The Triss content and the inconsistency of our romance's choice

[Riddlin]

@luc0s
Hey, you seem to have more than a few play-throughs on TW3 already...can you answer that question I posed earlier up? Just off your head, how many side quest results were referenced later in either MAIN story quests or, if you can remember, other side quests?

I am drawing a blank...seems only the Baron outcome and that LONG line of sides you did for Dijkstra, returning his stash...anything else? if there are a lot just a couple examples Thanks!

 

[luc0s]

If you do romance Triss on another playthrough, I'd love to hear your reaction to how the Triss romance was handled upon experiencing it yourself. There's been a few people that have come into this thread and offered their perspective saying that Triss kind of got mishandled even though they prefer Yen. Although from what I'm seeing, it seems Yen kind of got mishanded as well after Kaer Morhen.

Will do.

Personally I wasn't unhappy with how Yen got treated in TW3. At least not regarding her romance arc with Geralt and Ciri. I was really happy and satisfied with how that turned out.

What did slightly piss me off though is the entire anti-Yen vipe that the TW3 seems to have going for it. CDPR is trying really hard to scare new players away from romancing Yen. From what I've seen and experienced, all Yen romancers are book readers who romanced Yen based on who she was in the books. People with no real knowledge of the books all seem to get a pretty negative impression of Yen and I blame it on how TW3 handled her.

Sure, Yen has always be somewhat of a bitch, but TW3 kinda goes overboard with trying to convince you - the player - on how much of a bitch she is. I found it pretty annoying how every single goddamn NPC felt the need to meddle with Geralt's personal affairs and tell him how much of a bitch Yen is or asking him why he even romances that bitch.

I'm curious, how does that play out if you romance Triss? Do you also get a lot of Yen-bashing from NPCs if Triss is your romance choice? Does any NPC comment negatively about Triss at all if you romance her?

 

[hawkeyesforever]

Will do.

Personally I wasn't unhappy with how Yen got treated in TW3. At least not regarding her romance arc with Geralt and Ciri. I was really happy and satisfied with how that turned out.

What did slightly piss me off though is the entire anti-Yen vipe that the TW3 seems to have going for it. CDPR is trying really hard to scare new players away from romancing Yen. From what I've seen and experienced, all Yen romancers are book readers who romanced Yen based on who she was in the books. People with no real knowledge of the books all seem to get a pretty negative impression of Yen and I blame it on how TW3 handled her.

Sure, Yen has always be somewhat of a bitch, but TW3 kinda goes overboard with trying to convince you - the player - on how much of a bitch she is. I found it pretty annoying how every single goddamn NPC felt the need to meddle with Geralt's personal affairs and tell him how much of a bitch Yen is or asking him why he even romances that bitch.

I'm curious, how does that play out if you romance Triss? Do you also get a lot of Yen-bashing from NPCs if Triss is your romance choice? Does any NPC comment negatively about Triss at all if you romance her?

Hmm as far as choosing Triss goes, I chose Triss in Novigard and then did Skellige after that, and pretty much everyone in Skellige thought that I was with Yen. Triss is almost like an afterthought and you really have no way of correcting anyone. Even with the drunk scene in Kaer Morhen you can't correct Lambert or Eskel and tell them that you're with Triss now. Also when Geralt arrives in KM, Triss is nowhere to be found even though she says that she's heading there after the Novigrad lighthouse scene.

Not to mention on the boat in Skellige all you get from Triss is "Well?", which doesn't seem realistic for a romance choice. Its like, "Hey I love you, you love me to, talk to me more than one word before the biggest battle of my life!" lol.

I guess it's a lot of little things that add up to make the romance choice seem not worthwhile and not as realistic as it should be.

 

[luc0s]

@luc0s
Hey, you seem to have more than a few play-throughs on TW3 already...can you answer that question I posed earlier up? Just off your head, how many side quest results were referenced later in either MAIN story quests or, if you can remember, other side quests?

I am drawing a blank...seems only the Baron outcome and that LONG line of sides you did for Dijkstra, returning his stash...anything else? if there are a lot just a couple examples Thanks!

Honestly I've only done 1 complete playthrough and currently working on my 2nd.

