The lack of 3rd person view

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Its really only the epilogues. So 5(?) TPP cutscenes... Maybe you could also count the scene after the life path intro... 3 secs in the mirror...
I couldn't imagine the hotel room scene in Konpeki Plaza being as intense as it was if it was in done in third person with you and Jackie hiding inside that screen.
 
If I go to McDonalds and order a BigMac I am entitled to a BigMac with acceptable quality.
If some of the ingredients are missing or instead of beef I am served Tofu I am entitled to complain or even my money back.

You being the creepy guy at back whispering I should be grateful McDonalds had the graciousness to serve me dog doodoo as a meal for my money is neither here nor there.

Not that I would buy a Big Mac but if I did I would expect to get exactly what I knew it was going to be, a Big Mac and yea not Tofu. Thing is they did announce years before release it was going to be a First Person Game in General, so you did get your Big Mac and you were not sold Tofu going by what the game is if you carefully check online.

Unfortunately for you (and others) Cyberpunk 2077 was never intended to be sold as Tofu (third person), it was always going to be a Big Mac (first person) with or without some core components. There is one real issue with this though and it's sort of like the players who complained about finding PvP being in Fallout 76 and asking for refunds?

Did you follow any or even just a little of the online talk, gameplay videos, game site early comments or opinions/reviews. If you did you very likely knew you were buying a first person game, so I must ask, WHY did you buy it. I did because I found out it had first person and I got to admit I've hardly followed any hype on any game since Oblivion. I think I may have found out on the Beth Site in the Cyberpunk 2077 thread? The only place I ever read anything about the game in advance, didn't even watch any of the videos linked there.
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This is about the thrid person mode. CDPR never promised us a third person mode. Its like order a BigMac with beef, getting a BigMac with Beef and complaining because its with beef and not tofu.

This game has a lot of problems. Lack of third person is not one of them.

Bravo(y)

PS: I have no issue with those who believe 3rd view is better, I openly admit I can not understand that opinion not can I even play that way BUT we have our rights to our own opinions. I have never called 3rd person "Shit" just discussed preferences, this is the real problem, some players can not see the other sides viewpoint. I know many like 3rd, many can play both styles (lucky them). I openly admit in every conversation like this i can not play 3rd that well, I can not at all if I try with a console controller.

However I do not disrespect your preference, not do I say it's crap, I just can not understand how watching you character perform like in a film can feel immersive. I'm giving Assassin Creed Black Flag and Roque a trial as I got the two together for $10, playing Black Flag not too badly but there is no immersion, I'm watching the game. For me 1st person makes me even forget I'm watching it on a screen, I'm damn well in there doing it because that's what it looks like.

But I can go over the top with immersion, like looking at plants in real life wondering what potion I could make with them.;)
 
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Not that I would buy a Big Mac but if I did I would expect to get exactly what I knew it was going to be, a Big Mac and yea not Tofu. Thing is they did announce years before release it was going to be a First Person Game in General, so you did get your Big Mac and you were not sold Tofu going by what the game is if you carefully check online.

Unfortunately for you (and others) Cyberpunk 2077 was never intended to be sold as Tofu (third person), it was always going to be a Big Mac (first person) with or without some core components. There is one real issue with this though and it's sort of like the players who complained about finding PvP being in Fallout 76 and asking for refunds?

Did you follow any or even just a little of the online talk, gameplay videos, game site early comments or opinions/reviews. If you did you very likely knew you were buying a first person game, so I must ask, WHY did you buy it. I did because I found out it had first person and I got to admit I've hardly followed any hype on any game since Oblivion. I think I may have found out on the Beth Site in the Cyberpunk 2077 thread? The only place I ever read anything about the game in advance, didn't even watch any of the videos linked there.

The analogy I was making was this game in general but the reasoning for their first person view was "immersive" experience which has already been established as a complete and utter lie. The Big Mac was the most immersive city, thousands of NPC behaviors, most detailed city in gaming, decisions have consequences, and all the other lies people have spend many threads here pointing out.

Thats the tofu they tried to pass off as beef. This game is a complete and utter disaster and so far CDPR has not returned my money. Despite me asking for a refund days later after I realized what utter disappointment I was playing.
 
As an older player, I've been used to first person from the past. The fact that almost all guys play as a woman (apart from secret fantasies) is due to the view of one's own (now female) butt. A look at Nexus reveals the secret longings in the form of oversized breasts or butts, for example at Skyrim. As a gay man, I find it hard to understand this, as I am aiming to identify with the character in a role-playing game and not find my virtual self horny. So I think the decision to do everything in first person is good... You'll have Panam's backside, while we've only got a 70-year-old rocker who couldn't be more boring...
 
