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Can some book reader, please, explain this to me, what Yennefer meant with this (bolded text) ? It's from very end of last book before they enter Rivia.
The way I understand it - Lodge didn't really do much, they tried, but all they actions were irrelevant. Triss had nothing to do with Yennfer's compression and that happened way before Lodge was created.. so what was Yennefer talking about ?
The way I understand it - Lodge didn't really do much, they tried, but all they actions were irrelevant. Triss had nothing to do with Yennfer's compression and that happened way before Lodge was created.. so what was Yennefer talking about ?
'You're not going to meet a loved one, Triss,' Yennefer continued. 'I am not so noble or stupid
enough to give you the opportunity, or him the temptation. But just for today. I could not deny myself
the sweet satisfaction. He knows what role you play as a member of the Lodge. He will thank you for
that with his famous look. And I'll be looking at your quivering lips and trembling hands, I will listen
to your lame apologies and excuses. And you know what, Triss? I will faint with delight.'
'I knew,' Triss grunted. 'That you would not forget, that you would take your revenge. I agreed to
this, because I was actually at fault. But one thing I must tell you, Yennefer. Do not count too much on
fainting. He knows how to forgive.'
'He knows what was done to him, of course,' Yennefer narrowed her eyes. 'But he will never forgive
you for what was done to Ciri. And me.'
'It is possible,' Triss swallowed. 'He may not forgive. Especially if you insist. But he won't fly into a
rage. He won't lower himself like that.'
'
enough to give you the opportunity, or him the temptation. But just for today. I could not deny myself
the sweet satisfaction. He knows what role you play as a member of the Lodge. He will thank you for
that with his famous look. And I'll be looking at your quivering lips and trembling hands, I will listen
to your lame apologies and excuses. And you know what, Triss? I will faint with delight.'
'I knew,' Triss grunted. 'That you would not forget, that you would take your revenge. I agreed to
this, because I was actually at fault. But one thing I must tell you, Yennefer. Do not count too much on
fainting. He knows how to forgive.'
'He knows what was done to him, of course,' Yennefer narrowed her eyes. 'But he will never forgive
you for what was done to Ciri. And me.'
'It is possible,' Triss swallowed. 'He may not forgive. Especially if you insist. But he won't fly into a
rage. He won't lower himself like that.'
'
Pretty much this, from Tower of the Swallow, chapter 9:
Philippa Eilhart appeared in the window next to her, dressed in a dark blue men’s jerkin. ‘Bravo,’ she said. ‘As usual, quick. As usual, perceptive. As usual, hard to grasp and understand. I am glad to see you in health, Yennefer. I am happy that your crazy teleportation from Montecalvo did not end in tragedy.’
‘Let's assume that you really are happy.’ Yennefer pouted. ‘Although that is a very bold assumption. But never mind that, who betrayed me?’
Philippa shrugged her shoulders. ‘Does it matter? For four days now you’ve been in contact with traitors. To such as them, venality and treachery are second nature. And to those that you have blackmailed to betrayal. One of them has betrayed you. The normal course of events. Don't tell me you didn't expect it.’
‘Of course I expected it,’ snapped Yennefer. ‘The best proof of that is that I've contacted you. I did not have to.’
‘You did not have to. This means that you have an agenda.’
‘Bravo. As usual, quick. As usual, perceptive. I have contacted you to assure you that the secret of your Lodge is safe with me. I will not tell on you.’
Philippa stared at her from under lowered eyelids. ‘If you believe,’ she said finally, ‘that you've won peace, time, or security with this declaration, then you've miscalculated. Make no mistake about it, Yennefer. When you fled from Montecalvo, you made your decision. You chose to stand on a different side of the barricade. If you are not with the Lodge, you are against the Lodge. Now you're trying to forestall us from finding Ciri, and the motives that guide you are opposed to ours. You act against us. You do not want to allow us to use Ciri for our political purposes. You should know that we will also do everything in our power to make sure that you cannot use the girl for your sentimental purposes.’
‘So it’s war?’
