The Triss content and the inconsistency of our romance's choice

[zaskar70]

It's pretty obvious they rushed things, the project was too big and they had to cut many things in order to release it on time , that's my guess . I saw this thread some time ago but did not bothered to read it because i like Yen very much and i was quite ok with the way game develops if you romance her , however i just did another play-through and decided to check Triss romance . Yes , i understand your complains, it was like nothing changed , just a couple extra lines and the scene from the fountain outside Passiflora , otherwise the game felt the same . I don't understand why she is not at KM during the Uma episode , they could at least add an extra line when she leaves the lighthouse, explaining that she needs to stay longer in Kovir , or something similar .

Triss is not at Kaer Morhen for Uma because she was never supposed to show up to Kaer Morhen until Yennefer asks her to come, Triss and Geralt's relationship was supposed to come to a conclusion at the docks in Novigrad, she was to sail away to Kovir in the story CDPR wrote.

The reason why nothing really changes when you do a Triss romance playthrough vs a Yen romance playthrough is because the Triss romance choice is an add on that was put into an already finished game.

CDPR did the best they could with the time they had left as far as the Triss romance arc is concerned. If they had envisioned a choice between the two ladies from day one the game would have been a lot different.
The choice would have come much later after having spent an equal amount of time with both women, the reason why you have to make a choice between Triss and Yen so early in the game at the docks is because that is where they had Geralt and Triss end things in the original plotline.

If you go back and watch all the cutscenes and listen to all the dialogue between Geralt and Triss you will notice a recurring theme, Triss is constantly letting Geralt know that they are over and it hurts but they should move on:

Her attitude in the ratcatcher warehouse scene.
The wilted rose and the scene where she tells you she saved it as a warning to her.
The apology after the Vegalbud's party.
The dock scene before they have her magicaly return.

It's all about Geralt and Triss ending things and moving on, you dont get anything like that with Yennefer, in fact most of the dialogue with Yennefer is flirtatious with a lot of reminicing about past good times.

The theme you get between Yennefer and Geralt is of two people rekindling a romance vs the theme you get between Geralt and Triss of two people ending a romance.
It's plain to see what CDPR's intentions with the story in The Wild Hunt were as far as Geralts love life is concerned.

This is why so many people are upset, this is why I originally came here. For those of us that were invested in the Geralt Triss relationship it was a huge let down and left many of us with a bad feeling throughout a lot of the game.

As I have previously stated the only way that I believe CDPR could possibly address this is through an enhanced edition and a rewriting of the the storyline from Novigrad on, this would not be possible via DLC's or patches.

In the end I think it just comes down to the fact that for some reason there was a disconnect between the fans of the Witcher series and CDPR when they were plotting out the story for The Witcher 3.

 

[almostfaceman]

They were in the realm of good and consistent writing back in W2. Once you hear the whole story, you can: deny her the rose, deny her at every opportunity, blame her for the lodge stuff, deny her advances in the bath (and get MR), don't rescue her at all and go do political stuff...

Or you can, give her the rose (knowing its meaning), have a nice time in the baths, be understanding, rescue her and tell her why you did it, set out on a trip between the two to find Yennefer.

See? Options for everyone.

It's all good, no anger here. The problem with the Rose stuff is that I give Triss a rose because she's nice, helping me out, and hawt. Yennefer... who's that? I don't give her a rose to forgive her for anything since they didn't tell me through the story that there was anything to forgive. They leave out everything Triss told Geralt on the boat. It's not even in a flashback. That conversation (probably stuff that happened in the books) should have been available to the player either in Witcher 2 or 3.

 

[Pryce68]

In the end I think it just comes down to the fact that for some reason there was a disconnect between the fans of the Witcher series and CDPR when they were plotting out the story for The Witcher 3.

Watching the trailers, especially the E3 2014 trailer - The Sword Of Destiny made it look like that Triss was going to be an obvious choice of romance if not the main one. It was hard for us to predict what was going to happen and we weren't given much of a choice to say anything about it before the game was released.

However. If the choices we made in the previous games mattered, and it should've mattered considering how much time we've invested playing the previous games. We should've been given the choice to handle how to proceed with Geralt and Triss's relationship, either remaining as friends or choosing to continue on as lovers.

