The Lodge of Sorceresses(all spoilers)

[dmcaldw]

She might have her reasons, but using Philippa to help them against the Hunt just to sell her out later is vile. And it makes Yennefer no better than Philippa. It actually makes her worse, since Phil never used any of her fellow sorceresses just to betray them.

I think what is interesting is depending on the ending the lodge gets what they want . Philippa being a non-factor in the end makes sense but do you really think she would be content . The flip side is the only time I could see Yen betraying the Lodge is dependent on the ending and for protection of Ciri . I think there are too many variables to end the Lodge properly i.e. Philippa , Rita , and Fringilla ( I know spelling ). I do agree Philippa should have been taken care of better . Rita was in my opinion taken care of worse because either way she is just there . Fringilla was bad but it wouldn't be a stretch to say she is welcome back in Tousant . Game wise Philippa was a key player with Geralt and should have been ended better . Kiera was a lesser character in comparison and got an ending . I can understand the Lodges ending the way it is because it is a leave it to your imagination type thing .

There is only one happy ending for the Lodge . I think the reason for the Lodge should have been explained in this game considering it really isn't explained and it is dependent on knowing their history . Also the players don't get to see that the amnesty from the Emperor was the right thing because the Lodge was his scapegoat or patsy for everything leading up to the war . I feel bad that the Lodge is a prop to advance the story . The Philippa in Reason of State story line is compelling to say the least but this is where the story line could at least explained the motivations of the Lodge as well .

 

[Guest 3847602]

Philippa already got the ending in the books - death at the hands of Willemer of Vizima during witch-hunts. No need to drag Rita and Fringilla into that, no need for Yennefer to betray anyone.
Leaving things to imagination about how she got captured is infinitely better option than rewriting canon, logical leaps and well-known character acting ooc.
Fate of remaining Lodge members could have been included in the epilogue, but it would not have any variety. Philippa dies the same way no matter what, Rita's and Fringilla's fates are unknown, but also outside of player's control in the final shape of the game (no choices - no consequences).
In the end, that crap was not deleted by accident, something about it obviously didn't fit the game.

 

[sv3672]

She might have her reasons, but using Philippa to help them against the Hunt just to sell her out later is vile. And it makes Yennefer no better than Philippa. It actually makes her worse, since Phil never used any of her fellow sorceresses just to betray them.

As I already mentioned, nothing in those few lines proves that the Lodge being "sold out" was already decided at the time when they were asked for help. Or it may have been decided only on Emhyr's side. In any case, all the unwarranted outrage over this (and other) unused content just proves why it is a right policy that posting such stuff on the forum is no longer allowed, and also that CDPR do not release any of it nor answer the questions.

By the way, Philippa already having a different (but the same as far as her fate is concerned) ending in the books does not mean much, the games differ from the books in their own time frame in more than one way already. Ciri stops the White Frost, Emhyr (who, as far as I know, rules until 1290 in the books) can be assassinated in the 1270's, not to mention you are playing as Geralt who died in 1268, and so on. There would be little point making games with player agency if they were to follow the exact same story that is already written, they could just as well be movies instead.

Edit: never mind, probably better to leave.

 

[Zyvik]

Philippa already got the ending in the books - death at the hands of Willemer of Vizima during witch-hunts.

Never liked this ending by the way. But canon is canon

 

[Guest 3847602]

Never liked this ending by the way. But canon is canon

You mean, the fact that she was outplayed by some priest, or brutality of the act itself? Or maybe both?
I kinda expected Sapko will have something really, really bad in store for her before the end of TLotL.
Funny how Sheala got imprisoned and tormented by witch-hunters (TW3) and Sabrina posthumously became martyr and Saint (TW2) - exactly what happened to Philippa.

 

[Zyvik]

You mean, the fact that she was outplayed by some priest, or brutality of the act itself? Or maybe both?

Both of course And the fact that she died is pretty bad in itself. But at least she went out like a boss!

Funny how Sheala got imprisoned and tormented by witch-hunters (TW3) and Sabrina posthumously became martyr and Saint (TW2) - exactly what happened to Philippa.

Yeah, looks like the devs decided that if they're gonna keep Philippa alive then they have to sacrifice the others to balance things out.
Actually I wouldn't mind as much if Philippa was the one who got tortured and killed in TW3 (as long as Sheala and Sabrina stay alive of course). I wouldn't like it, but I would accept it.

 

[e-ahmet]

I voted for Phillippa. I'm surprised she is in the lead. I thought she wouldn't be a popular choice. Personally, I find her really attractive. Probably the voice talent acting as her has a hand in that too. She is also powerful, can turn into an owl. I believe she had played some parts in the second game while going through the haunted battlefield too. It was awesome. What's not to like about her? To clarify my previous comment, I thought Triss or Yen would be in the lead.

edit: I realized those two aren't in the vote.

 

[Zyvik]

I voted for Phillippa. I'm surprised she is in the lead. I thought she wouldn't be a popular choice.

And I on the contrary knew from the start that Phil would win
Even though some people don't like her as a person, they seem to at least like as a character. She's charismatic, witty and has some of the best lines in the games. The fact that she gets more screen time than the other sorceresses (in both books and games) also helps.

 

[e-ahmet]

You know I just remembered my disappointment when I found out in TW2 she wasn't interested in men LOL.

 

[Zyvik]

You know I just remembered my disappointment when I found out in TW2 she wasn't interested in men LOL.