The analogy I was making was this game in general but the reasoning for their first person view was "immersive" experience which has already been established as a complete and utter lie. The Big Mac was the most immersive city, thousands of NPC behaviors, most detailed city in gaming, decisions have consequences, and all the other lies people have spend many threads here pointing out.

Thats the tofu they tried to pass off as beef. This game is a complete and utter disaster and so far CDPR has not returned my money. Despite me asking for a refund days later after I realized what utter disappointment I was playing.

Well I hope you get your refund, stick to your reasons and if the lack of third is one don't forget if it's not on the game box or in the official game description that it's only first person you have a case, apart from all the other reasons as well.

I came in with no expectations except it had first person instead of like Witcher 3, to the game itself I'm quite serious when I say I do not follow online hype. Either for the Dev and especially not with player predictions, I was only hoping it would be a game I could get into and try to pull away from Beth because IMO they no longer make AAA games either.

Fallout 76 is AA for want od something else to call it, on PC Cyberpunk is about the same for me. Only difference is I've played every Beth TES and Fallout so I really know their games. 2077 is totally different in almost every respect but it's fun which is what I can only call FO76, neither are immersive be first person or third the game will not allow it.

My biggest issue is freezes followed by a CTD, followed by something you mentioned 'NPC's', Beth may use far less but at least they are original. Sick of seeing the same NPC 3 times in 30 seconds, the same NPC pose (holding arm while walking) I had I think 5 of them within a small crowd at one time. I wonder if it would be less immersion breaking to reduce the NPC setting to minimum, I'm used to Beth having very few in a City and maybe I will not see the same ones constantly?

Seriously, despite differences in how we prefer to play, you deserve your refund the game is not upto spec at all. I found it cheap before release and it's only just got down that low again now so I'm not so pissed. In fact cheaper than I got Fallout 76 for and that was a far, far worse release than 2077 was for sure. FO76 has only just about reached were it should have been 2 years ago and it's still missing things they said was going to happen from way before it was even released?

PS: Just a thought, maybe if this unofficial leak on like a game 'rebuild' by June 2021 is even possibly true, it may have some future, that are open modding of course. Cheers.
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As an older player, I've been used to first person from the past. The fact that almost all guys play as a woman (apart from secret fantasies) is due to the view of one's own (now female) butt. A look at Nexus reveals the secret longings in the form of oversized breasts or butts, for example at Skyrim. As a gay man, I find it hard to understand this, as I am aiming to identify with the character in a role-playing game and not find my virtual self horny. So I think the decision to do everything in first person is good... You'll have Panam's backside, while we've only got a 70-year-old rocker who couldn't be more boring...

Funny that as I obviously prefer first but I have always played females since early TES days. They had better agility? and seemed to move faster which was the game itself, Skyrim changed that to all be the same but they still seem faster to me???

I only swap to a Male if I've died too many times as a female and sort of feel maybe a change will break my run of bad luck. Oh that's because I play Dead is Dead once I'm into the flow of almost all games, not sure I'll get there with 2077 though?
 
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Well I hope you get your refund, stick to your reasons and if the lack of third is one don't forget if it's not on the game box or in the official game description that it's only first person you have a case, apart from all the other reasons as well.

I came in with no expectations except it had first person instead of like Witcher 3, to the game itself I'm quite serious when I say I do not follow online hype. Either for the Dev and especially not with player predictions, I was only hoping it would be a game I could get into and try to pull away from Beth because IMO they no longer make AAA games either.

Fallout 76 is AA for want od something else to call it, on PC Cyberpunk is about the same for me. Only difference is I've played every Beth TES and Fallout so I really know their games. 2077 is totally different in almost every respect but it's fun which is what I can only call FO76, neither are immersive be first person or third the game will not allow it.

My biggest issue is freezes followed by a CTD, followed by something you mentioned 'NPC's', Beth may use far less but at least they are original. Sick of seeing the same NPC 3 times in 30 seconds, the same NPC pose (holding arm while walking) I had I think 5 of them within a small crowd at one time. I wonder if it would be less immersion breaking to reduce the NPC setting to minimum, I'm used to Beth having very few in a City and maybe I will not see the same ones constantly?

Seriously, despite differences in how we prefer to play, you deserve your refund the game is not upto spec at all. I found it cheap before release and it's only just got down that low again now so I'm not so pissed. In fact cheaper than I got Fallout 76 for and that was a far, far worse release than 2077 was for sure. FO76 has only just about reached were it should have been 2 years ago and it's still missing things they said was going to happen from way before it was even released?