If you're saying that this was anything other than a rushed content and a badly handled decision making for some of us, you're highly mistaken.

The choice to break up with Triss should've been ours, how to get back to Yennefer and what to do about her should've been the choice we had to make in TW3, not the other way around.

If they wanted to make TW3 independent from the previous games, they should've just said so.

 

[Gerald01]

@zaskar70 Uhm, if we want to be honest and pragmatic (or is it pessimistic?), by your pov, not even an EE will rework so much of the storyline around.
Story can be improved upon, not changed to what it could have been envisioned etc.
I don't know of a single game that did that. Only thing slightly similar are some extremely problematic movies that got alternative cuts, but extremely rare.

What's done is done, but that does not mean the structurally and inherently flawed situation cannot be improved upon as we discussed at lenght with no crazy additional effort by enriching and trmming around what's there.

It would still lack a perfectly simmetrical and balanced structure (assuming a game should at all costs) but still be fulfilling.

 

[HardcoreSalmon]

If you think about it for most of Triss's content in the game you aren't in a relationship and Triss acts as if she's moving on. So if you take that into account the only scenes you get with her when you're actually in a romance is the lighthouse scene and the scene at the fountain.

The romance ends just as it begins.

 

[saladin1701]

Triss is not at Kaer Morhen for Uma because she was never supposed to show up to Kaer Morhen until Yennefer asks her to come, Triss and Geralt's relationship was supposed to come to a conclusion at the docks in Novigrad, she was to sail away to Kovir in the story CDPR wrote.

The reason why nothing really changes when you do a Triss romance playthrough vs a Yen romance playthrough is because the Triss romance choice is an add on that was put into an already finished game.

CDPR did the best they could with the time they had left as far as the Triss romance arc is concerned. If they had envisioned a choice between the two ladies from day one the game would have been a lot different.
The choice would have come much later after having spent an equal amount of time with both women, the reason why you have to make a choice between Triss and Yen so early in the game at the docks is because that is where they had Geralt and Triss end things in the original plotline.

If you go back and watch all the cutscenes and listen to all the dialogue between Geralt and Triss you will notice a recurring theme, Triss is constantly letting Geralt know that they are over and it hurts but they should move on:

Her attitude in the ratcatcher warehouse scene.
The wilted rose and the scene where she tells you she saved it as a warning to her.
The apology after the Vegalbud's party.
The dock scene before they have her magicaly return.

It's all about Geralt and Triss ending things and moving on, you dont get anything like that with Yennefer, in fact most of the dialogue with Yennefer is flirtatious with a lot of reminicing about past good times.

The theme you get between Yennefer and Geralt is of two people rekindling a romance vs the theme you get between Geralt and Triss of two people ending a romance.
It's plain to see what CDPR's intentions with the story in The Wild Hunt were as far as Geralts love life is concerned.

This is why so many people are upset, this is why I originally came here. For those of us that were invested in the Geralt Triss relationship it was a huge let down and left many of us with a bad feeling throughout a lot of the game.

As I have previously stated the only way that I believe CDPR could possibly address this is through an enhanced edition and a rewriting of the the storyline from Novigrad on, this would not be possible via DLC's or patches.

In the end I think it just comes down to the fact that for some reason there was a disconnect between the fans of the Witcher series and CDPR when they were plotting out the story for The Witcher 3.

I wouldn't necessarily have had an issue with that had they properly explained why you weren't with Triss at the end of the game and effectively written her out of the series. Instead, what we have is them offering us the choice between two hands and each time we choose the left, they move it behind their back nodding to their right hand. That's what pisses me off about this situation more than anything. You either give us the choice or you don't, not pretend to and try make it for us.

 

[Gerald01]

Watching the trailers, especially the E3 2014 trailer - The Sword Of Destiny made it look like that Triss was going to be an obvious choice of romance if not the main one. It was hard for us to predict what was going to happen and we weren't given much of a choice to say anything about it before the game was released.

It's not like CDPR has been a shining example of transparency during the lead up to release as far as promotional material goes

 

[KrazyK785]

Don't mean to stray away from the topic at hand. But when I opened my game case and saw the soundtrack I decided to listen to it after completing the main game and GOOD LORD is it amazing. If you haven't given it a try I highly suggest you do. However the only song that I've notice to be missing is the song that plays when you first arrive in Ard Skellige...

