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The Main Villain (Eredin) Just Doesn't cut it for me... (SPOILERS!)

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L

Lieste

Ex-moderator
#41
Oct 1, 2014
scryar said:
(Fringila, Vigo, Keira Metz, Margaritta Laux- Antille, Francisca Findabair) and Phillipa
Click to expand...
Fringilla Vigo is one woman.
 
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HellKnightX88

HellKnightX88

Forum veteran
#42
Oct 1, 2014
Maybe she has a doppelganger... or maybe Emhyr caught her and now there's 2 separate parts of her :p
 
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Mefris

Mefris

Senior user
#43
Oct 1, 2014
I don't think it's really fair to judge Eredin by just two confrontations and omit eveything that was otherwise said about him.It would be (as LordCrash already pointed out) like judging Geralt solely by his failure with Vilgefortz or the inexpirienced farmer.With that said Eredin is just one half of the cake.I'm more curious why we haven't heard anything about his partner in crime,Avallac'h.Of the two I get the feeling Avallac'h is the more powerful one (especially since he's an Aen Saevherne).
 
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M

MassEffectReaper

Rookie
#44
Oct 1, 2014
TheDespondentMind said:
I mean I know that Ciri is kinda OP even without the time travel, she had a few months of training and already she's arguably the third best swordsman in the witcher world, and she's not even 18! By know she should be able to defeat Geralt with an toothpick.
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Nah Geralt has been fighting for about a century, and he knows how to fight Sorcerers. Sorceresses well.... Geralt has his ways ;)
 
T

TheDespondentMind2

Rookie
#45
Oct 2, 2014
Avallac'h has and seems more and more the greater danger, though I can't resist the hunch that Eredin "removed him" so the things can be easier for him and the plot.


P.S. I have a feeling I already wrote this.
 
HellKnightX88

HellKnightX88

Forum veteran
#46
Oct 2, 2014
TheDespondentMind said:
Avallac'h has and seems more and more the greater danger, though I can't resist the hunch that Eredin "removed him" so the things can be easier for him and the plot.
Click to expand...
I honestly hope not. I'm not too thrilled when they kill important/unique characters like that off screen in the past (like they did in chapter 2 in TW2) especially if it's Avallac'h.
 
JackalJ

JackalJ

Senior user
#47
Oct 2, 2014
TheDespondentMind said:
I mean I know that Ciri is kinda OP even without the time travel, she had a few months of training and already she's arguably the third best swordsman in the witcher world, and she's not even 18! By know she should be able to defeat Geralt with an toothpick.
Click to expand...
Yet she will never be able to defeat a full witcher, they are to fast. Like Coen said in the books, she will never be as fast as a real witcher. That is if she doesn't use her magic. Then again does she really have magic that would be usefull in a fight? (I'm rereading the series and am at the last book, the only kind of magic she has now is the world traveling. Can't remember if she regains her old abilities as well.)
 
S

Scholdarr

Banned
#48
Oct 2, 2014
jackalj said:
Yet she will never be able to defeat a full witcher, they are to fast. Like Coen said in the books, she will never be as fast as a real witcher. That is if she doesn't use her magic. Then again does she really have magic that would be usefull in a fight? (I'm rereading the series and am at the last book, the only kind of magic she has now is the world traveling. Can't remember if she regains her old abilities as well.)
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No, she has not. Ciri gave up her abiities to use "normal" magic. And we shouldn't forget that witchers aren't the fastest or best sword fighters in the world. Vilgefortz was faster than Geralt because he used his magical powers in melee combat. So every really powerful mage is basically able to defeat Ciri or the witchers. But we shouldn't see that as a solid science anyway. Every little failure could kill you in a melee encounter and every little trick could save your life. So it's not always sure who will win a fight before it actually happens... ;)
 
T

TheDespondentMind2

Rookie
#49
Oct 2, 2014
HellKnightX88 said:
I honestly hope not. I'm not too thrilled when they kill important/unique characters like that off screen in the past (like they did in chapter 2 in TW2) especially if it's Avallac'h.
Click to expand...
Which one? I know
Assire dies in ch3.
Click to expand...
 
L

Lieste

Ex-moderator
#50
Oct 2, 2014
LordCrash said:
No, she has not. Ciri gave up her abiities to use "normal" magic. And we shouldn't forget that witchers aren't the fastest or best sword fighters in the world. Vilgefortz was faster than Geralt because he used his magical powers in melee combat. So every really powerful mage is basically able to defeat Ciri or the witchers. But we shouldn't see that as a solid science anyway. Every little failure could kill you in a melee encounter and every little trick could save your life. So it's not always sure who will win a fight before it actually happens... ;)
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Not entirely sure that was the only reason...

Vilgefortz has had some 'fighting' experience - this is directly alluded to, and a known thing... the *way* it is phrased suggests that it might be rather more specialised than membership of the FPI. (sic)

When I read it, I wondered if Geralt suspected unfinished witcher training... similar to that undergone by Ciri.
 