The only side-quests having any influence on the main quest as far as I can remember are:

- Whether you help Letho and send him to Kaer Morhen or not.
- Whether you spare Keira and send her to Kaer Morhen or not.
- If you spare Keira and send her to Kaer Morhen she becomes Lambert's girlfriend, which is quite cute.
- Roche's quests, which unlock the Radovid assassination quest and the ability to send him to Kaer Morhen.
- Whether you kill the Botchling or change her into a Lubberkin. You'll get a different follow-up quest for each.
- Siding with the Crows or siding with the Oak spirit changes how the Baron questline ends.
- Whether you kill Radovid and who you side with afterwards (Dijkstra or Roche) decides which ending you can get (you'll only be able to get the Empress Ciri ending if you kill Radovid and side with Roche).
- Triss's and Yennefer's respective side-quests obviously also influence the main quest to some degree, at least it influences the ending you'll get (depending on who you romanced at the end of their side-quest stories).
- I remember the side-quest where you have to search for Phillipa's hide-out changing some dialogue in the main quest, but nothing much.
- If you have both Roche and Letho present at Kaer Morhen you'll get a short little conversation with both of them bickering.
- The King's Gambit, which is also a side-quest, influences the mainquest a little. if Cerys becomes queen of Skellige she'll send Hjalmar to Kaer Morhen to help you there. It also influences the ending a bit. If you don't do this side-quest then that black-haired dude who's name I forgot becomes king of Skellige.

Hmmmmmmmm, that's it. If I find more during my 2nd playthrough I'll add it to this list.

 

[vTemeria]

Will do.

Personally I wasn't unhappy with how Yen got treated in TW3. At least not regarding her romance arc with Geralt and Ciri. I was really happy and satisfied with how that turned out.

What did slightly piss me off though is the entire anti-Yen vipe that the TW3 seems to have going for it. CDPR is trying really hard to scare new players away from romancing Yen. From what I've seen and experienced, all Yen romancers are book readers who romanced Yen based on who she was in the books. People with no real knowledge of the books all seem to get a pretty negative impression of Yen and I blame it on how TW3 handled her.

Sure, Yen has always be somewhat of a bitch, but TW3 kinda goes overboard with trying to convince you - the player - on how much of a bitch she is. I found it pretty annoying how every single goddamn NPC felt the need to meddle with Geralt's personal affairs and tell him how much of a bitch Yen is or asking him why he even romances that bitch.

I'm curious, how does that play out if you romance Triss? Do you also get a lot of Yen-bashing from NPCs if Triss is your romance choice? Does any NPC comment negatively about Triss at all if you romance her?

So Yen is not an accurate portrayal from the books? I've just started reading The Last Wish. So far what I've observed after picking dialogue options where I've called her out and asked her to stop when she's gone too far, she's less of a bitch and will likely explain herself when pressed which is still a turn off.

NPCs don't notice if you romanced Triss at all, except Djikstra, Yen and Phillippa. Yen comments negatively and I'm not sure how the conversation went with Phillippa in the cave but I think it was more of the same. "Triss is like a big sister to Ciri and Yen is like her mom".

The consistency was pretty bad. It really needs to get patched, I know CDPR said no to an EE, but this game needs it.

 

[Riddlin]

Sure, Yen has always be somewhat of a bitch, but TW3 kinda goes overboard with trying to convince you - the player - on how much of a bitch she is. I found it pretty annoying how every single goddamn NPC felt the need to meddle with Geralt's personal affairs and tell him how much of a bitch Yen is or asking him why he even romances that bitch.

I've not read the books YET(bucket list!) but I picked Yen...basically because I am just a sucker for bitchy dark haired chicks with light eyes(they are actually like kryptonite to me)! Anyway, I found her to soften and be much nicer after the Last Wish quest but sadly, that only lasted until about the point you return to KM...I don't remember hardly any endearing moments with Yen after about the halfway point...maybe I messed something up but other than the support before the big fight scene and the 'what will be do when this is over' scene...I can't remember anything positive after the drinking scene at KM.

---------- Updated at 08:45 PM ----------

Honestly I've only done 1 complete playthrough and currently working on my 2nd.

The only side-quests having any influence on the main quest as far as I can remember are:

- Whether you help Letho and send him to Kaer Morhen or not.
- Whether you spare Keira and send her to Kaer Morhen or not.
- If you spare Keira and send her to Kaer Morhen she becomes Lambert's girlfriend, which is quite cute.
- Roche's quests, which unlock the Radovid assassination quest and the ability to send him to Kaer Morhen.
- Whether you kill the Botchling or change her into a Lubberkin. You'll get a different follow-up quest for each.
- Siding with the Crows or siding with the Oak spirit changes how the Baron questline ends.
- Whether you kill Radovid and who you side with afterwards (Dijkstra or Roche) depends which ending you can get (you'll only be able to get the Empress Ciri ending if you side with Roche).
- Triss's and Yennefer's respective side-quests obviously also influence the main quest to some degree, at least it influences the ending you'll get (depending on who you romanced at the end of their side-quest stories).
- I remember the side-quest where you have to search for Phillipa's hide-out changing some dialogue in the main quest, but nothing much.
- If you have both Roche and Letho present at Kaer Morhen you'll get a short little conversation with both of them bickering.

