The Forlorn Hope: Cyberpunk Off-Topic

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Snowflakez;n10323532 said:
That your cat?

No, but turns out that is a real cat with a weird face so I'd like to post it here for no reason.

Raxaphan;n10323612 said:
It's her undercover CP identity. She likes to bite deep into the lore.

You're telling me that's me with a cat mask? Absolute nonsense, I would never do that.
 
Snowflakez;n10323312 said:
To your second statement, as long as they have decent viewership and signed up ages ago, they could probably go if they wanted to. Never heard of them before, though.

Gopher is pretty notable youtuber (he has more subscribers then YongYea) for his modding related videos and playthroughs of interesting story mods, in which he mostly focuses on Bethesda's games like Fallout 3/4 (but also New Vegas) and Skyrim, but he also makes a let's plays for other games, including Witcher games, which he is a huge fan of and he is also very excited for Cyberpunk 2077. His let's plays are always thorough, he explores as much as he can, tries to be immersive as possible (for example, he never uses fast travel unless it's absolutely necessary and disables most of the marks on the map, so he could discover all the important places himself) and tries to put himself into a mindset of character he plays (no matter if it's character created by him or already established, like Geralt). Also he was already invited to previous events regarding Witcher 3 and Blood and Wine. Christopher Odd is also similar in his approach to try and explore the game as much as he's able to, is a huge Witcher fan and excited for Cyberpunk plus he is not far behind YongYea when it comes to number of subscribers. I think he was invited for Blood and Wine event, but he couldn't go, because of his job.
 
Cyberpunk 2077's success may crush Bethesda and any other RPG on its path

Cyberpunk 2077 will be different than The Witcher. And Cyberpunk 2077 might sell so much that it will affect many gaming companies in the industry, including Bethesda.

Games made by Bethesda might be popular because of their levels of freedom. In Witcher 3 players had to roleplay as Geralt. But if Cybepunk 2077 starts to adopt the same level of "doing what you want with the character you want" then Bethesda and CDPR will start competing against each other toe to toe. And that's a bad thing, for Bethesda:


1) Bethesda has one successfull formulae when making games: open world RPGs that allow players to have full freedom, as Todd Howard himself says:

Todd Howard's Time interview after Skyrim was released as shown below:



2) Witcher 3 had freedom but not that much freedom since you had to roleplay as Geralt. But with Cyberpunk 2077, CDPR might start giving players that freedom of "playing as the character you want and doing what you want" which is present in Bethesda games:

This might be evidenced by CP2077 official blog mentioning Skyrim's open world as their inspiration for making CP2077 + Iwinski's insterest for Fallout 4 in the pic below:


It might also be evidenced by Marcin Iwinski saying back in 2012 that in Cyberpunk 2077 "You'll be able to play the character you want and to customize the character you want. That's a big change from The Witcher and that makes perfect sense for a Cyberpunk game."

He says it at 05:00:

3) Bethesda games sell quite well. That's because that freedom of doing what you want and with the character you want is what MOST people want when playing RPGs and because no one else in the industry makes that. Bethesda have lilttle to no competition but this might be about to end.

Witcher 3 also sold well, but not as well as Bethesda. So if CDPR adopts that kind of freedom in CP2077 then both companies will sell equally good right? Wrong. Bethesda uses an outdated engine with an outdated graphics, because of this alone Cyberpunk 2077 might break the gaming industry standards for games, but it will certainly break how the public sees RPGs made by Bethesda and Bioware. My point is, that games made by Bethesda might be fun because of their freedom, but if Cybepunk 2077 has the same level of character and world freedom (which it will) then Bethesda and CDPR will start competing against each other toe to toe.

When Cyberpunk 2077 comes out, it might make us gamers compare both companies, and one of them has a far superior polished engine with next gen graphics. That may drastically affect Cyberpunk 2077 sales and its competitors.

