answers, worth reading just for the novelty of that these days. This is definitely my #2 anticipated game (beating PoE / Torment etc, because this could be pure progress).

[Quoting Madoc] By this I don’t mean choosing to be a fisherman rather than an adventurer but that when faced with a situation you can do anything you can think of rather than being limited to specific choices.

I dunno... I can think of quite a lot of things usually, may want to tone down this particular claim ;)

But it also chimes with something I've been pondering a lot lately, why can't one of the systems in a RPG be an accurate or complex societal structure in which the player can participate, advance or fall? Crime, NPC behavioural responses, status, access or loss of various benefits, all kinds of systems that occasionally appear in RPGs but are always detached from eachother could be modelled under the one larger, comprehensible, real world mirroring system. Why not add a deep social interaction sim to our hacking & slashing?

And wouldn't such a thing provide what some people on the fringes of gaming have been claiming is required to bring more people into the scene? Maybe even get some people off Facebook, thereby saving humanity in general from damnation ;)
 
Good Interview, non-stock questions & full answers, worth reading just for the novelty of that these days. This is definitely my #2 anticipated game (beating PoE / Torment etc, because this could be pure progress).

Yes, Madoc is always straightforward and honest. He doesn't attempt to give vague PR nonsense responses and he puts a lot of thought into what he says. It also helps that he knows exactly what currently is or isn't possible in the game since he's written all the code himself.

I dunno... I can think of quite a lot of things usually, may want to tone down this particular claim ;)

Yes, he could have been more specific about that. I think he meant that you can do anything you can think of (as long as it's possible to do in the game in the first place). For example, in most games your only choices are those presented to you via a list of options in a dialogue box. In SG this will not be the case. In SG your actions actually matter and not just what dialogue options are selected.

Let's say you choose to get inside a heavily guarded castle for whatever reason. You could go up and talk to the guards and attempt to bribe them or try to gain favor with them by helping in some way. You could ambush a different guard wearing the same uniform, knock him unconscious or kill him and then put on his uniform as a disguise. You could attempt to be stealthy and sneak past the guards or create a diversion to get the guards to leave their post. The point being: you are not limited to only a few options presented in a dialogue box. How you go about something is totally up to you and finding creative solutions is encouraged. The devs consider this to be an important aspect of roleplaying.

But it also chimes with something I've been pondering a lot lately, why can't one of the systems in a RPG be an accurate or complex societal structure in which the player can participate, advance or fall? Crime, NPC behavioural responses, status, access or loss of various benefits, all kinds of systems that occasionally appear in RPGs but are always detached from eachother could be modelled under the one larger, comprehensible, real world mirroring system. Why not add a deep social interaction sim to our hacking & slashing?

It sounds like you've just described how things will work in SG. ;)
 
Yes, Madoc is always straightforward and honest. He doesn't attempt to give vague PR nonsense responses and he puts a lot of thought into what he says. It also helps that he knows exactly what currently is or isn't possible in the game since he's written all the code himself.

It's definitely the major bonus of the indie scene that developers get to pursue their vision of a game as closely as feasibly possible, without undue influence from extraneous sources.

Seriously looking forward to this game.
 
New Kickstarter update: LINK

This update is about the beta launch of Exanima but first we think we should address the elephant in the room. Why the lack of updates? What's happening with the game's development?

Let's be honest here, when we came to Kickstarter we didn't know what we were getting into, not so much in terms of development but everything else. We were excited about making the game and naive about many realities. We saw ourselves as indie devs promising to do a lot of cool new things that people would share our enthusiasm for. Our plan was to focus on the game's most unique qualities, release it and then continue work on it indefinitely after release, improving and expanding it. What we soon realised is that most people were not so willing to forgive a few flaws for the sake of the game's virtues. We would be subject to harsh criticism on all fronts and where we showed ability and quality these would only serve to make them expected everywhere. Sui Generis does not present itself as a humble game and expectations were sky high.

Our focus almost immediately shifted from just developing the game to improving everything and responding to criticism so that people would not prematurely dismiss the game. It is a very unconventional game, one that can't be described with what are usually the biggest selling points. It's unfamiliar and people don't know if they want it, they will more easily compare it to what they know and fixate it on flaws rather than understand its unique potential. This was further reinforced by our first alpha releases, our alpha backers were in large part people who believed in and understood the game but a lot of people who knew less about what they were getting into and what the game aimed to achieve were, at least initially, not as impressed.