Hmmmmmmmm, that's it. If I find more during my 2nd playthrough I'll add it to this list.

Actually I went right down the list with you on those...pretty much...wait, was the King of Skelliga a side quest or part of the main? Thats the only other one I can think of.

 

[Redemyr]

It really is a great piece of writing, I want to share it with others on the other place I post but I don't want to steal his work. XD

By all means share it with whoever you want, that was just an attempt to bring to words why it is that the story resonated so strongly with me, and it's not my work, its original author and the devs who created it, I merely summarized it. The more people who fall in love with Geralt and Triss' tale, the better chance we have that they do something about it.

Also if any book fans out there would be kind enough to provide clarification with the dates (Yen and Geralt relationship before they meet Triss, etc) it would be appreciated. (and if anybody with actual writings skills wants to edit the phrasing I wouldn't mind either)

If I'm being honest I started the topic thinking on how emotions can change the view we have different people. On my first playrhough I tented to ignore Yen's most "special" traits and focused on the good parts. This is because even though I had already decided Triss was the girl who deserved to be happy in the end, those two also deserved their reunion of sorts (even if then I still felt Geralt forced flitring was a little off). It was only in the second one, with all the frustration over what we all know on me, that I focused on the so called negative traits exclusively.

In the end though, I decided to keep anything Yen offensive out of it, because for many, especially the book crowd, this is how the tale in their heads actually plays out. For us here, it is the other way around, we feel that Triss is the one who belongs with Geralt, despite all the troubles that such a relationship would cause. Well, now that I think about it, many friends of Geralt would nod their heads approvingly to him choosing Triss too.

Ultimately though, it is all a moot point, because it is up to Geralt, and, thanks to CDPR, us, to decide how the tale goes.

The stage is set beautifully for "rekindling the love of yore" or for "something ends, something begins". I only ask that we actually get to watch the play.

 

[vTemeria]

I've not read the books YET(bucket list!) but I picked Yen...basically because I am just a sucker for bitchy dark haired chicks with light eyes(they are actually like kryptonite to me)! Anyway, I found her to soften and be much nicer after the Last Wish quest but sadly, that only lasted until about the point you return to KM...I don't remember hardly any endearing moments with Yen after about the halfway point...maybe I messed something up but other than the support before the big fight scene and the 'what will be do when this is over' scene...I can't remember anything positive after the drinking scene at KM.

---------- Updated at 08:45 PM ----------



Actually I went right down the list with you on those...pretty much...wait, was the King of Skelliga a side quest or part of the main? Thats the only other one I can think of.

I feel as if Yen was supposed to be nicer, because before The Last Wish quest she wasn't even sure if the bond was real. But she was the same old grump after that.

 

[Riddlin]

The consistency was pretty bad. It really needs to get patched, I know CDPR said no to an EE, but this game needs it.

Not sure they anticipated selling 4 mil copies in 14 days either

---------- Updated at 08:55 PM ----------

I feel as if Yen was supposed to be nicer, because before The Last Wish quest she wasn't even sure if the bond was real. But she was the same old grump after that.

See, I thought it was different...I thought the sitting on the boat and talking really made Geralt fall for her even more...and the drinking scene followed by her just grabbing you and dragging you upstairs, I felt that she was a much warmer person for a little while anyway. After you find Ciri and the Kiss...after that I really thought she went back to her 'default' mode.

 

[hawkeyesforever]

Not sure they anticipated selling 4 mil copies in 14 days either

---------- Updated at 08:55 PM ----------



See, I thought it was different...I thought the sitting on the boat and talking really made Geralt fall for her even more...and the drinking scene followed by her just grabbing you and dragging you upstairs, I felt that she was a much warmer person for a little while anyway. After you find Ciri and the Kiss...after that I really thought she went back to her 'default' mode.

It almost seems like after Ciri is taken back to Kaer Morhen, CDPR had this mindset, "Hey, Ciri's in the game now and been introduced, she's the main show. All the romances are put on the back burner now and aren't important anymore, people will be satisfied with the slideshow nobody will care if Triss is standing on the boat saying Well?."

I haven't played a Yen romance playthrough, but from what I see it seems that's how it went for both Yen & Triss at that juncture. It was a missed opportunity to not only establish more of a bond with the love interest and Geralt, but also with the love interest and Ciri since I think Ciri would have been interested in who Geralt chose.