 

[Monkey_Molester]

Don't mean to stray away from the topic at hand. But when I opened my game case and saw the soundtrack I decided to listen to it after completing the main game and GOOD LORD is it amazing. If you haven't given it a try I highly suggest you do. However the only song that I've notice to be missing is the song that plays when you first arrive in Ard Skellige...

That's more than straying away from the topic at hand. While the soundtrack is great - this has absolutely zero relevancy to this thread. opo:

 

[Ash86s]

The choice to break up with Triss should've been ours, how to get back to Yennefer and what to do about her should've been the choice we had to make in TW3, not the other way around.

If they wanted to make TW3 independent from the previous games, they should've just said so.

Thank you!

 

[saladin1701]

If you think about it for most of Triss's content in the game you aren't in a relationship and Triss acts as if she's moving on. So if you take that into account the only scenes you get with her when you're actually in a romance is the lighthouse scene and the scene at the fountain.

The romance ends just as it begins.

As others have said, the content we do have is extremely well written. If you are intent on getting back with Yen, Triss sailing off to Kovir provides closure on that part of Geralt's life. If you choose to Triss to romance, it's written in a way where Geralt finally realises just how in love with Triss he is and can't bear the thought of loosing her. Given the extremely high quality of the writing, it's all the more perplexing why it wasn't continued.

I think it's at this point, where Geralt, a man unaccustomed to expressing his emotion could give Triss back the rose. I'm thinking you give it to her as you tell her you love her. She boards the boat in a short cut scene that shows the rose re-blossom after which it cuts back to Geralt and Dijkstra's conversation on the dockside and plays out as normal. I think that would add to the romanticism of the scene.

 

[msanx]

Watching the trailers, especially the E3 2014 trailer - The Sword Of Destiny made it look like that Triss was going to be an obvious choice of romance if not the main one. It was hard for us to predict what was going to happen and we weren't given much of a choice to say anything about it before the game was released.

However. If the choices we made in the previous games mattered, and it should've mattered considering how much time we've invested playing the previous games. We should've been given the choice to handle how to proceed with Geralt and Triss's relationship, either remaining as friends or choosing to continue on as lovers.

If you're saying that this was anything other than a rushed content and a badly handled decision making for some of us, you're highly mistaken.

The choice to break up with Triss should've been ours, how to get back to Yennefer and what to do about her should've been the choice we had to make in TW3, not the other way around.

If they wanted to make TW3 independent from the previous games, they should've just said so.

Honestly, i think CDPR tossed around the idea of what to do with Triss in the game, they did say that they put things into the game and the storyline that they didn't want to do because the customer (us) is the final contractor. What this means about Triss could mean that they didn't intend for Triss to be a valid romance option (and at this point, she still isn't), but added her for the fans or on the other side they were leaning towards Triss being that valid romance option but were going more towards the books so they did a bit of u-turn and focused on the Yen and Ciri relationship with Geralt. I do hope eventually a dev clears this up and explains what the process was.

I agree, that you don't just go ignoring the choices and the investment fans had with the previous games, after all those games were the basis for CDPR to even undertake a game like this. When you have a choice built up over the series, well then it is going to have that start, middle and end type storyline especially if we are referring to the romance options for Geralt.

I am not too fussed about them breaking up between W2 and W3 (would of been better with an explanation), it is more due to her storyline always shifting towards the 'letting her go' situation, where if this game and our choices didn't come into effect, well then it would of been set that Geralt and Yen would get back together, of course as this is a game and since we did make that choice, having the inconsistencies show up like that is a bit jarring.

 

[Pryce68]

I agree, that you don't just go ignoring the choices and the investment fans had with the previous games, after all those games were the basis for CDPR to even undertake a game like this. When you have a choice built up over the series, well then it is going to have that start, middle and end type storyline especially if we are referring to the romance options for Geralt.

I am not too fussed about them breaking up between W2 and W3 (would of been better with an explanation), it is more due to her storyline always shifting towards the 'letting her go' situation, where if this game and our choices didn't come into effect, well then it would of been set that Geralt and Yen would get back together, of course as this is a game and since we did make that choice, having the inconsistencies show up like that is a bit jarring.