‘Competition.’ Philippa smiled toxically. ‘Competition only, Yennefer.’
‘Decent and honourable?’
‘You must be joking.’
‘Obviously. Though on at least one specific issue, I would like have an honest and genuine conversation. And incidentally it involves a favour to me.’
‘Speak.’
‘Over the next few days, maybe even tomorrow, events will occur whose consequences I cannot foresee. It may happen that our competition and rivalry suddenly has no meaning. For the simple reason that one of the competitors will not be there anymore.’
Philippa Eilhart narrowed her blue shaded eyes. ‘I understand.’
‘Ensure that I posthumously gain back my reputation and good name. I will no longer be held for a traitor or an accomplice of Vilgefortz. I ask this of the Lodge. I ask this of you personally.’
Philippa was silent for a moment.
‘I deny your request,’ she said finally. ‘I'm sorry, but your exoneration is not in the interest of the Lodge. If you die, you die a traitor. You'll be a traitor and criminal to Ciri, because then it will be easier to manipulate the girl.’
‘Before you do something that could be fatal,’ Triss said suddenly, ‘leave something behind for us...’
‘A will?’
‘Something that allows us to... continue. To find Ciri. Because we are primarily concerned for her health! For her life! Yennefer, Dijkstra has found some traces of... some traces of certain activities have been found. If Vilgefortz does have Ciri, then the girl faces a horrible death.’
‘Be quiet, Triss,’ Philippa Eilhart hissed sharply. ‘We are not trading or bargaining.’
‘I will leave you the information’, Yennefer said slowly. ‘I'll leave you the information on what I've found and what I plan. I’ll leave a trail you can follow to her. But not in vain. If you will not facilitate my exoneration in the eyes of the world, then to hell with you and with the world. But at least grant me exoneration in the eyes of the witcher.’
‘No,’ Philippa denied the request almost instantly. ‘That is also not in the interest of the Lodge. You will also remain a traitor and a mercenary sorceress to your witcher. It is not in the interest of the Lodge for him to furiously attempt to avenge you. If he despises you, he will not attempt to take revenge. By the way, he's probably already dead or will die any day now.’
‘The information’ Yennefer said dully, ‘for his life. Save him, Philippa.’
‘No, Yennefer.’
‘Because it's not in the interest of the Lodge.’ A purple fire kindled in the sorceress’ eyes. ‘Did you hear that Triss? There, you have your Lodge. You see their true colours, their true interests. And what do you think of them? You were a mentor to the girl, almost – as you put it – a big sister. And Geralt...’
‘Do not attack Triss’ relationships, Yennefer.’ Philippa retaliated with her own fire in her eyes. ‘We will find and rescue the girl without your help. And if you succeed, that's fine, a thousand thanks, because you will have saved us the trouble. You tear the girl out of the hands of Vilgefortz and we will be happy. And Geralt? Who cares about Geralt?’
‘Did you hear that, Triss?’
‘Forgive me,’ said Triss Merigold dully. ‘Forgive me, Yennefer.’
‘Oh no, Triss. Never.’
‘Let's assume that you really are happy.’ Yennefer pouted. ‘Although that is a very bold assumption. But never mind that, who betrayed me?’
Philippa shrugged her shoulders. ‘Does it matter? For four days now you’ve been in contact with traitors. To such as them, venality and treachery are second nature. And to those that you have blackmailed to betrayal. One of them has betrayed you. The normal course of events. Don't tell me you didn't expect it.’
‘Of course I expected it,’ snapped Yennefer. ‘The best proof of that is that I've contacted you. I did not have to.’
‘You did not have to. This means that you have an agenda.’
‘Bravo. As usual, quick. As usual, perceptive. I have contacted you to assure you that the secret of your Lodge is safe with me. I will not tell on you.’