 

[luc0s]

I've not read the books YET(bucket list!) but I picked Yen...basically because I am just a sucker for bitchy dark haired chicks with light eyes(they are actually like kryptonite to me)! Anyway, I found her to soften and be much nicer after the Last Wish quest but sadly, that only lasted until about the point you return to KM...I don't remember hardly any endearing moments with Yen after about the halfway point...maybe I messed something up but other than the support before the big fight scene and the 'what will be do when this is over' scene...I can't remember anything positive after the drinking scene at KM.

---------- Updated at 08:45 PM ----------



Actually I went right down the list with you on those...pretty much...wait, was the King of Skelliga a side quest or part of the main? Thats the only other one I can think of.

Nice to see a non-book-reader choosing Yen.

As for nice moments between Geralt and Yen: I felt there were plenty of sweet moments between the two, even after The Last Wish quest when you lock-in your romance with her. To name a few:

- Yen and Geralt having romantic sex at Kaer Morhen the night before they break the curse on Uma (link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIK0117iBaU)
- Yen kissing Geralt after he returns with Ciri.
- Yen and Geralt eavesdropping on Ciri's conversation with the Lodge (while not necessarily romance-related, I found this funny and adorable).
- Yen and Geralt discussing their future before the final battle.

There's probably more that I forgot right now. At least it feels like I'm forgetting some scenes.

 

[Redemyr]

Nice to see a non-book-reader choosing Yen.

As for nice moments between Geralt and Yen: I felt there were plenty of sweet moments between the two, even after The Last Wish quest when you lock-in your romance with her. To name a few:

- Yen and Geralt having romantic sex at Kaer Morhen the night before they break the curse on Uma (link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIK0117iBaU)
- Yen kissing Geralt after he returns with Ciri.
- Yen and Geralt eavesdropping on Ciri's conversation with the Lodge (while not necessarily romance-related, I found this funny and adorable).
- Yen and Geralt discussing their future before the final battle.

There's probably more that I forgot right now. At least it feels like I'm forgetting some scenes.

Keeping on topic with the thread, I feel obligated to ask, where are the Triss equivalents of these scenarios?

 

[xE1NSTE1Nx2049]

I'm almost done with a Yen-romance playthrough to see the differences, and to be honest it feels a bit like the Triss version. There is almost none of the back-and-forth you get with Yen in first Skellige, and except for one or two scenes there is nothing to acknowledge that you've actually chosen Yen. Everything after you find Ciri seems to be built for a no-choice or try-to-get-both choice scenario. Yen is basically all business and much less interesting than in the early parts of the game, so I understand why the Pro-Yen crowd sympathizes with us.

I figured as much. The whole Act 3 seems to focus too much on Ciri and not enough about the interpersonal relationships forged throughout the game. The reason I think it's worse with Triss, is because even though it's business as usual running around Skellige with Yennefer, at least she's there with you. In real relationships, it doesn't matter what you do with them, so long as they are with you. Triss doesn't accompany you for any of the battle prep, she won't talk, she doesn't have anything to say to you before the final battle. She's just there to be there which doesn't help much.

@Witcherman1151 this was a nice read. I'll always take more Triss. I'm not sure Geralt would want to distance himself from this new 'school' he's creating. He would probably want to be intimately involved. He also would not want to leave Triss, and she has her job in Kovir. Dunno if it's the most practical set up but I enjoyed reading it. The Dandelion & Zoltan part was pretty funny. :lol:

I'm not going to be able to say no when I reach her again in my second playthrough, sorry Yen, you didn't make the cut a second time.

Haha, yeah, this is pretty much my thinking. Too bad for Yen that you meet Triss first in the game because after that there is no turning her away once you first lay eyes on her. :wub:

Anyway, the main story only affect ciri's ending AND some of the romance results, does that sound right?

MOST of the romance stuff is handled through the side quests(like Last Wish, Now and Never).

So that leaves the world state...does all of that stuff get determined by the side quests?

Witcher Contracts and Treasure Hunts are only for Geralt to make cash and gain XPs...nothing tied to the outcome of one of those, right?

The end-state is determined by a variety of things. Side quests/main quests both have an effect. Usually tied to that character's specific quest line. A few examples:
- Whoreson Junior - kill him or not (pretty obvious) [Main Quest]
- Bloody Baron - his fate is determined by your actions in the Whispering Hillock (as well as the fate of several others) [Main Quest]
- Keira Metz - send her to Kaer Morhen and she rides off with Lambert after the battle [Main Quest & Side Quest]
- Ruller of Skellige - Cerys or Hjallmar [Main Quest & Side Quests]
- Letho of Gulet - his fate and his assistance at Kaer Morhen [Side Quest]
- Romance - both are optional side quests
There's no fine line upon which these are divided. Basically a character's fate is tied to their quest line. Ciri's is tied to the main quest. Others' are tied to their specific quests. Optional side quests, however, can have effects on the world state (Radovid's Assassination missions are all optional but have far-reaching consequences).