PS: Just a thought, maybe if this unofficial leak on like a game 'rebuild' by June 2021 is even possibly true, it may have some future, that are open modding of course. Cheers.

Even Witcher 3 had random world encounters, better mobs to kill, a mini-game (gwent) to completely distract me from the main game or honestly a frigging barber shop?! Anyone remember the hair growth over time? That game was also incredibly long so the story really had time to settle with me.
I honestly didn't follow that much of hype anyway, i just knew I was told I take narrative decisions and my choices matter and all that crap. Well none of it was true.

The first demo quest where you steal the flathead or whatever is its name was by far the most detailed quest. You meet Meredith Strout and that leads.... nowhere. Well besides a booty call for no reason. This game is a massive scam honestly, its just all lies, all the "choices" are illusions. None of my dialogue choices matter at all... ugh I can keep going.
Yeah CDPR just give me back my money. Maybe I will give this trash fire one more chance 3 or 4 years from now when you finally figure out what you want to do with it.
 
First Person was dropped due to immersion.

That was CDPR's reasoning.

What immersion is CDPR talking about? Where is it? Which goes directly into cut content territory and performance issues.
Where are reflective surfaces that you can see yourself? Is it immersive to see your shadow shamble about the ground like you are a puppet with the strings cut?

RDR2 had both first person and third person and it wasn't the POV that made it more or less immersive. It was everything else around it. So... lets just agree that CDPR's reasoning to cut third person view was less than honest.
 
It's intentional to increase immersion but I'd prefer it. I think the game would have more comparisons to GTA which is what they're trying to avoid but I guess it's bound to happen so why not. Look at Sleeping Dogs, Saints Row and the Yakuza series.

Didn't people discover the character model is actually nightmare fuel type shit in third person? Like a headless, deformed ape like creature with joints that bend at unnatural angles and shit. Might wanna get that fixed before thinking of implementing 3rd person but I agree, would much rather play wit proper peripheral vision than not
 
because they are lazy

Don't think they're implying laziness.

Not needing to animate significantly cuts down production time. And no animator worth their salt is going to stand by 'machine-only animation'. Sure it can get the 'rough cut' sorted. But then you have to go in and manually move this or that due to clipping and such.

Also, you're forgetting they do seem to have a plan to do a multiplayer Cyberpunk 2077. Which means they have to make the game '3rd person capable'; who wants to run around Night City and watch other players contort into The Thing when aiming.

((Best article I could find about the multiplayer; can't really doubt Investor Calls: https://www.greenmangaming.com/blog/will-cyberpunk-2077-have-multiplayer/))

Even if it's a separate game like Don't Starve Together. They'll likely be using the same assets (code, animations, models, textures, audio, etc).
 

Guest 4529090

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It was known from 2018, the initial reveal, that there would be no TPP, and they never said anything different.
It's still a silly decision , the people clearly want it .
They already pointed out a lot of good reasons as to why it'd be a good thing as well so I am not going to list any further ones .


They announced in June 2018 that it would be FPP other than while driving and very rarely in some cutscenes. There are of course mirrors and the photomode to see V.


There is a photomode.

It's kinda too little anyway...?
 
the people clearly want it
Not "the people", but some people. Or many people, but either way not the people. Important difference.

And many people want many things, for many reasons. This is no exception -- except maybe in the sense that the information of there being no TPP mode was fully available for well over two years prior to release, like you quoted both Rawls and myself pointing out.
 
As an older player, I've been used to first person from the past. The fact that almost all guys play as a woman (apart from secret fantasies) is due to the view of one's own (now female) butt. A look at Nexus reveals the secret longings in the form of oversized breasts or butts, for example at Skyrim. As a gay man, I find it hard to understand this, as I am aiming to identify with the character in a role-playing game and not find my virtual self horny. So I think the decision to do everything in first person is good... You'll have Panam's backside, while we've only got a 70-year-old rocker who couldn't be more boring...
I admit that I like to play as a female character for cosmetic reasons, but the same goes for a male character.
I enjoy seeing agile Aloy from Horizon Zero Dawn swaying and climbing around in her animal skin outfits, just the same as I enjoy seeing badass looking witcher Geralt running around in his cool looking armor, or just his bare chest riddled with scars.
When I can choose the gender, then it depends which game I'm playing:
Mass Effect trilogy > maleshep, Mass Effect Andromeda > femryder, Skyrim > mostly male dragonborn, Fallout 3/LV/4 > female, Dragon Age series > female warden/Hawke/inquisitor, ...
It often happens that I start with a certain gender, only to realize that I rather see the story progressing as the other one, causing to cease the current playthrough and start over. The first days playing Cyberpunk 2077 was only to see if I wanted to progress as a male or female V.

