The graphics

+
I challenge anyone to find a major development title that did not "downgrade" graphics at some point in the production cycle.
Metro Exodus+God Of War (2018). Both are big titles and both are upgraded from their E3 versions. Downgrading is not well tolerated by people. If you can't do any stuff, just don't show that stuff. Simple as that.

Normalizing downgrade won't help people who doubt buying game nor devs.
 
Metro Exodus+God Of War (2018). Both are big titles and both are upgraded from their E3 versions. Downgrading is not well tolerated by people. If you can't do any stuff, just don't show that stuff. Simple as that.

Normalizing downgrade won't help people who doubt buying game nor devs.

Then, people complain because there's no news and they don't get to see anything for years on end. It also squelches publicity, energy, and support. Complaints no matter what, so I fully support sharing WiP.

But that also requires the audience to become more familiar with the way such huge projects work -- not to count chickens before the eggs have even been laid. You mention two titles that are arguably better than their E3 versions. Can't speak to God of War (except for the final version being gorgeous). I can truthfully say that I disagree about Metro. I feel the overall world lighting as well as the animations for NPCs looked better in the first few vids that were released, but I also think the first one (the bear chasing Artyom and the train rescue) was a completely scripted scene (concept of gameplay, not actual gameplay). Graphics often have to be scaled back universally (at least a bit), or it takes a mega-powerhouse PC to come close to the detail seen in demos.

In the end, this is why CDPR has gone to great lengths to say, "...everything is subject to change." Oft and repeatedly. And we haven't seen the final version yet. Maybe it will be better.

(Realistically, I think visuals in this demo look both solid and believeable for a game with an open world on this scale. I also think the lighting / shaders may not be as crisp as they'll wind up being in the end. But I'm just speculating.)
 
Great analysis. Highly recommend you guys watch this.


in this video they said that new gameplay looks much better in person, and it was confirmed that youtube video was compressed bad

also 99% people who saw whole 1 hour of new gameplay said that is more impressive than E3 2018

lets give CDPR faith, if anyone deserved it, they did
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Juist noticed, the deep dive video has this in the description.

1567545220238.png
 
Sometimes, you've gotta kill your darlings.

never... NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Post automatically merged:

I know this one. I remember it. But this isn't it. This is too long.

But it sounds like it... could have been fake.
I also vaguely remember hearing about it in a youtube video. It was something recent.
Post automatically merged:

Great analysis. Highly recommend you guys watch this.
That's really interesting, I like how they explain some of the things.
Post automatically merged:

I agree. As much as it's difficult to optimize, devs should start with current gen consoles and NOT with high-end PC specs.
Yes, but actually no, and the reason why is that (while I do agree with you and dogukans) that building it on the pc platform first (for technical reasons, not fan-wars reasons) makes for easier development because it's easier to make adjustments after vs doing it another way, but I get what you mean.
Post automatically merged:

Then, people complain because there's no news and they don't get to see anything for years on end. It also squelches publicity, energy, and support. Complaints no matter what, so I fully support sharing WiP.
I support sharing work in progress too, that's always good and fun and allows for lots of feedback and just good healthy hype, but I rather that people complain about lack of news when a game comes out surprisingly good graphics top quality, than complain about late news after the fact when it's a finished product that basically says "yep that's a downgrade" out of nowhere as a surprise. And I agree but disagree simultaneously, If there are complaints no matter what, then doesn't it make the most sense to just do the right thing anyways no matter what? If someone complains no matter what I eat, I just go eat the salad anyway. funny example.


CDPR:

*munch munch munch*

Angry person: "STOP EATING HEALTH"


CDPR:


Lol
Post automatically merged:

in this video they said that new gameplay looks much better in person, and it was confirmed that youtube video was compressed bad
also 99% people who saw whole 1 hour of new gameplay said that is more impressive than E3 2018
lets give CDPR faith, if anyone deserved it, they did
I have agree, the video the made it to youtube did not survive the bumpy ride of bad internets Lol.
I would love to see the clean HD re-upload though. I trust CDPR, but I'm thirsty for more footage! :)
 
Last edited:
I support sharing work in progress too, that's always good and fun and allows for lots of feedback and just good healthy hype, but I rather that people complain about lack of news when a game comes out surprisingly good graphics top quality, than complain about late news after the fact when it's a finished product that basically says "yep that's a downgrade" out of nowhere as a surprise. And I agree but disagree simultaneously, If there are complaints no matter what, then doesn't it make the most sense to just do the right thing anyways no matter what? If someone complains no matter what I eat, I just go eat the salad anyway. funny example.