 
I doubt it would crush Bethesda, but it may very well crush BioWare. If CP2077 is released sooner than Anthem (or whatever their next game is called), and the latter turns out to be a disappointment and commercial failure (again after ME:A) because of comparisons to Cyberpunk, I can see EA closing BioWare. At least Bethesda is independent and Fallout 4 has been a commercial success, even if outsold by The Witcher 3 on PC.

It also remains to be seen if CP2077 manages to achieve the same level of freedom as Bethesda's games (that is, assuming CDPR even want that), while at the same time not giving up anything that made Witcher 3 good. This would actually be quite an accomplishment.
 
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Well, personally I don't like the way of freedom Bethesda is doing. I can go anywhere, I can join any faction, in anytime. but that's it. It feels so empty

because It's not organic. most of the quests, factions, npcs are separated. they don't affect each other, so I can't feel immersed. all of my actions are just like the air.

I don't want CDPR follows this way.. instead, I want story-focused freedom like Fallout:NV or Deus Ex or VTMB..

I think this approach is more limited about freedom aspect than Bethesda's way, but feels more organic and natural.

But I agree CP2077 will be more comparable to Bethesda than The Witcher 3 haha

(Sorry for my poor english. I'm Korean.. :()
 
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sv3672;n10353352 said:
I doubt it would crush Bethesda, but it may very well crush BioWare. If CP2077 is released sooner than Anthem (or whatever their next game is called)

Topping Bioware shouldn't be hard at this point. They haven't been making good games in ages. And wasn't Anthem just an action game (I mean, not even an RPG, so is it even "competition")?

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Personally I'm a tad ashamed to admit, that while I'm not jumping up and down, I have a bit higher expectations for Obsidian's mystery title - or, not necessarily "higher", but more.... 'reliable' for it not having a baggage on its shoulders that just might be a bit too heavy in the end, like CP2020 - if only for being headed by the guys that also made Fallout, Arcanum and VtMB. There are so many variables with CP2077, so much uncertainty about the general direction and expectations for meeting with 2020, and CDPR only has three games (the only ones to draw references from) under their sleeve, none of which I'm a huge fan of (as RPG's) even if I don't hate them.
 
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How is this about Cyberpunk 2077 and not just a Bethesda sucks/CDPR rocks thread? No. Off to Forlorn Hope. This be Bar Talk.
 
I agree with you, Lis, for the most part and I too am very excited. But some amount of skepticism is warranted. We really, honestly, truly have no clue what form the game will take. All we have right now is "XYZ is more/less likely than ABC because Reasons 1-3."

For instance, character creation is likely based on what we know... but it's not confirmed. Same deal with flying vehicles, this "Tactical mode" thing and countless other features we've all discussed for the past several months.

If stealth is in the game, maybe you can only use it during very specific encounters.

If flying vehicles are in the game, maybe you can only use them for one, maybe two missions.

If character creation is in, maybe you can only change your appearance, and not your class, role or anything else. Maybe you won't even be able to choose your own name, maybe it'll be like playing Shephard in Mass Effect.

All we can do is weigh probabilities, unfortunately. The game could end up being exactly the opposite of what many of us want.
 
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Whatever CP2077 ends up being, please no "Bethesda freedom". It's not freedom, it's just untied ends, a busy work writers, scripters and quest designers forgot to do. Player can be a member of any guild? Reputation system and stat checks tied to progression in ranks (also cut) that B*thesda scripters didn't bother to do and instead pushed Pete Hines to shitpost at twatter. Guild progression is a series of quests, now just boiled down to dungeon walking simulation? B*thesda writers lost their inspiration, B*thesda quest designers decided to take a week off and B*thesda team leads busy fapping to /y/ while level designers were told to place more dungeons on the map. Radiant quests - not a just busy work for players until they, well, work their way to rise in ranks and get to guild's politics (because there's none since it's never planned to be written and scripted *Todd waving his middle finger*) but now legit quests? Insert something extremely offensive and insulting.
 
