With the exception of a chance of interrupt, as well as some weird placement issues like where you are standing in relationship to opponents and walls/objects causing a "stand there uselessly and get beat to death" bug, it looks to me as if group sword skills do more damage then any skill or other technique to any type of opponent except in a 1v1 situation. Landing a lvl 4 combo is is almost always a 1 hit kill for anything short of a boss/trophy. I've been playing medium, with str and dex maxed, using aard and igni for crowd control to sort of reset my group stance so as to get hits. That "circle of death" lvl 5 trap skill though seems very nice, would like to see that in action.
Do you mean that the silver sword doesn't work equally well on non monster npcs as it does on monster npcs?Syvere said:
I agree with the OP on the signs. the other signs other than Aard and Igni seem to be almost an afterthought in comparison to these 2 more "useful" signs. Aard is useful for me up to the point you receive the special sign/attack combo skill for fast silver. As the OP mentioned I don't see much point in maxing it out right away. Igni is more useful maxxed.As for combat styles I highly disagree with the OP. Group is by far the most useful combat style. Keep in mind that the more enemies you have in attack range the higher your DPS (dmg per second) becomes. You don't notice much usefulness with Group style until you have 4 or more enemies around you. This is why (especially if i'm in a big open area) I tend to run around like a chicken with it's head cut off and get a huge train of monsters. Once I have a good amount of bastards behind me I will generally Igni 'em and get a nice BBQ started. Then commence the group attack. Now, no matter what you're fighting as long as there are 4+ of em around you they should start droppin like flies. Once there are 3 of em or so left smack em down with Aard. The rest is history.I consider strong style to be second best only because you need it for the tougher more heavily armored foes. I really suffered against echinopes (flower monsters) because I had a lousy strong attack. I corrected this in my second build and noticed a vast improvement upon beefing up my silver tier Strong line.Fast attack just doesn't strike me as being particularly worthwhile to max out. The +Pain is ok, as the OP said, for crowd control, but also as the OP says this is already a part of Igni which you should max anyway. You can also rune/meteor your swords for +Pain. Plus let's face it: Most of the guys you take out with Fast are weaker rogue types that Igni/Aard will ruin anyways. Strong seems to carry you better through the game against stronger enemies and Group has far more utility than Strong and especially Fast. I didn't even mention Group's awesome Knockdown ability or the Igni stack on Silver Group. But I guess I just did, but I'll leave that for y'all to figure out. 
That's my 2 cents.
That's my 2 cents.The 40% damage bonus against blind targets that you can get with Fast Attack wouldn't be bad because one of the signs has a blinding upgrade dedicated to Fast Attack. I say "wouldn't be" because I've not been able to get it to work. :-\Otherwise, Fast Style with its 100% attack (never misses) is mainly useful at the start of the game when low dexterity keeps you from landing hits in the other styles.PhelanKA7 said:
I would agree that the game seems pretty well balanced, so that you shouldn't get in any drastic trouble by putting (or not putting) skills in a certain area. In general when choosing which skills to put points in you should consider under what circumstances the skills occur, and if you are in those circumstances enough to warrant using a point on it. Power up the skills you use the most, and skills that remain effective under all conditions first. Avoid the skills marked "only works when" until you filled up the other skills that interest you and you find yourself in the "only" situations quite often. For example in the bronze category (which you'll get plenty of coins for anywayVisVenti said:
):Skills to avoid or hold off on:STR related:Only works when intoxicated: Buzz, Only works when less than 25% vitality: True Grit (and requires consumption of a mutagen)Position: Parry provides 10% boost (not a very large boost)DEX related:Repel: provides 10% boost (not a very large boost)Predator: Requires consumption of a mutagen & only works from midnight to dawn (even though the 50% boosts to attack and dodge are nice - you may want to invest in skills like this later in the game, but not starting out).Mutation: requires a mutagen, and increases toxicity in the bodyIgni related:Harms Way I: provides a 10% bonus (not very large boost), while the same one skill point could be put in Harms Way II which provides a 20% boostStrong Steel related: Bloody Rage I (and II): Only works when vitality below 15% (by that time your almost dead )Fast Steel related:Sever Sinews I (and II): Only works when enemy's vitality is below 25% (by that time he/she/it is almost dead )Group Steel related:Trip I (and II) works only when fighting at least three opponents (if you're using a lot of signs they you are probably limiting your enemies to less in direct contact with you)(again this is a skill you might want to add later, but not when first starting out, and you might want to go with level II before I).Strong Silver relatedatinado I (and II) only works when enemy is effected by Incineration. If you are constantly using Ingi and have incineration then it may be worthwhile (once again you might want to get level III (silver skill) before level II,and that before level I).Fast Silver related:Sinister I, II, and III (only works when enemy is blinded, and the higher level ones can be obtained the prerequisite of the lower level ones).Group Silver related:Knockdown: only works when fighting three or more opponents at a time.With Sword skills it is usually more worthwhile to put them into level skills (which more than double your damage over the previous level) than in skills that add 15% or 25% more damage. For example going from Level I Strong Steel to Level II Strong Steel goes from 20-30 damage to 40-80 damage while that same skill point used in crushing blow in the Strong Steel tree would have only increased damage by 5-6 points and 10-20 (at level II).The Sign Student, Apprentice, Specialist, etc in many cases may be a waste of skill points (with the exception of Aard which gives you a larger degree of effect).Sliver Skills I'd advise holding off on include: Survival Instinct (only works when bleeding), Finesse (only works when using Fast sword combat), Altered Metabolism (only works when poisoned by potion), Blasting Fist (only works with Strong Sliver sword attacks), Burning Blade (only works with Group Silver), Faze (only works with Fast sliver attack), Bloody Rage III (only works when below 15% vitality - aka almost dead and Strong Steel), Sever Sinews III (only works when below 25% vitality and using fast steel), Trip III (only works with Group Steel, Patinado III (only works with Incineration active and strong silver), Sinister III (only when enemy blinded, and only with Fast Silver), Knockdown III (only works when fighting three opponents and group silver).There's a very common misunderstanding about the sword skill enhancements available at each level. The player only causes the damage shown at a given level while executing that attack in the sequence. For instance, whenever you manage to do the third attack in an uninterrupted sword attack sequence then you will score damage and effects in accordance with the enhancements you've made to the Level III attack. So, if you go with Trip II before Trip I then you will not have a chance at tripping the target until you've successfully executed at least 2 sword attacks in sequence.AvidGamer said:Group Steel related:Trip I (and II) works only when fighting at least three opponents (if you're using a lot of signs they you are probably limiting your enemies to less in direct contact with you)(again this is a skill you might want to add later, but not when first starting out, and you might want to go with level II before I).Strong Silver related
I'm almost in vizima (i had to start over) and i'm level 7.I invested in Strong steel a fair bit and I see that there is crushing blow and cut at the jugular.Are those active skills or are they passive?If they are passive what skills are active?
