The Problem with Nilfgaard

[EduFerraz]

The problem with nilfgard its...

The coolest deck in The game - assimilate - ist not an OP deck and Will be problably nerfed because all The blames with locks, poison, and double Ball.

The same happens with SK. I have a cool ursine bear deck, but with all The blames they change rupture and my deck was nerfed.

So, If devs Will change things, be carefull to not nerfed another engines thats works well

 

[LoveToDie7]

I've only been playing this game for 3 months, and this is my first post. So feel free to tell me how clueless I am.

I've really been struggling this season playing anything other than SK or NG. I don't like either faction. But I hit R0 last season so I was "given" R3 on this season. I've played over 100 matches since the new season started, maybe closer to 200. I'm still at R3. I'm aware how much I suck so let's skip over that, if we can...

So when I heard they Nerfed SK, I started going for SK cards and tried a Flurry load out. I kept being beat by PF so I switched to that. Every NG could beat me soundly in that so I decided to use all my ores on NG....sadly... I sold out to the faction I dislike the most.

Though I'm still R3 (I'm feeling better about my chances to get to R2 now) I find the deck is easier to play. (Enslave with 2x Ball/poison) There's more consistency to this deck, imo. If you miss 1 or 2 major cards you can still win. Where with the other factions, you seem screwed if you don't draw the card you built the deck around to win one of your rounds.

I feel if you made the following changes to NG, it might put it on par with other decks:

Make Assire a neutral card so everyone can use it. Ending NG devotion decks.

or:

Make Assire only be able to shuffle cards 10 points or lower.

Make poison a 3 level status to kill. If you have 2 poisons, you can't gain any more power but it doesn't kill the cards outright. The 3rd poison sends it to the graveyard. Also, change Van Moorlehem hunter to a Lock/Poison instead of Lock/bleed.

JMHO
LTD

 

[irrrregular]

The problem with nilfgaard:

3 cards left, the opponent plays Cantarella and gets my Slander; next he plays bribery and gets my Graden to destroy Imke.

Tell me other faction that can count with this "luck" and variety of options........

I abominate this faction.

 

[Bleach25]

I've only been playing this game for 3 months, and this is my first post. So feel free to tell me how clueless I am.

I've really been struggling this season playing anything other than SK or NG. I don't like either faction. But I hit R0 last season so I was "given" R3 on this season. I've played over 100 matches since the new season started, maybe closer to 200. I'm still at R3. I'm aware how much I suck so let's skip over that, if we can...

So when I heard they Nerfed SK, I started going for SK cards and tried a Flurry load out. I kept being beat by PF so I switched to that. Every NG could beat me soundly in that so I decided to use all my ores on NG....sadly... I sold out to the faction I dislike the most.

Though I'm still R3 (I'm feeling better about my chances to get to R2 now) I find the deck is easier to play. (Enslave with 2x Ball/poison) There's more consistency to this deck, imo. If you miss 1 or 2 major cards you can still win. Where with the other factions, you seem screwed if you don't draw the card you built the deck around to win one of your rounds.

I feel if you made the following changes to NG, it might put it on par with other decks:

Make Assire a neutral card so everyone can use it. Ending NG devotion decks.

or:

Make Assire only be able to shuffle cards 10 points or lower.

Make poison a 3 level status to kill. If you have 2 poisons, you can't gain any more power but it doesn't kill the cards outright. The 3rd poison sends it to the graveyard. Also, change Van Moorlehem hunter to a Lock/Poison instead of Lock/bleed.

JMHO
LTD

Cancel Nilfgaard

 

[Slizzl]

Make Assire only be able to shuffle cards 10 points or lower.

This might actually be the best solution, better than just making Scenarios doomed (even with that I think they should be). I do think 10 points is a bit harsh though I don't think it would serve much purpose at that point. 11-12 or lower would be a good nerf but not kill it I think. Her entire purpose is to shuffle strong cards back, I don't see any 10 provision or lower cards that would need that. 11-12 ones however could serve a purpose to be played again.
I just dislike the overly harsh nerfs CDPR most often goes for, I think there should be a middle ground.

 

[Celadyl]

This might actually be the best solution, better than just making Scenarios doomed (even with that I think they should be). I do think 10 points is a bit harsh though I don't think it would serve much purpose at that point. 11-12 or lower would be a good nerf but not kill it I think. Her entire purpose is to shuffle strong cards back, I don't see any 10 provision or lower cards that would need that. 11-12 ones however could serve a purpose to be played again.
I just dislike the overly harsh nerfs CDPR most often goes for, I think there should be a middle ground.

my take on an assire nerf would be to make her only able to shuffle units back into the deck, no provision cap needed

 

[Markus_Wirth]

The problem with nilfgaard:

3 cards left, the opponent plays Cantarella and gets my Slander; next he plays bribery and gets my Graden to destroy Imke.

Tell me other faction that can count with this "luck" and variety of options........

I abominate this faction.

Hehe, thas really bad luck.