Philippa stared at her from under lowered eyelids. ‘If you believe,’ she said finally, ‘that you've won peace, time, or security with this declaration, then you've miscalculated. Make no mistake about it, Yennefer. When you fled from Montecalvo, you made your decision. You chose to stand on a different side of the barricade. If you are not with the Lodge, you are against the Lodge. Now you're trying to forestall us from finding Ciri, and the motives that guide you are opposed to ours. You act against us. You do not want to allow us to use Ciri for our political purposes. You should know that we will also do everything in our power to make sure that you cannot use the girl for your sentimental purposes.’
‘So it’s war?’
‘Competition.’ Philippa smiled toxically. ‘Competition only, Yennefer.’
‘Decent and honourable?’
‘You must be joking.’
‘Obviously. Though on at least one specific issue, I would like have an honest and genuine conversation. And incidentally it involves a favour to me.’
‘Speak.’
‘Over the next few days, maybe even tomorrow, events will occur whose consequences I cannot foresee. It may happen that our competition and rivalry suddenly has no meaning. For the simple reason that one of the competitors will not be there anymore.’
Philippa Eilhart narrowed her blue shaded eyes. ‘I understand.’
‘Ensure that I posthumously gain back my reputation and good name. I will no longer be held for a traitor or an accomplice of Vilgefortz. I ask this of the Lodge. I ask this of you personally.’
Philippa was silent for a moment.
‘I deny your request,’ she said finally. ‘I'm sorry, but your exoneration is not in the interest of the Lodge. If you die, you die a traitor. You'll be a traitor and criminal to Ciri, because then it will be easier to manipulate the girl.’
‘Before you do something that could be fatal,’ Triss said suddenly, ‘leave something behind for us...’
‘A will?’
‘Something that allows us to... continue. To find Ciri. Because we are primarily concerned for her health! For her life! Yennefer, Dijkstra has found some traces of... some traces of certain activities have been found. If Vilgefortz does have Ciri, then the girl faces a horrible death.’
‘Be quiet, Triss,’ Philippa Eilhart hissed sharply. ‘We are not trading or bargaining.’
‘I will leave you the information’, Yennefer said slowly. ‘I'll leave you the information on what I've found and what I plan. I’ll leave a trail you can follow to her. But not in vain. If you will not facilitate my exoneration in the eyes of the world, then to hell with you and with the world. But at least grant me exoneration in the eyes of the witcher.’
‘No,’ Philippa denied the request almost instantly. ‘That is also not in the interest of the Lodge. You will also remain a traitor and a mercenary sorceress to your witcher. It is not in the interest of the Lodge for him to furiously attempt to avenge you. If he despises you, he will not attempt to take revenge. By the way, he's probably already dead or will die any day now.’
‘The information’ Yennefer said dully, ‘for his life. Save him, Philippa.’
‘No, Yennefer.’
‘Because it's not in the interest of the Lodge.’ A purple fire kindled in the sorceress’ eyes. ‘Did you hear that Triss? There, you have your Lodge. You see their true colours, their true interests. And what do you think of them? You were a mentor to the girl, almost – as you put it – a big sister. And Geralt...’
‘Do not attack Triss’ relationships, Yennefer.’ Philippa retaliated with her own fire in her eyes. ‘We will find and rescue the girl without your help. And if you succeed, that's fine, a thousand thanks, because you will have saved us the trouble. You tear the girl out of the hands of Vilgefortz and we will be happy. And Geralt? Who cares about Geralt?’
‘Did you hear that, Triss?’
‘Forgive me,’ said Triss Merigold dully. ‘Forgive me, Yennefer.’
‘Oh no, Triss. Never.’
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Reading that part kind of amazed me and it had a large impact on how I viewed Triss. I actually wondered why I haven't seen much discussion about it considering Yennefer having this whole "evil bitch" reputation and Triss fans being 100% certain about her loyalty to her friends/Geralt. Unless they just happen to treat Triss like two different characters, one from the books and one from the games. :/
Yeah. Pretty much reason why most people who read book will teal you they choose Yen and why those who played games only Triss.
Triss was very much influenced by Phillipa, she didn't know what she was doing..