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HellKnightX88

HellKnightX88

Forum veteran
#51
Oct 3, 2014
@TheDespondentMind
I'm referring to Sabrina.
 
C

Code412

Rookie
#52
Oct 3, 2014
A hunch-backed gnome with a limp can prove a deadly opponent, if it's smart enough. I think Eredin will be a serious threat in the Witcher universe, *especially* with his ability to inflict terror and havoc at random places in the world. Geralt won't be able to save everyone.

Is W3's Eredin is intelligently written (and there is no reason to doubt it), he should prove a menace far greater (and convincing) than Skyrim's Alduin or any recent D&D villains.
 
S

shawn_kh

Rookie
#53
Oct 3, 2014
The possibility that Ciri could defeat Geralt is almost none existent. Geralt is not a regular Witcher. He went through more mutations which made him even faster and stronger than the rest of the Witchers, on the other hand Ciri is not even a mutant. Geralt has much more fighting experience than Ciri does. I'm not sure why some people assume that Ciri was more talented than Geralt to begin with. probably Geralt was also really talented with a sword and physically superior to the rest of the kids, and that's why he was chosen to go through further mutations. Gralt taught Ciri how to fight in the first place. And Geralt is taller, heavier, and stronger than Ciri.
Geralt's weakness is actually fighting powerful mages such as Vilgefortz. To be honest no swordsman, no matter how good they are, could defeat a mage as powerful as Vilgefortz.. If I remember correctly Geralt killed Vilgefortz with the help of Yen's magic, and even then Yen was wounded by Vilgefortz.
One should never underestimate the power of Eredin, because he has an army behind him and he is smart and cunning.
 
Last edited: Oct 3, 2014
T

TheDespondentMind2

Rookie
#54
Oct 6, 2014
HellKnightX88 said:
@TheDespondentMind
I'm referring to Sabrina.
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, that was done horribly.
The possibility that Ciri could defeat Geralt is almost none existent. Geralt is not a regular Witcher. He went through more mutations which made him even faster and stronger than the rest of the Witchers, on the other hand Ciri is not even a mutant. Geralt has much more fighting experience than Ciri does. I'm not sure why some people assume that Ciri was more talented than Geralt to begin with.
Click to expand...
Maybe because she sliced up a wyvern and every opponent before even reaching 15 years. Without mutations and with a way shorter training. If she had the proper Witcher training-mutations I think she would be able to cut up the whole Nilfgard army.
If I remember correctly Geralt killed Vilgefortz with the help of Yen's magic, and even then Yen was wounded by Vilgefortz.
Click to expand...
There are several reasons for that. Geralt had Yen's help, and then Reggis popped up, then after the battle Yen mentions how VIlgefortz'es coordination might be slightly worse because he was missing a proper eye. And Geralt had a new medallion that warned him against all dangers.

Basically until Reggis came Vilgefortz was still kicking ass without any setbacks. That's the kind of villain we need. Though Yennefer was far from her best condition in that battle.
 
S

Scholdarr

Banned
#55
Oct 7, 2014
TheDespondentMind said:
And Geralt had a new medallion that warned him against all dangers.
.
Click to expand...
Actually it was this very medallion that empowered Geralt to kill Vilgefortz by casting illusional magic on Geralt. In the end it was Fringilla Vigo who saved Geralt's ass.

It was this element of surprise which led to victory against Vilgefortz. Neither Geralt nor Yennefer nor Reggis would have been able to kill him no matter in which condition. He was more powerful than all of them together. It was his own hybris that killed him. He didn't expect Geralt to use illusional magic and his misguided blow due to the magic of the medalilon together with his elation of total victory that made him a very little bit careless gave Geralt the fraction of a second to break through the sorcerer's defense and to deadly wound him.

We have absolutely no idea how powerful Eredin and Avellac'h really are. We don't know how powerful they are compared to e.g. Vilgefortz. Maybe they are even more powerful than him, depending on situation. The books don't really give us much information on this very point. As I've said before, Ciri was able to win against Eredin due to very specific circumstances and not because she was a better sword fighter or more powerful than him. On the opposite, Sapkowski used a literary "trick" to let her escape from Eredin and the world of the Aen Elle. We can be quite sure that something like that won't happen to Eredin a second time...

I think many of you really deeply overestimate Ciri's power and fighting abilities. Yes, she is a very good sword fighter. That doesn't make her immortal. She probably wouldn't stand a chance against a group of well trained attacker who attack at the same time. Also, she can easily be killed by a bolt or arrow in the back like everyone else. In no way she would imo stand a chance against Geralt under normal circumstances, although she would be a tough opponent. But that's just statistics. In a realistic environment everyone can win against everyone. Nobody's perfect and everyone makes mistakes. It's totally up to the writer/storyteller who'd win such a fight... ;)
 
Last edited: Oct 7, 2014
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