Does this mean we've bowed to criticism and let it change our game? No. We've listened to what meant improving on what we already had, whether it was making animations more fluid and lifelike, controls more responsive, armour designs more realistic or whatever reflected our own desires for the game. It seems there's endless room for improvement and as something approaches perfection any flaws only become more apparent. For a small team with limited resources working on such an already ambitious project this has proved to be a gargantuan challenge and incredibly time consuming. Doing things well just takes a lot of time and some of Sui Generis' more ambitious and experimental features are incredibly difficult to do "well".

Is this overall a bad thing? We think not. Without so much scrutiny and feedback early in development the game would never be as good. It has evolved from something experimental and rough around the edges to something very refined. But it has been taking a lot longer. It has had the unfortunate consequence that with the game being constantly subject to new iterations and dramatic improvements we became reluctant to show it in its incomplete state. Recent months have also been a constant cycle of feedback and us making improvements, something that is not very meaningful to those that haven't experienced the game. Our insider forum is a busy place where there is constant and meaningful interaction with us developers, now we are opening the gates to this interaction for all of you.

WHAT IS THE EXANIMA BETA?

We call it a beta but really this is more indicative of what tier of backer has access to it than anything else. We've reached a level of quality and functionality that we're happy with, we've used our alpha testing period to refine core gameplay and weed out all the bugs we could find. Exanima is a prelude to a game that is still in development and our focus has been on getting the most fundamental things right and solve any issues before we start piling on more features.

The purpose of Exanima is to give all of you something to play and provide feeback on as we complete development of Sui Generis. It is also designed as a standalone game that we can release to raise further funds for the final stretch of development. It is designed as a slice of Sui Generis. It is set in the same world some 20 years earlier, it tries to convey the existence of this world beyond it and the events taking place at this time are of some importance. You could see Exanima as what a long trip into the underworld in Sui Generis might be like, we have been faithful to it in every regard.

Despite all of this it is important to remember that while Exanima could be seen as a slice of SG as an actual game it doesn't have much in common with it. It's made from the same ingredients but follows a completely different recipe. More importantly we've prepared the finest dough and baked it to perfection but we're still adding the final icing that will make it taste delicious.

Given the kind of criticism we've been subject to in the past this could be considered risky. We've been accused of focusing too much on technology and not enough on the game, an accusation that frankly we consider utterly ridiculous. In order to make exactly the game we wanted we had to develop all the technology, games are made with technology and it's all about the game. This means a lot of very large scale development goals are the reality we are confronted with. Implementing the complete gameplay front-end to this is hugely important, perhaps more important than anything else but considering what we actually had to do and implement, it is trivial. We're not saying the design of the gameplay is trivial, only its implementation.

We are as you know including all the trappings of an RPG, it is a genre that we love, we are crystal clear on what we want here and it's something we take very seriously. But we've often described ours as "world first design", what we want above all else is a world that feels real and is incredibly dynamic with an unprecedented potential for emergent behaviour. This includes complete interactivity, realistic and functional behaviours, meaning attributed to every single thing, AI making real decisions rather than following rigid scripts, physics, lighting and basically just everything being part of a real functional world rather than being symbolic of it.

So, while we hope that Exanima succeeds in conveying at least the spirit of SG please bear in mind that it is far from feature complete, there are many details and big gameplay features still missing that are hugely important to your enjoyment of the game. Despite this the game does already provide a very enjoyable and rewarding experience. More features will be coming in fast, just in the past two weeks we've added a really large amount of new and important content and features and made countless improvements. Expect the game to improve dramatically in the near future. We've been battling giants all this time and now we're just breezing through development.

In past updates we've also talked about the care we were putting into many things such as interaction, animation, the inventory system, sound, combat AI, pathfinding and many other things. Now you can see how serious we are about doing all these things right. It's easy not to notice these things but that means we've done our job well.

Finally, please note that the game has a very steep learning curve and does not yet include a tutorial. Be sure to read the user guide accessible from the main menu, experiment with the game and learn to play it. There's a lot to the game that is not immediately obvious so take your time in discovering it.

GAMEPLAY VIDEO AND NDA LIFTED

We've put a quick gameplay video up so you can all see some of the game in action. This is not a trailer intended to demonstrate features but just something to give you some idea of its current state. The footage is actually a bit out of date, but you should be seeing more recent and complete videos from players as this version is not under NDA.