Oh-ho-ho...and even more, what's "the right thing"? Who decides that exactly? This is Art, not Science. There are no procedural steps in the end. No one can say, your painting / music / performance is "wrong". (That's what they tried to tell Shakespeare, Van Gogh, and The Beatles.) If I direct a musical, and we plan and rehearse this absolutely amazing, 15-minute finale at the end of Act I, and the news happens to do a quick spot on it -- that does not mean that I owe the audience that finale in the final production. Sharing that bit does not mean it's promised, regardless of how much people not involved in the production may love the tiny sliver we shared with them. Recognizing that, "It looked great!" does not mean people with that opinion understand everything else that goes into producing that show.

Plans may change. Once the rest of the show is staged, I may find that the Act I finale is throwing the pacing and energy out of whack. Maybe some of the costumes are ruined during rehearsals and can't be replaced. Maybe a few of the dancers are injured along the way, and have to quit the ensemble. Maybe the lighting specials we're using for it are putting a bit too much strain on the board. Perhaps the set just isn't practical enough for so much activity, and constantly repairing it is becoming a safety hazard. Whatever it happens to be, any number of things may not work out as planned, and it may force me to chop the finale down to 6 minutes.

That's the creative biz. The show must go on.
 
People always ask me, "What's in the box?" I get the question a lot. "Come on -- what's in the box!?" I won't tell them...but I'll tell you. Go on.
You can see what's IN THE BOX!!!
cool check failed, overwhelmed by curiosity... Damn, that box
is empty :eek:

OOPS! WE RAN INTO SOME PROBLEMS.

The requested thread could not be found.
Is it supposed to be that way... ?


Also, great text about "right and wrong" in art...
 
Oh-ho-ho...and even more, what's "the right thing"? Who decides that exactly? This is Art, not Science. There are no procedural steps in the end. No one can say, your painting / music / performance is "wrong".
Did you notice the salad/healthy food example I used? I mentioned the funny joke example from the perspective of CDPR implying that they have total control over what they believe is right and wrong and they choose what they do in the end, even if the angry cartoon man said "don't eat healthy", CDPR is like "call the cops I don't care!" and CDPR eats the salad anyway because CDPR knows their stuff, you know what I mean?
Post automatically merged:

Also, great text about "right and wrong" in art...
*face-palm*
My example is implying that CDPR defines their own "right" exactly because of the fact that it's their art. (why nobody see my example? :()
 
Juist noticed, the deep dive video has this in the description.

I suppose it explains some things.

I personally want to have ok graphics with good framerate. I want the gameplay to feel fluent enough to not bother me.
I am not looking for photographic graphics, even though I am 100% sure going to upgrade my graphics card before CP2077 hits.
 
I suppose it explains some things.

I personally want to have ok graphics with good framerate. I want the gameplay to feel fluent enough to not bother me.
I am not looking for photographic graphics, even though I am 100% sure going to upgrade my graphics card before CP2077 hits.

If you are interested, a video review by the graphics experts from Digital Foundry was quite insightful. Not just about the various unfortunate ways the video quality was reduced in the deep dive, but also regarding the techniques that were actually added since the 2018 demo, and their comparison to the apparently very crisp and sharp indoor Gamescom 2019 demo they watched just a week before.


Another interesting video to watch is the deep dive demo without twitch/youtube compression: Its still only 1080p with TAA, motion blur and DOF causing problems, but at least it has no extra compression artefacts - so it looks noticably better.

https://www.gamersyde.com/video_cyberpunk_2077_deep_dive_video-44116_en.html
(ideally the 3.8 GB download for no stream compression)
 
Last edited:
I never paid attention to graphics in any game to tell the truth, the overall aspect is what matters . Played lot of strategies focused games with shitty graphics but great core construction and game mechanics, story line etc..
There is so much aggressive marketing behind graphics and this is why many companies get away with premium prices with garbage story, game mechanics and core construction and every other abuse toward their market.
If you want a good game don't put so much thought on graphics, and don't get me wrong not that it doesn't matter but it should not be the main focus.
 
Last edited:
I am not much of a graphics nut (and didn't watch the video yet) but I still think the shadows in the demo (both demos really) lack definition, like there is too much ambient lighting. This is likely due to graphic settings rather than an issue with the game. I'd prefer things darker with more contrast. Currently it looks whitewashed with too bright lighting, which doesn't really make the graphics stand out from CP's rival games imo. There were also graphic effects present which arguably make the videos look worse - such as depth of field and motion blur. These we can 100% sure be able to disable once we get our hands on the game (at least on PC)..
 
The lighting is very different from the 2018 video, but it's also clarity and detail which were better in that vid. The overall impression from the deep dive video is that everything looks more bland and washed out. I wonder if they're still experimenting with the lighting tech.
 
Top Bottom