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metalmaniac21;n10355542 said:
Whatever CP2077 ends up being, please no "Bethesda freedom". It's not freedom, it's just untied ends, a busy work writers, scripters and quest designers forgot to do. Player can be a member of any guild? Reputation system and stat checks tied to progression in ranks (also cut) that B*thesda scripters didn't bother to do and instead pushed Pete Hines to shitpost at twatter. Guild progression is a series of quests, now just boiled down to dungeon walking simulation? B*thesda writers lost their inspiration, B*thesda quest designers decided to take a week off and B*thesda team leads busy fapping to /y/ while level designers were told to place more dungeons on the map. Radiant quests - not a just busy work for players until they, well, work their way to rise in ranks and get to guild's politics (because there's none since it's never planned to be written and scripted *Todd waving his middle finger*) but now legit quests? Insert something extremely offensive and insulting.

Yeah, it's definitely a different kind of game. Bethesda's Elder Scrolls games since Oblivion (and to a much lesser degree, Morrowind) have always been a different type of RPG than others on the market. They have never tried to be anything other than what they are.

In my mind, it's neither good nor bad. I've played Skyrim for well over 1200 hours at this point, and there's a reason for that. Yes, it's not super cohesive and the side quests aren't particularly engaging. But the world is immersive and it just feels good to play.

For the record, I completely and totally agree with everything you said. But none of that, to me, is the mark of a bad game. It's the mark of a different game, one where absolute player freedom is held in higher regard than anything else. If that's not your cup of tea, that's fine, and I 100% agree that I don't want it in 2077 - again, different types of games.

But I also wouldn't mind if Bethesda kept the same formula for their Elder Scrolls games and just added new mechanics, fixed bugs and redid their engine. Controversial opinion, I know, but if I want a really good story-driven RPG, I don't play Bethesda games. I play CDPR games, or Obsidian games, or -- until the past few entries -- Bioware games.

This is the thing many people don't understand, I think. There is room for all types of games in the industry. It would be tremendously dull if every single game out there was a CDPR RPG, or a Bethesda RPG, or a Bioware RPG... Everyone has their own style that they return to, and it doesn't click with everyone.

Now, Fallout, on the other hand... Bethesda really dropped the ball there. They try to make them more story focused and tied down to their roots, but they have failed. That's why I only played Fallout 4 for a couple hundred hours (still a lot of playtime, to be fair...), though I got a lot more time out of New Vegas.
 
Bondaebu;n10353402 said:
Well, personally I don't like the way of freedom Bethesda is doing. I can go anywhere, I can join any faction, in anytime. but that's it. It feels so empty, because It's not organic. Most of the quests, factions, npcs are separated. they don't affect each other, so I can't feel immersed. all of my actions are just like the air.

Yeah, I respect Bethesda for what they've been able to accomplish with the Elder Scrolls series, but I seriously can't keep playing these games. It feels so lifeless somehow; I can't connect with the characters or the world. I spent more than 150 hours in Oblivion (it was a great game), but I felt so disconnected. I just couldn't continue playing the game in the end. It was kind of depressing. Skyrim had the same problem, but I couldn't handle more than about 50 hours for that game.

I prefer a more restrictive hub system with greater focus on character interaction and story. It feels so much more alive.

Deus Ex or Mass Effect are great examples of this.
 
Neuronin;n10376272 said:
Yeah, I respect Bethesda for what they've been able to accomplish with the Elder Scrolls series, but I seriously can't keep playing these games. It feels so lifeless somehow; I can't connect with the characters or the world. I spent more than 150 hours in Oblivion (it was a great game), but I felt so disconnected. I just couldn't continue playing the game in the end. It was kind of depressing. Skyrim had the same problem, but I couldn't handle more than about 50 hours for that game.

I prefer a more restrictive hub system with greater focus on character interaction and story. It feels so much more alive.

Deus Ex or Mass Effect are great examples of this.

God, please no. I hope CDPR doesn't use either of those games as examples.
 
Snowflakez;n10376312 said:
God, please no. I hope CDPR doesn't use either of those games as examples.

I don't want CDPR to imitate those games exactly, but I do want them to emulate the great character interaction in Mass Effect, as well as the freedom of choice in Deus Ex.
 
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