 
Now that the NDA is lifted I'm watching beta backers play the game for the first time and it's hilarious! People are going into the game expecting it to be just like every other RPG they've played before and it makes for some pretty funny situations. I think the biggest hurdle is for people to forget everything they know about RPG's and to approach things in a different way; the game mechanics are very intuitive but also have more complexity than people are used to seeing in RPG's.

The most common first impressions seem to be "OMG, it's so hard!" and "wow, you can do that?". Good times and it's fun seeing how different people attempt to do things :). Overall people seem to be loving the beta (once they learn some of the basics since the game has a pretty steep learning curve) and they appreciate the new and refreshing approach Bare Mettle has taken.
 
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Some of my arena fights in Exanima... I'm picking on people while wearing nothing but diapers :troll:



---------- Updated at 01:31 AM ----------

And a video I created to help some people who were struggling; I was demonstrating some basic two-handed sword tactics:

 
Exanima is going through the Steam greenlight process. If anyone is interested in the game then it could use all the "Yes" votes people are willing to give ;). Here are some screenshots they posted on the Steam page of the current build:





 
Do you have a link to the greenlight page to vote. Though I think, they should go on gog as well. ;)

Oops! I posted the link in the "General Videogame" thread but forgot to post it here. Here's the LINK.

They want to sell the game on GOG as well and they'll also have a DRM free copy which can be purchased and downloaded directly from the Bare Mettle Entertainment site. For now they're just using Steam as a way to get more publicity and to raise awareness of the game since they don't have a lot of funds to spend on PR and advertising :).
 
So... I don't know how it happened exactly, but I awoke a few weeks ago after a nights sleep disturbed by the vaguest unease hovering at the edge of my subconscious, on wakened reflection I realised it was a sense of inadequacy, all neon & gnawing, but wherefore had this confidence sucking miasma arose? It's been a long time since I;ve faced failure repeatedly as a Nameless Hollow, or even extreme challenge as a Whirlwind of Rage & Steel (vanilla faction)... exposure to failure or above-average challenge is almost unheard of in todays risk-adverse world !

Wait... theres a new icon on my desktop... hmm "Exanima"... I wonder if that might explain my nightmares, sudden onset claustrophobia, and bloody hands?

(In case its not clear as far as this game is concerned I've gone from an enthusiastic bystander to an Actual Adventurer in a fantasy world, literally, great way to spend a week too).
 
So Exanima is the new name for Sui Generis?

Sorry, I haven't been on these forums much lately (busy playing and streaming Exanima). It looks like Reptile answered your question but for those too lazy to click a link and read :)P) I'll answer it again: Exanima is the prelude to Sui Generis which takes place 20 years before Sui Generis. Exanima and Sui Generis are two completely separate games. Exanima plays more like a dungeon crawler (takes place in the Underworld) whereas Sui Generis will be a fully open world game where you can go anywhere and do anything you like, and it will not be limited to just the Underworld.

Here are some things that will be added to Exanima in the upcoming months:

• Per session and global character skill progression
• Large non-linear main game following early content
• Build and permanently save characters by completing early content
• New encounters, items and environments
• Ranged combat and new close quarter manoeuvres
• Numerous moddable thaumaturgic powers
• More complete arena game modes featuring outdoor arenas
• Complex NPC interactions and dialogue
• Cooperative and competitive LAN multiplayer (possibly online play too if latency isn't an issue with the physics)
 
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I love the atmosphere and lighting. Having a tough time with the controls.

Most people take a few hours or sometimes days for the control scheme to become muscle memory since it has character relative movement instead of screen relative like most people are accustomed to. But once you learn to use it well then it allows more precise control of your character and things will flow better.

A few tips to make it easier:

-don't try to force the camera to always be behind your character and learn to fight from all angles. The only time the camera should be adjusted is if your view is obstructed.

-practice fighting and basic movement in the arena before hopping into the dungeon; practice dodging in and out of attack range without attacking the opponent, practice parrying an opponent's attacks without attacking the opponent, practice circling around the opponent using the strafing keys, and lastly practice combining all of this while attacking. Doing this should teach you the basics and it'll become muscle memory in about an hour's worth of practice.

-in the dungeon choose your fights wisely and don't fight until you've found a good weapon and armor. Most of the zombies are neutral unless provoked; don't approach them in combat mode and give them some space until they become accustomed to your presence. If you do get aggro don't be afraid to run away and close a door since zombies do not know how to open doors.
 
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