Well, she does sleep with them sometimes. In the books Dandelion even thought that she and Geralt had a thing going at some point :surprise:

 

[e-ahmet]

Well, she does sleep with them sometimes. In the books Dandelion even thought that she and Geralt had a thing going at some point :surprise:

Nice tidbit. Thanks. I read the first two books but that was ages ago if it was mentioned in one of those.

 

[Zyvik]

The awesome people on nexus fixed Sheala's model in the game. Now she actually kinda resembles herself from TW2:
https://www.nexusmods.com/witcher3/mods/2715/?
Now if they could also save her from death...

 

[Guest 3847602]

Now she actually kinda resembles herself from TW2

Looks good, but no tatoo

Speaking of mods, something even better is in the works:

Spoiler

 

[sv3672]

The awesome people on nexus fixed Sheala's model in the game. Now she actually kinda resembles herself from TW2:

Looking good and well dressed is obviously important for the occasion of getting tortured and killed in prison. By the way, that other mod is just bad, it does not even make sense for those characters to be there (let alone as a group), besides, the models look awful with that pasted on hair and low quality face.

 

[Zyvik]

Looks good, but no tatoo

That's fine with me. I always thought that tatoo was OOC.

Speaking of mods, something even better is in the works

Oh my...

 

[Zyvik]

Looking good and well dressed is obviously important for the occasion of getting tortured and killed in prison.

lol that Sheala wannabe can die for all I care. The actual Sheala will be adventuring with my Geralt as a companion

it does not even make sense for those characters to be there

Why? Invinting your friends to the wedding is a common practice.

 

[sv3672]

Why? Invinting your friends to the wedding is a common practice.

Why invite the Lodge after their plans with Ciri, which they are insinuated to have again in the game, or Triss (not even a member of the Lodge in TW3, she even talks about having no plans to return, the mod reverts that for no good reason) after cheating with Geralt for more than a year? I do not think their presence would be fun at the wedding party (speaking of which, the mod is also a middle finger to anyone who did not romance Yennefer). Nor would Triss travel there just to attend the wedding of her ex with someone else and be humiliated, most people would not do that, it is clear from Witcher 3 that if she is not romanced then they would never meet again with Geralt after the ending, they have to move on. Low quality fan fiction like this just cheapens the characters and the decisions that can be made in the game, regardless of the path. Then again, it is also nonsensical to see Roche partying with the kingslayer and Iorveth, again, it detracts from the seriousness of the characters.

Really, the only people who should be there are Ciri and maybe Dandelion and a couple others, whoever just happens to be around Kaer Morhen (why is the party there anyway? Isn't Geralt supposed to settle down elsewhere a thousand or more miles away?), like Eskel. I figure the mod authors just had throw in as many cameo NPCs as they could to maximize their audience. I wonder if Papa Emhyr is going to make an appearance, too.

Anyway, it is probably best to return to the topic of the Lodge of Sorceresses.

 

[Zyvik]

Why invite the Lodge after their plans with Ciri

It's not like they invited Philippa. Margarita is one of Yennefer's oldest friends and there was no indication in either books or games that she harbours any ill feelings towards her. And TW3 implies that she became close with Fringilla (who wasn't even part of that Ciri discussion).

Nor would Triss travel there just to attend the wedding of her ex with someone else and be humiliated, most people would not do that

Well, she did it in "Something ends, Something begins" wich was written by Sapkowski himself, so...

 

[sv3672]

Again, this is off-topic so I will not post more, but isn't "Something ends, Something begins" a non-canon short story that Sapkowski wrote as a wedding gift for one of his friends, and thus it can be expected not to be serious? Also, the situation is different after the end of the games, it would be even less in character now.

Spoiler

Regarding Yennefer not harboring any ill feelings, or becoming close with Fringilla Vigo:

"Your Imperial Majesty,

Allow me to remind you that our arrangement encompassed all the sorceresses wishing to take part in the risky endeavor whose success is so vital to us. I find it hard to believe that in the current situation, when I have already succeeded in gathering so many members of the Lodge, you would refuse to allow Fringilla Vigo to join our company.
I understand there are personal factors that make you reluctant to part with your subject, but I assure you our interests are aligned in those matters as well.
I promise that I will uphold the conditions of our arrangement, despite the fact that they will demand sacrifices of me and will leave me in an unfortunate situation.

I therefore request, politely yet with great insistence, that you release Fringilla.

With all due respect,
Yennefer"

Or, to view it from another angle, which of these characters do you honestly think would be present if the equivalent of this mod was made by CDPR (fortunately they are yet to sink that low, but let's imagine for a moment that they are making it)? I could bet that none of the three from the picture would even be mentioned, and that would be the right decision. They did not shoehorn characters into their existing games either when they could not find a meaningful and in character role for them, even if that meant disappointing fans.

 

[Zyvik]

Or, to view it from another angle, which of these characters do you honestly think would be present if the equivalent of this mod was made by CDPR (fortunately they are yet to sink that low, but let's imagine for a moment that they are making it)? I could bet that none of the three from the picture would even be mentioned, and that would be the right decision.

Of course Rita and Fringilla would not appear, not because it doesn't make sense for them, but because CDPR simply don't care about them one bit. In fact they care so little that Fringilla wasn't even metioned in Blood and Wine and Rita still looks like a pig after two years since the game's release. Fortunately, some fans care about them.