The best approach is to keep them separate. And Triss has never been 100% loyal to Geralt in the games, or she'd have been more upfront about her dealings with the lodge and saved him a whole heap of trouble. Not to mention taking advantage of his amnesia to sate her school girl crush. But all is of course forgiven at the Nilfgardian camp when I rescue her and look into those deep, green eyes and sigh......
#Trissforever. :heart:
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I can see her feeling the pressure from Philippa in that scene but I do believe Triss was very much in control of herself considering she knew the consequences and admitted to being at fault. The quotes that give me this impression just from this page of the thread:
Before you do something that could be fatal,’ Triss said suddenly, ‘leave something behind for us...’
‘A will?’
‘Something that allows us to... continue. To find Ciri. Because we are primarily concerned for her health! For her life! Yennefer, Dijkstra has found some traces of... some traces of certain activities have been found. If Vilgefortz does have Ciri, then the girl faces a horrible death.’
‘Be quiet, Triss,’ Philippa Eilhart hissed sharply. ‘We are not trading or bargaining.’
‘A will?’
‘Something that allows us to... continue. To find Ciri. Because we are primarily concerned for her health! For her life! Yennefer, Dijkstra has found some traces of... some traces of certain activities have been found. If Vilgefortz does have Ciri, then the girl faces a horrible death.’
‘Be quiet, Triss,’ Philippa Eilhart hissed sharply. ‘We are not trading or bargaining.’
I knew,' Triss grunted. 'That you would not forget, that you would take your revenge. I agreed to
this, because I was actually at fault.
this, because I was actually at fault.
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As a guy who loves the books and the Games by an equal amount.
Well my first feeling is to of course choose Yen. but thats just my feeling based on the books.
I will try my hardest to stay open minded and see what happens in the Game. It really depends on how CDPR do set up Yen as a Charakter.
I cant ignore the books but at least in my mind during the first 2 Games the Triss love story was enticing as well. I cant discard Triss that easily either.
So it will totally depend on what happens in TW3. And to stay true to Geralt in my opinion.
On an overall Level Geralt will always choose Ciri over anyone. even Yen. I know its more about Love Interesst here but still. I will see what happends and maybe choose between the two. Hell maybe i choose neither if that option exists(i bet it will). But Ciri's well beeing is always first.
Well my first feeling is to of course choose Yen. but thats just my feeling based on the books.
I will try my hardest to stay open minded and see what happens in the Game. It really depends on how CDPR do set up Yen as a Charakter.
I cant ignore the books but at least in my mind during the first 2 Games the Triss love story was enticing as well. I cant discard Triss that easily either.
So it will totally depend on what happens in TW3. And to stay true to Geralt in my opinion.
On an overall Level Geralt will always choose Ciri over anyone. even Yen. I know its more about Love Interesst here but still. I will see what happends and maybe choose between the two. Hell maybe i choose neither if that option exists(i bet it will). But Ciri's well beeing is always first.
Yeah. She obviously did not mean to hurt anyone but her will is kind of weak compared to Geralt/Yennefer. I believe she had panic attack in Sodden battle and she is not usually playmaker and her emotions control her too much. She is not bad character but she would rather allow Phillipa to control Ciri that try to save her on her own just because she thought lodge would have higher chance of saving her.
I see so much unfairness towards Triss. Many seem to forget that Triss is young and as a result naive in the books, and she lacked the life experience that is necessary for someone with such power. I think she did not make the decisions that she made in order to harm Ciri, Yen, or Geralt, but instead she was driven by her naivety and lack of experience. She loves and cares about Ciri and Yennefer, and I think she'll never harm them knowingly.
The Triss, we see in the games, is so different from the books. The reason for that is that she has changed, and she has grown to become more experienced and responsible after the events of the books. She realized that she had hurt Ciri, Yennefer, and Geralt with the choices that she had made, and I believe that was the turning point in her life that set her on the path to become more mature. The games take place several years after the books, and so we meet a Triss that has had years to change and develop as a character.