Passive.The level 4 ability in each style and the signs are active.
Seems to me from this thread that no-one really uses signs other than Aard and Igni, myself included. Is there anyone who uses any of the other signs (i.e. MORE than Aard/Igni) and in which situations? Though I must say I'm considering stopping using Igni, since it's almost too powerful...
I use Yrden traps all the time. Usually, they can be set before starting a fight which allows you to recharge their endurance cost - in other words, they effectively cost nothing. The poison, blinding and stupor enhancements are together very powerful. I'd not recommend getting Yrden's special power up attack for two reasons; the effect can much more easily, quickly and cheaply be replaced by a bomb and there seems to be a bug that activates the special attack (at twice the endurance cost!) when all you've tried to do is plant a trap. I can't wait to reach the level 5 Yrden and try out the Ring of Death. ;DBesides Yrden, Aard is the only other sign that I've upgraded fully across all its silver enhancements.I tried Axii and ALL its silver enhancements. Unfortunately, I found it to be such a complete waste of talents that I reverted my character 14 levels back (31 to 17) to get rid of it. At Axii level 4 with an additional 150% sign intensity boost it still failed to hex simple wyverns or devourers around 40% of the time. Furthermore, it casts like a very slow moving line-of-sight projectile that often misses its target entirely. And when you do hex a distant target does he start fighting with his friends? No!! He immediately runs over to you so he can stand at your side, usually pulling all his angry friends along with him. By the time he reaches you the hex has worn off and he joins his buddies against you. :-\I've only upgraded Qen across all its bronze enhancements except for the special attacks. I plan to save up a set of talent to see how the special attack does at cleaving off massive chunks of health from some of the late game bosses. Not there yet. I enjoy gathering large mobs around Geralt and then slaying them with a few swings in Group Style. Even a low level of Qen protection makes this quite a simple and risk-free strategy. Also, if you plan to drop Yrden traps in the thick of combat you'll likely need a shot of Qen to keep from being interrupted. Otherwise, its uses seem fairly limited.Btw, I may be one of the few who have not enhanced Igni beyond level 2 (yet). Apparently, it's intensity does not increase with level and for the increased endurance cost I didn't really need to broaden its attack angle. However, I did invest in its ranged special attack which reaches plenty far at level 2.majestic said:Seems to me from this thread that no-one really uses signs other than Aard and Igni, myself included. Is there anyone who uses any of the other signs (i.e. MORE than Aard/Igni) and in which situations? Though I must say I'm considering stopping using Igni, since it's almost too powerful...
"In ancient times true warriors first made themselves invulnerable and then looked for weaknesses in enemy."This is what I call the essence of Quen."The art of war teaches us not to rely on likehood of enemy coming, but on our own readines to recieve him"Yrden brings yuo superior ground where ever yuo go. For "If yuo know yuor self and yuor enemy, victory shal not stand in doubt; If yuo know Heaven and Earth yuor victory maybe comple.""In all fighting, the direct method can be used for joining in battle, but indirect are needed to secure victory."The non-damaging Aard perhapsepitomizes most this."In battle there are no more than two methods of attack -the direct and the indirect. Yet these two in combination give rise to endless series of manuovers."Quen can be used to get of Aard or Yrden secondary attacks. As Quen doesn't discharce before actuall attack.
Yes Quen is very pratical, I raised it quickly to level 4 to get a longer time. It is stopped when you attack but also by a time limit. I like using it at beginning of some battle or when I need use some potion during a battle.Igni with Strong Silver Patinado is very efficient.Aard is eventually the more interesting to mix with sword fighting but it can be very powerful. I recently got a fight against a lesser vampire, don't remember the name. Not far from the battle there was an energy point I used. I get near the vampire, used Aard, vampire down, one hit, a final blow, vampire dead. After that quest log was mentioning a very tough battle!