That said, it also annoys me beyond measure when I have to wade though heaps of skimpy armors or clothing at nexusmods, often with bodyparts out of proportions, to finally get that one decent looking outfit I'm searching for.
 
and very rarely in some cutscenes.

And they use that to absolutely great effect, in my opinion. Disconnecting from your character is such a powerful way to signal the end of the game, it's absolutely fantastic.


That said, it also annoys me beyond measure when I have to wade though heaps of skimpy armors or clothing at nexusmods, often with bodyparts out of proportions, to finally get that one decent looking outfit I'm searching for.

What?! The world doesn't cater to you alone? Blasphemy!
 

Guest 4529090

Guest
Not "the people", but some people. Or many people, but either way not the people. Important difference.

And many people want many things, for many reasons. This is no exception -- except maybe in the sense that the information of there being no TPP mode was fully available for well over two years prior to release, like you quoted both Rawls and myself pointing out.
Fair enough difference but let's even assume it's a minority ( which I don't think it is ) ...
I don't think they'd be bothered by the option to have such a feature in the game .
You want a third person mode ? You use it . You don't want it ? You keep playing in first person mode . It is optional , as simple as that .

In any case...why bother with character creation options if V's not going to be visible for 90% of the game ? Why add clothing options ?

I understand it was not planned or in developement , it's fine . I just find it to be silly in any case and think it would be a valid addition to the game .
 
It is a creative decision and clearly an important one.

That means it should not be changed just due to pressure from managers or even any portion of players.
That is the difference of doing creative work and yogurts. Creators need to have their vision somehow to be kept, forced even sometimes.

Many scenes would not work in 3rd person and even the idea of the Relic is working better in 1st person IMO.

I can imgine there are more important improvements/fixes for developers than going against themselfs

That does not stop anyone doing modes... if anyone solve how 1st person animation are glued to camera.
 
In any case...why bother with character creation options if V's not going to be visible for 90% of the game ? Why add clothing options ?
You do see your character at times (not to mention there is photomode), and there is no harm in having customization.

I was in favour of FPP long before E3 2018 -- it's on this forum somewhere, in an old and now locked thread -- based on personal preferences (first person is definitely more immersive to me). So what if the character isn't visible for most of the time? I personally don't care, or wouldn't care rather.
Many people do, which is perfectly fine and understandable, but not everyone does.

The developers had a clear vision, which they shared and underlined many, many times. Their vision doesn't please everyone, but no vision ever does.


I've had more than enough of these threads in the past two years, so I'll say no more on this topic.
 
Don't think they're implying laziness.

Not needing to animate significantly cuts down production time. And no animator worth their salt is going to stand by 'machine-only animation'. Sure it can get the 'rough cut' sorted. But then you have to go in and manually move this or that due to clipping and such.

Also, you're forgetting they do seem to have a plan to do a multiplayer Cyberpunk 2077. Which means they have to make the game '3rd person capable'; who wants to run around Night City and watch other players contort into The Thing when aiming.

((Best article I could find about the multiplayer; can't really doubt Investor Calls: https://www.greenmangaming.com/blog/will-cyberpunk-2077-have-multiplayer/))

Even if it's a separate game like Don't Starve Together. They'll likely be using the same assets (code, animations, models, textures, audio, etc).
I actually have no idea what you are even talking about, implying that animators who are hired to do ANIMATING are going first person only to cut time and not because they are rushed is absolutely insinuating that they are lazy, by the way the claims that first person is not animated is not even true, many "cutscenes" in first person are animated.

And I'm not forgetting that they will be doing multiplayer, you're assumption is clearly based on false premises. They most likely didn't finish animations for shadows and body not because they think people will never go to third person, rather they didn't have time to complete them because the game got RUSHED.

It's actually unbelievable to me that anyone is making criticisms of the first person such as the animation and shadows as if they are intended, they aren't, they are simply not finished.
 
All new games are going to be about multiplayer, and it seems every company focuses on that. I for one would love to see 3rd person view which will be modded soon or it will be added in a patch, hopefully soon. To do 3rd person on the vehicles as it is in game now means they can do it on people to, there will just need to be some added animations if they are missing.

I know every company doesn't want to be compared to GTA 5 but those features kind of set the bar for these types of games. And I don't mean GTA Online.
 
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