One should not forget that Cantarella, Bribery and the leader Double Ball heavily depends whether your target does not depend heavily on other fraction-specific cards.
As soon as you have cards which only give value within the fraction the value when "stolen" is heavily reduced. (Queen Adalia nerv, Caranthir nerv, more tutors, tutoring special cards, bonded cards,...)

This might actually be the best solution, better than just making Scenarios doomed (even with that I think they should be). I do think 10 points is a bit harsh though I don't think it would serve much purpose at that point. 11-12 or lower would be a good nerf but not kill it I think. Her entire purpose is to shuffle strong cards back, I don't see any 10 provision or lower cards that would need that. 11-12 ones however could serve a purpose to be played again.
I just dislike the overly harsh nerfs CDPR most often goes for, I think there should be a middle ground.

Maybe it´s only my expression. But those double-ball cards do not appear to be the toughest opponents. After MMM you have various way to react on it and usually I win against those decks

 

[Philido]

To reiterate, 4-provision cards should be the absolute worst cards in the game. You're mainly including them in your deck in order to make room for more expensive cards. If 4-provision cards are providing the same amount of utility and value as 5-, 6-, and 7-provision cards, why would anyone choose to play most of the cards that cost 5-7 provisions?

I listed the overpowered 4-provision cards for Nilfgaard because this is a thread about Nilfgaard, and Van Moorlehem Hunters was already being discussed; however, there are plenty of examples of cards that are too good at 4 provisions in the other factions. (e.g. Fisstech Trafficker, Street Urchins, Lyrian Scytheman, Radovid's Royal Guards, Endrega Warrior, basically every 7 for 4 along with the various units with Bond, Fisstech and all the 4-provision damage specials, etc.)

I don't think they should be "the worst of the worst", actually bronzes should receive substantial buffs to make the game less draw dependent. Right now, missing an important gold can already be decisive. I have no idea how exactly Joust, Urchins or Royal Guards are overpowered. Yes, they are better than others, but I'm really glad that there are bronzes who don't automatically make you feel bad when you have them in your hand in round three.

Post automatically merged: Aug 27, 2020

VM Hunter made Alba Armored Cavalry (Row locked 5 provisions no alternative skill) obsolete and what bothers me the most about VMH is that he's even able to lock units on you're side of the Board (cow carass, Sabrina for example) while some of the Gold Lock Cards like Margarita, Djenge, Auckes and Letho are only able to target enemy unit's.

I would personally prefer if they would remove lock from bronze units and would make it more powerfull by removing it as a status so that only lock units able to lock and unlock Units again like in open beta in this case they could probably even give something like Radovids old ability (lock 2 units) to NG as a leader skill.

I also agree that some of the 4 Provision Cards of all factions are way to strong considering that they are mainly used as fillers to make room for more powerfull gold Cards, I think this is actually one of the biggest flaws of the provision system and gives Gwent more of a Arena Mode feel, that's why I prefer the old system by a lot (4 Golds/6 Silvers (low tier Golds) /rest bronzes 3 copies instead of 2 possible) where you actually needed to sacrifice synergie if you wanted to include a control card like Gigni, I still remember myself building a deck and realizing that I probably should add some control option like whether removal or lock and still didn't do it because I would lose a lot of synergie if I would replace one of the silver Cards with a control card, while in HC you just remove one or two of higher provision bronzes instead and put in some of the better 4 provisions to make room for that Gold you wanted to add.

Hunters can't be copied with Ramon, they don't proc Crossbowmen and they have one point less than AAC. The row lock doesn't change anything regarding its viability. Definitely not "obsolete".

 

[ShinAkira00]

Hehe, thas really bad luck.

One should not forget that Cantarella, Bribery and the leader Double Ball heavily depends whether your target does not depend heavily on other fraction-specific cards.
As soon as you have cards which only give value within the fraction the value when "stolen" is heavily reduced. (Queen Adalia nerv, Caranthir nerv, more tutors, tutoring special cards, bonded cards,...)

So you're suggesting players not use the best cards available to their faction to counter the faction that has all their auto include cards in almost every deck? That's evidence of a poorly balanced game if there ever was one. You supposedly win against double ball by your own words, using what faction?

 

[Jollyrogerxberg]

So you're suggesting players not use the best cards available to their faction to counter the faction that has all their auto include cards in almost every deck? That's evidence of a poorly balanced game if there ever was one. You supposedly win against double ball by your own words, using what faction?

SK, SC, NR, MO, SY and some times I lose but most times I win. The greediest cards are mostly not the best cards because of control existing. Not only NG has control.

 

[ShinAkira00]

SK, SC, NR, MO, SY and some times I lose but most times I win. The greediest cards are mostly not the best cards because of control existing. Not only NG has control.

If you're going to list all the factions then that just removes any validity to your argument, moving on.

 

[Philido]

If you're going to list all the factions then that just removes any validity to your argument.

How exactly is it not "valid" to win with every faction against Double Ball?

 

[judgecsk]

...omg...