Triss has been making amends for her mistakes, and she even told Geralt in the Elven baths "I would travel to the end of the world with you to save Yennefer. I owe you that, I owe her that ...". She has nurtured Geralt through his amnesia, and she has saved his life on several occasions. She sacrificed her political status and house by sticking with Geralt, while she could have denied their relationship and pinned the murder on him in order to relieve herself of the accusations. She kept warning Geralt about Sile', but he did not listen. She did not betray Geralt by not telling him about the Lodge, but instead she was trying to protect him from Sile' and the Lodge. Geralt would have arrogantly confronted Sile' just like he was arrogantly pursuing Letho with such carelessness and disregard for his own safety and the safety of those around him, which led to Cedric's death and Triss getting captured, getting turned into a statue, and getting tortured.
The Triss, we see in the games, is so different from the books. The reason for that is that she has changed, and she has grown to become more experienced and responsible after the events of the books. She realized that she had hurt Ciri, Yennefer, and Geralt with the choices that she had made, and I believe that was the turning point in her life that set her on the path to become more mature. The games take place several years after the books, and so we meet a Triss that has had years to change and develop as a character.
Triss has been making amends for her mistakes, and she even told Geralt in the Elven baths "I would travel to the end of the world with you to save Yennefer. I owe you that, I owe her that ...". She has nurtured Geralt through his amnesia, and she has saved his life on several occasions. She sacrificed her political status and house by sticking with Geralt, while she could have denied their relationship and pinned the murder on him in order to relieve herself of the accusations. She kept warning Geralt about Sile', but he did not listen. She did not betray Geralt by not telling him about the Lodge, but instead she was trying to protect him from Sile' and the Lodge. Geralt would have arrogantly confronted Sile' just like he was arrogantly pursuing Letho with such carelessness and disregard for his own safety and the safety of those around him, which led to Cedric's death and Triss getting captured, getting turned into a statue, and getting tortured.
Definatly a big NO to this one... Triss would sacrifice everything to help Geralt and Ciri, what you said might be right for the
before the battle of sodden... but this Triss died on that fucking hill. On start of TW3 there is NO way she would allow anybody
take control or harm Ciri and Geralt in anyway. (if she does ... she is so death i swear...) and the same goes for
Yennefer and everybody else who tries anything on Ciri!
In TW1 she took and advantage over Geralt´s amnesia while also tried to affect his actions. So not so sure about your blind faith.
EDIT: Also was commenting her actions in the books...not upcoming ones in TW3.
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Wrong battle of Sodden. Most of the events of the books and all of those in W1 and W2 happen after this, and she is quite willing to go along with the lodge.
She has a glimmer of sense, and subsequently aids Yennefer when the lodge "catches up" with Ciri and Yennefer at the end of Lady of the Lake - but then loses the plot completely when she gets her chance with Geralt.
Yes for the greater good, at last as she believes it... and yes as long as TW1 may last, but end of TW1 and whole TW2
NO WAY even though she is in the lodge ... she just realizes in Flotsam that she just is "used" by the lodge to
influence Geralt ... so don t you think she might up her mind and stay loyal to her true friends? Instead of staying
loyal to the lodge....
Yes sure she did in some way... but ask with what intention... i think definatly not to "control" Geralt and his actions... even if
there is some influence of the lodge. I still think she does that because, she truly loves him, she also doesn t know
Yennefer is alive at that time so she just tries, to protect Geralt. Protect him of the pain he would feel, if he got told that
his love is death. Still might be the wrong decision... yes to her own benefit because she loves Garalt... but evil?
Only to USE him for her own good..... yeah sure.... pffff don t make me laugh. But what i said sounds definatly as
the Triss we know from the books. As i told you before ... all of those 3 have some time behind since "The Lady of the Lake"
the characters go with time and develop... so don t be that fast with your judgement
@wichat.571
yes even a certain cold blooded animal, would not be save anymore!!!
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The thing with Triss is she finally comes around by TW2's end and realizes she wants to be faithful to Geralt. She's done trying to play it both ways. It's at the elven baths and Nilfgardian camp where she fesses up, and if she's not sincere in those two instances, then my Geralt has indeed been duped. She's sacrificed so much by then.
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