 

[zaskar70]

Keeping on topic with the thread, I feel obligated to ask, where are the Triss equivalents of these scenarios?

For the Triss Romance you get the vegelbud scene, the lighthouse intimate scene, and the fountain scene. No intimate scene at Kaer Morhen because well Triss is inexplicably vanished and isn't at kaer Morhen, Yen kisses Geralt when he returns with Ciri even if you have chosen Triss lol, no Triss before the final battle.

 

[CaptainZamzabam]

No intimate scene at Kaer Morhen because well Triss is inexplicably vanished and isn't at kaer Morhen, Yen kisses Geralt when he returns with Ciri even if you have chosen Triss lol, no Triss before the final battle.

Triss should be there before the battle, there really isn't a good excuse for her or Letho or Keira not be there when you first arrive. That would lead to a good opportunity for plenty of dialogue options.
There should also be a quest to restore that poor bed. It didn't deserve it's fate.

 

[Riddlin]

It almost seems like after Ciri is taken back to Kaer Morhen, CDPR had this mindset, "Hey, Ciri's in the game now and been introduced, she's the main show. All the romances are put on the back burner now and aren't important anymore, people will be satisfied with the slideshow nobody will care if Triss is standing on the boat saying Well?."

I haven't played a Yen romance playthrough, but from what I see it seems that's how it went for both Yen & Triss at that juncture. It was a missed opportunity to not only establish more of a bond with the love interest and Geralt, but also with the love interest and Ciri.

You know, I just keep hammering on this like an old dwarf blacksmith BUT, I really believe it was a forced design decision. Time ran out and they had to stop fleshing out certain parts. Things they had been working on for a while was finished and polished with all the links to other parts and quests in places. That would be the first half of the story.

Now, the last half of the story got the base of the story in place and they tested it to make sure it worked but...you have some items that were on the to-do list but couldn't get around to it before the deadline! The romance elements and their impact dialogs and cut-scenes were probably one of them. Yen got a little more 'love' since she was new and they thought the majority would pick her(yikes, huh)...but Triss was ignored after her parts in Novigrad (Well? anyone?)

I have to trust CDPR that they will come back and spend a few months and clean all that stuff up. If I am right, they would have all the VO stuff already done...its just a matter of getting in there and plugging the modules into place and chasing all the squirrels out!

 

[EtherealSand]

Keeping on topic with the thread, I feel obligated to ask, where are the Triss equivalents of these scenarios?

Nice moments that I can remember
-Conversation while mice are running away
-Triss commenting on how Geralt didn't correct Djistra
-Preparing for the ball Geralt complains about the doublet and Triss saying she'll be sure to thank him for his suffering (something like that)
-Bench talk
-Fountain kiss
-Talk behind the horse right before Triss leaves the estate
-Dock scene
-Light house scene and conversation
-Conversation in dandelion's tavern where Geralt kissis Triss as a means of calming her
-Fountain scene
-"Good luck" (not sure if this is exclusive to her romance)

All of these to me are what seemed to have been connected to the romance or just enhanced the experience for those who romanced her. Also notice that all but 1 of these ("Good luck" which really wasn't much at all) are in Novigrad and happen around the same time.

 

[Riddlin]

- Yen and Geralt eavesdropping on Ciri's conversation with the Lodge (while not necessarily romance-related, I found this funny and adorable)..

DARN! I went with Ciri Oh well, next time.

But yes on the other parts...didn't you feel there should have been more between them? I mean, he's a beast and she is now TRULY in love with him(no spell clouding her thoughts on that)...I think a moment for that would have been at Dandelions...and a bit more opportunity for meaningful conversations while on the trip with Ciri.

 

[mukhlisz]

Maybe CDPR will do a Triss DLC where we can patch things up with her?

that indifference from her after the almost threesome made me so miserable...

 

[Redemyr]

Triss should be there before the battle, there really isn't a good excuse for her or Letho or Keira not be there when you first arrive. That would lead to a good opportunity for plenty of dialogue options.
There should also be a quest to restore that poor bed. It didn't deserve it's fate.

Can you imagine Yen's face watching all the witchers working together on restoring it and Triss adding some finishing touches with her magic and commenting "Actually, it is better than before now, thanks Yen."