...this is still going hot I see, lul !
Them hunters are pretty annoying and powerful indeed, they're more like a 5p card rather than a 4p imo, yeah I said it !
Locks are not just "pffft c'mon don't complain it's not a big deal" like some NG players say.

- Since we got the whole <<devotion>> concept and the dimetrium lock card is a "neutral" thus breaking devotion, it's out of reach, so yeah, comparing those two is like comparing apples to oranges, not the same not even close.
Imo it should get a 1p buff in power, his shield should be removed and it's prov cost should go up to 5p.

Cheers !

 

[Sensimilius]

It's like "locking is just a NG thing man, it's their identity" oh but so are POISONING, stealing units, killing or seizing defenders lol, all this for cheap. Make Hunters be only able to lock cards that are 6 provision or less. :] Or make them 5 provision, or make them have 1 power and 1 armor or 2 hp.
NG doesn't even need "good" units of its' own when it can just cheaply seize opponents units and also lock them down.

 

[Philido]

It's like "locking is just a NG thing man, it's their identity" oh but so are POISONING, stealing units, killing or seizing defenders lol, all this for cheap. Make Hunters be only able to lock cards that are 5 provision or less. :] Or make them 5 provision, or make them have 1 power and 1 armor or 2 hp.

Come on, you must know that these "suggestions" are absolutely ridiculous if you play the game at least once in a while....

 

[judgecsk]

It's like "locking is just a NG thing man, it's their identity" oh but so are POISONING, stealing units, killing or seizing defenders lol, all this for cheap. Make Hunters be only able to lock cards that are 5 provision or less. :] Or make them 5 provision, or make them have 1 power and 1 armor or 2 hp.
NG doesn't even need "good" units of its' own when it can just cheaply seize opponents units and also lock them down.

- I think that is a bit too much mate... xD

- My only complaint atm bout NG is their ability to play 2-3 times the Ball scenario and them 4p 3power 1armor lock-bleed units, so much versatility at such low cost.
If any <<devotion>> NG player thinks im exaggerating, remove them hunters and use the dimetrium lock cards, see how you like it...

 

[Philido]

- I think that is a bit too much mate... xD

- My only complaint atm bout NG is their ability to play 2-3 times the Ball scenario and them 4p 3power 1armor lock-bleed units, so much versatility at such low cost.
If any <<devotion>> NG player thinks im exaggerating, remove them hunters and use the dimetrium lock cards, see how you like it...

But why is it a problem? How do Hunters in any way imbalance the game? Just because they are better than Shackles?

 

[judgecsk]

But why is it a problem? How do Hunters in any way imbalance the game? Just because they are better than Shackles?

Nah mate, pardon me for not being clear, don't get me wrong, they are not OP.
I just find em dirt cheap for the versatility they provide and I believe they should be reevaluated to 5p cost (like I stated on a previous post of mine).
Lock-Bleed-Armor-Ball scebario proc without breaking devotion, need I say more..?

Cheers

 

[Philido]

Nah mate, pardon me for not being clear, don't get me wrong, they are not OP.
I just find em dirt cheap for the versatility they provide and I believe they should be reevaluated to 5p cost (like I stated on a previous post of mine).
Lock-Bleed-Armor-Ball scebario proc without breaking devotion, need I say more..?

Cheers

I don't like that suggestion, NG really doesn't need a nerf at the moment. Also I think you overvalue Lock as it is essential to find a good target, otherwise you won't get any value. And the Bleeding 2 makes this card a potential five for four which is underwhelming these days. The scenario procs might somewhat balance these shortcomings out. But again, this would be a big nerf for the faction as a whole which is definitely not necessary.

 

[Bleach25]

Knowing full well I'll be eaten alive, I've decided to point out what I believe to consider the problem(s) with Nilfgaard at the Moment.

1°) overreliance on Ball: any NG Tier 2 deck plays Ball. (Helge Elder Bears has disappeared and Hyperthin is Tier 3. ) After last month Devotion Nilfgaard has also lost quite a lot of popularity, which leaves the most hideous Nilfgaard deck to carry the faction: Double ball. It's the only deck that has stood the test of time mostly because it's the only deck that allows Nilfgaard to contend round One without overcommitting.

2°)...which makes Nilfgaard vulnerable to bomb heaver and Korathi Heatwave, partially explaining its position in the meta. Status archetype is the only strongly supported archetype in the faction

3°) Nilfgaard is still being carried by same bronzes: Fangs of the Empire, Thirsty Dames, Magne Division, Ard Feainn Bowmen to be precise. None or almost nome of the new bronzes are featured in metà lists and for a reason. NG doesn't have neither outstanding pointslam bronzes, nor outstanding engines.

4°) Nilfgaard has some powerful cards in the 10-11 provisions slot, but for the most part its golds are "useless"

5°) Nilfgaard most interesting concepts, like deck manipulation, are rather underdeveloped. This is the same for most of its archetypes, which lack either support or points or even clear foundations.

That's it.