I understand how important it was for her to set off to Novigrad. However, there could've been more than one way to handle it.

The first version. The Geralt that broke up with Triss while remaining as friends, that should give some people the option to rekindle back their love and continue their relationship after finally opening up to her and telling her that we did lover her.

The second version would be for the people who actually chose her in the previous games and decided that travelling on the road with Geralt with the Witch Hunt and the war going on was no life nor a place for her. She's to go to her house in Novigrad and await their reunion.

This would've felt rewarding and it definitely would've made a lot of the new players out there consider playing the old games to enjoy the full romantic experience between Geralt and Triss.

I would say the reason why this didn't happen because they wanted to equalize between the people who's been playing the game for 8 years and the people who just started playing it and that wasn't fair for us.

 

[Jamesjford77]

The second version would be for the people who actually chose her in the previous games and decided that travelling on the road with Geralt with the Witch Hunt and the war going on was no life nor a place for her. She's to go to her house in Novigrad and await their reunion.

This would've felt rewarding and it definitely would've made a lot of the new players out there consider playing the old games to enjoy the full romantic experience between Geralt and Triss.

I would say the reason why this didn't happen because they wanted to equalize between the people who's been playing the game for 8 years and the people who just started playing it and that wasn't fair for us.

if only.....................

 

[zaskar70]

@zaskar70 Uhm, if we want to be honest and pragmatic (or is it pessimistic?), by your pov, not even an EE will rework so much of the storyline around.
Story can be improved upon, not changed to what it could have been envisioned etc.
I don't know of a single game that did that. Only thing slightly similar are some extremely problematic movies that got alternative cuts, but extremely rare.

What's done is done, but that does not mean the structurally and inherently flawed situation cannot be improved upon as we discussed at lenght with no crazy additional effort by enriching and trmming around what's there.

It would still lack a perfectly simmetrical and balanced structure (assuming a game should at all costs) but still be fulfilling.

Actually they added a massive amount of new content to The Witcher 2 with it's enhanced edition, even a completley new area. I have no doubt that CDPR could do the same for The Witcher 3 if they were so inclined.

The question we all have on our minds really is are they so inclined? or are they content enough with what they have done. I for one do not want any bandaid solutions.

I think one of the first things they may do is add dialogue options to Triss on the boat in Skellige as this looks to be a most obvious mistake on their part as every other character on the boat has dialogue options except Triss. After that nothing else seems really doable without an enhanced edition besides a romance DLC and I don't think we will get that.

 

[SoleilMeurtri]

Is there any dev news?

 

[Jamesjford77]

I think one of the first things they may do is add dialogue options to Triss on the boat in Skellige as this looks to be a most obvious mistake on their part as every other character on the boat has dialogue options except Triss. After that nothing else seems really doable without an enhanced edition besides a romance DLC and I don't think we will get that.

this is very similar to the whole mess that happened with liara in mass effect 2...... bioware fixed it by adding the shadow broker dlc, which was a romance dlc for shepard and liara..... i don't see why cdpr cant do the same....

 

[KrazyK785]

Ah sorry forgive me senpai

 

[zaskar70]

this is very similar to the whole mess that happened with liara in mass effect 2...... bioware fixed it by adding the shadow broker dlc, which was a romance dlc for shepard and liara..... i don't see why cdpr cant do the same....

I think the main problem with doing character specific romance DLC for The Witcher is that there is a fairly even split in the community between Triss and Yennefer and as a developer you would want any DLC or expansions to appeal to your entire audience and not just a segment of it no matter how large that segment might be.

 

[Gerald01]

Actually they added a massive amount of new content to The Witcher 2 with it's enhanced edition, even a completley new area. I have no doubt that CDPR could do the same for The Witcher 3 if they were so inclined.

Th

Sure, as keyword here is ADDITION. I played Witcher 2 when it came out and later the EE (last time right before signing up). They did do a great job.
But from that (which had also possibly a less noble reason behind it, with the X360 release?) to what it would take it's a big step and a much more disruptive kind of work.

W2 EE: redecorating/revamping a room
W3 EE(it'd be needed for what you were saying): tossing out the furniture and buying new one, maybe bring down a wall etc.


What is actually in the proposition could be: buying a new drawer, trimming the curtains, a couple new lamps.